SCART, S-Video, and NTSF RF to VGA....

[StuOhQ]

On 3/5/2020 at 1:35 AM, Austin said:

For RF, you're probably best off getting a VCR, running the RF through that, then using the VCR's composite pass through to send it to your TV.

I fought against this inevitable truth for a looong time. You can find standalone demodulators that will work with vintage gaming hardware (sometimes), but it will cost you much more than what a decent VCR will - and will probably do a worse job. 

[tripletopper]

Okay I have the SCART adapters to Genesis 1/ Master , Genesis 2 / 32xcd, SNES (along with an original US SNES with S-Video and RGB compatibility) and one for Saturn and Dreamcast.

 

Some say that until you get into higher resolutions than 480i/240p there's very little difference between S Video, RGB SCART, and YPbPr.

 

If that's the case, then between ping added, and complications about compatibility, then all my pre-HD stuff can go downstairs.

 

I do have a VGA CRT.  I heard HDMI is not laggy in and of itself.  I do have an HDMI to VGA and a 3 RCA YPbPr to VGA converter.  Assuming  "draw time" of a minimum of 9 milliseconds, (what inputlag.com 's quickest TN monitor rates) and those 2 converters having a worst case scenario of 100 microseconds, and only needing one or the other, 0.1 milliseconds is a lot more reasonable to react to in a fighting game than 9 milliseconds, and is certainly better than my then best PlayStation 3D display time of 32 milliseconds.

 

Since I don't plan to play 4x3 games on it, just keep it at the 16x9 manual adjust and be able to block based purely on reactions.

 

[phoenixdownita]

FYI: at 240p60 refresh like the one of consoles of old, it takes 16.6msec per single screen, at 240lines that is about 69.3 usec (microsec) per single line.

So your fighting game example reaction time of 0.1 msec (aka 100usec) makes literally no sense, because it would mean you can react in about 1 line and a half .... I just don't think it's even possible.

[tripletopper]

By the way, I'm talking about the ADDED reaction time.  Human reaction time to something, depending on how braindead the  reaction is (land on big bucks and a spin, hit it now.  That's a  quicker easier response than a response to an unknown attack in a fighting game, where you see and gave to think of the response quickly). 

 

I'm not saying I can react perfectly.  It seems on the PS3DTV, I think I'm a little late.  I guess the ultimate test is Street Fighter 30th.  If I fail more defensively on PS3DTV than the CRT TV.

 

By the way. Hauppauge says their rocket has less than 1 ms recorder processing delay.

 

Maybe slight lag is more noticable in Bit Trip Runner, where it's more about learned timing than quick reactions. I noticed 10 years ago,  I did well until we switched from a Sony Sega Flat SD CRT TV to a Sony PS3DTV.  On the 360's Runner 2, It seemed to have a larger spot to hit the note right.  But the first one on the Wii was spot on with no delay, and felt you had to "premeditate the rhythm" on a PS3DTV, (and that was a good low ping TV in 2012 ) On 360, there was a big enough target, but the Wii was spot on, especially some of the level 3 jumps.

 

I guess I'll do some tests once the my stream works.

 

[phoenixdownita]

Wrt polling for input:

https://byuu.net/input/latency

according to byuu most SNES games do check input once per frame (but not all), so the only lag you need to care is technically in frames.

As long as your modern TV/monitor does not add full frames of lag (your PSTV3D at 32ms adds 2 full frames) you should be good.

Not sure what games would start to get too hard with 1 full frame of lag, ideally anything that stays say half a frame behind or so should be good enough.

 

As you stated light gun games are more tricky but it depends on consoles and games, tolerance varies and of course the less the lag the better ... a few lines of lag may be alright and within tolerance of the game.

[tripletopper]

In Street fighter for modern consoles, (CRYd not easy to get) if you're a half frame behind, chances are you'll have to react only if you catch the first half of the frame. If you see it in the second. You're s frame behind.

 

I guess typing in combos in Street Fighter is like rhythm games, you'll have to "lead" the pattern instead of timing exactly.

 

That's why they give you the combos, because it's harder to compensate for typical TV lag, and perform them organically without being given the combos.