Champ Games - RobotWar: 2684 (aka Robotron:2084), 2600

[+johnnywc]

12 hours ago, ZylonBane said:

Regarding the borrowed 7800 sounds, I kind of really hope you don't end up keeping them. I always thought the sound effects were the weakest aspect of the otherwise excellent 7800 port. They come across rather wimpy compared to the punchy arcade sounds.

Hello ZB,

 

I personally like the 7800 sounds but agree they can probably be improved upon.  I'm using them for the demo out of necessity (I don't have the talent nor ability to make decent sounds for the 2600) and right now there is no plan as to what sounds will be used in the final release (planned for early 2021).  If anybody wants to volunteer to spice up or redo the sounds, send me a PM.  I would certainly appreciate it!  

12 hours ago, ZylonBane said:

My only other complaint would be the motion of the Hulks. They move too smoothly compared to the arcade Hulks, that moved in chunky steps.

Good point and suggestion!  I'll take a closer look at the arcade and will try to more closely mimic the clunky movement.  

[ZylonBane]

Okay okay, most of the sounds are actually fine. It's just that there are a few effects that rely on the sound registers being updated much faster than once a frame for their unique sound, most notably the human pickup, bonus life, and wave end/begin sounds.

 

So is it even possible with this kernel to update sounds more than once per frame? In an ideal world you'd be able to program the DPC+ to run this algorithm to reproduce the Robotron sounds precisely, but I assume it's already busy doing other things.

 

EDIT: Getting back to the animations, I finally figured out what specifically is going on. In the arcade version, the animation cycles of the Hulks (and humans, and probably all the other bipedal enemies) are tied explicitly to their movement. That is, every time they move, they also advance to the next animation frame. The 2600 port instead appears to just cycle animations at a fixed rate no matter how they're moving, which makes them kind of look like they're skating around the screen.

Edited June 4, 2020 by ZylonBane

[flickertail]

SpiceWare posted on my blog about your Robotron 2600 game project in response to my MrBoehm USB/Bluetooth controller project. Excited to be able to buy a copy once it is released.

 

It'll be a great use of this feature:

MrBoehm Double-Joystick Template

[+johnnywc]

On 6/1/2020 at 6:06 PM, ZylonBane said:

Okay okay, most of the sounds are actually fine. It's just that there are a few effects that rely on the sound registers being updated much faster than once a frame for their unique sound, most notably the human pickup, bonus life, and wave end/begin sounds.

 

So is it even possible with this kernel to update sounds more than once per frame? In an ideal world you'd be able to program the DPC+ to run this algorithm to reproduce the Robotron sounds precisely, but I assume it's already busy doing other things.

That algorithm is really cool!  Unfortunately we're not using the DPC+, just plain ol' TIA.  DPC+ requires you update the DPC chip every scanline and unfortunately the kernels in Robotron don't have any more free cycles to do that.  I guess we could try to update the TIA registers twice a frame, but I think that would take a ton of ROM for the sounds and we're already at maximum cycle usage just to run the game as is, so we're probably stuck with single-update TIA sounds.

On 6/1/2020 at 6:06 PM, ZylonBane said:

EDIT: Getting back to the animations, I finally figured out what specifically is going on. In the arcade version, the animation cycles of the Hulks (and humans, and probably all the other bipedal enemies) are tied explicitly to their movement. That is, every time they move, they also advance to the next animation frame. The 2600 port instead appears to just cycle animations at a fixed rate no matter how they're moving, which makes them kind of look like they're skating around the screen.

Thanks for the insight!  I'll take a look at the animations more closely and see about syncing them with movement instead of being constant.  

[+johnnywc]

On 6/3/2020 at 10:16 PM, flickertail said:

SpiceWare posted on my blog about your Robotron 2600 game project in response to my MrBoehm USB/Bluetooth controller project. Excited to be able to buy a copy once it is released.

 

It'll be a great use of this feature:

MrBoehm Double-Joystick Template

That looks really cool!   Do you plan on selling those or is the project a one off?

[flickertail]

I'm not big on selling it myself. Once we have a working prototype, I think David and I would like to work with someone else to make it available to others.

 

IDK, I'm friends with the guy who owns the local gaming cafe. He fixes game consoles including old ones. I thought we might partner with him to make it available more widely. I'm mostly doing it for something to do while being locked down at my house.

 

Though I would hate for it be just a one-off as I've invested a vast amount of time in it, and just making only two of them (one each for David and I) would seem to be a bit of a waste of effort. Worst case scenario, we'd make the plans PCB drawings and code free for people to download.

[Shannon]

Just tried this today and all I can say is just WOW...

 

And I thought Galagon and Mappy were milestones.  This plays fantastic ( considering ).. even with one controller.  I managed to make it to the stage with the little boxy things flying around.

 

[Atariboy2600]

Dont know if its too late to do any fan art on the game but I wanted to see if I could do a classic 1950's/ 80s  style label box art with it.

[Greg2600]

On 5/16/2020 at 10:24 PM, D Train said:

so exciting!

 

this has been floated elsewhere, but is there any talk of developing a cx-40 joystick coupler?

 

you guys sort of mentioned it as a possibility in passing on ZPH and Nathan mentions it here:

 

thought that it would be a good idea to make this a part of this thread.

 

there are assorted homemade 7800 and 5200 couplers kicking around on AA but I am not sure if any were ever fully completed or whether anyone ever made one for the cx-40.

 

The other issue, of course is that there are a ton of different 2600 joysticks out there and the cx-40 may not even be the best one for robotron...

 

@amiman99 makes a nice one for 2600, just got it.

 

[+johnnywc]

15 minutes ago, Greg2600 said:

@amiman99 makes a nice one for 2600, just got it.

 

That's awesome!    I'll have to get one of these soon!  

[+sramirez2008]

 

3 minutes ago, johnnywc said:

That's awesome!    I'll have to get one of these soon!  

Me too. Thanks @Greg2600?

[TrekMD]

That coupler looks awesome!  How can I get one?!

[Thomas Jentzsch]

Looks like 3D printed. Maybe the data is available.

[nyandeyanen]

I modified one of the 6 button Genesis controllers I put together to play Xenocrisis with a pair of EdLaddin's Easy 78 boards. There's a switch on the side to change the ground configuration on the first two buttons so it works with the Atari 7800 twin controller configuration. Robotron 2048 plays amazingly well with it!

If anyone's interested in duplicating the stick, I bought the box kit from Workshop Matt at Etsy since I just don't have the space for woodworking tools. He made a few changes that I asked for from his usual sticks to set it up for twin Sanwa sticks and Happ buttons. After assembling it I covered the top with some extra arcade control panel vinyl, added some edge trim seals off Amazon, put in the sticks, added some 8 way restrictor plates, put in some Happ style buttons to suit the look I was going for, and it looks and works pretty great IMO.

[+thegoldenband]

Was really blown away when I randomly stumbled on a video of this -- it's simply astonishing and far beyond anything I imagined possible.

 

Regarding controls, has the possibility been floated of supporting two Master System or Genesis gamepads turned 90°? That was the control scheme used by Smash TV on the NES, and I thought it worked quite well (I beat the game that way).

[+sramirez2008]

On 7/25/2020 at 11:44 AM, johnnywc said:

That's awesome!    I'll have to get one of these soon!  

Mine arrived today and it works! Thanks @amiman99.

 

[Albert]

Being able to design and 3D print stuff like this is really amazing.  Cool times we live in.  Except for all the other crap going on. 

 

 ..Al

[+sramirez2008]

1 minute ago, Albert said:

Being able to design and 3D print stuff like this is really amazing.  Cool times we live in.  Except for all the other crap going on. 

 

 ..Al

Yep. @johnnywc Bring on Robotron!

[+johnnywc]

17 minutes ago, sramirez2008 said:

Yep. @johnnywc Bring on Robotron!

We're working on it now Steve!   I just finished adding in co-op mode that will allow you and a friend to battle together!  We're still testing it, but here is how it works for now:

• the players are working together to achieve one high score and they share the pool of reserve lives.
• two mutants (different colors) start the wave in the middle of the screen
• each player independently controls a mutant with their controller.  Note:  for now, only single joystick control is supported for each player, but the final version will allow BOTH players to each use two joysticks (one to move, one to fire) using the QuadTari  
• to balance the game play, both players have a pool of 4 shots total that they can fire at any one time (meaning if one person is shooting, they can shoot 4 missiles; if both players are shooting, they each will fire as long as there are < 4 shots on the screen)
• half of the enemies pursue player 1, the other half pursue player 2.  If one player is removed from the wave after being killed, all enemies will pursue the remaining player.
• If one player is killed during a wave:
  • On Novice, the player stays on the screen in a zombie state (cannot move or fire).  If the other player touches them, they are revived (invincible for 2 seconds).  If the second player is killed before they can revive the first player that was killed, a life is lost and the wave resets with the remaining enemies.
  • On Standard, the player is removed from the game.  They will return at the start of the next wave or if the other player is killed during the wave and there are reserves left.
  • On Advanced, the team loses a life and the wave resets with the remaining enemies (like normal)

We hope to post a demo of co-op mode soon for people to test out and give feedback.  

 

Thanks,

John

 

[+sramirez2008]

3 minutes ago, johnnywc said:

We're working on it now Steve!   I just finished adding in co-op mode that will allow you and a friend to battle together!  We're still testing it, but here is how it works for now:

• the players are working together to achieve one high score and they share the pool of reserve lives.
• two mutants (different colors) start the wave in the middle of the screen
• each player independently controls a mutant with their controller.  Note:  for now, only single joystick control is supported for each player, but the final version will allow BOTH players to each use two joysticks (one to move, one to fire) using the QuadTari  
• to balance the game play, both players have a pool of 4 shots total that they can fire at any one time (meaning if one person is shooting, they can shoot 4 missiles; if both players are shooting, they each will fire as long as there are < 4 shots on the screen)
• half of the enemies pursue player 1, the other half pursue player 2.  If one player is removed from the wave after being killed, all enemies will pursue the remaining player.
• If one player is killed during a wave:
  • On Novice, the player stays on the screen in a zombie state (cannot move or fire).  If the other player touches them, they are revived (invincible for 2 seconds).  If the second player is killed before they can revive the first player that was killed, a life is lost and the wave resets with the remaining enemies.
  • On Standard, the player is removed from the game.  They will return at the start of the next wave or if the other player is killed during the wave and there are reserves left.
  • On Advanced, the team loses a life and the wave resets with the remaining enemies (like normal)

We hope to post a demo of co-op mode soon for people to test out and give feedback.  

 

Thanks,

John

 

 What!!!  This is total voodoo. 
 

I’m gonna need a QuadTari.?

[+D Train]

2 hours ago, sramirez2008 said:

Mine arrived today and it works!

can you do a brief review after using is for a week?

 

how you're using it, whether the joysticks stay locked in place, etc?

 

I would appreciate knowing that.

 

thanks!

[+sramirez2008]

9 minutes ago, D Train said:

whether the joysticks stay locked in place, etc?

I played Robotron for ~40 minutes today and they lock in place just fine. 

[+ZeroPage Homebrew]

We have the EXCLUSIVE NEW BUILD of Robotron: 2084 with the new two player co-op mode on tomorrow's (Fri Jul 31) ZeroPage Homebrew stream LIVE on Twitch at 6PM PT | 9PM ET | 1AM GMT! Hope everyone can watch!

 

Twitch Stream: https://www.twitch.tv/zeropagehomebrew/

 

Games:

• Robotron: 2084 (2020 Exclusive WIP Update) by John Champeau (@johnnywc) (Coding & Design) of Champ Games, Nathan Strum (@Nathan Strum) (Art & Graphics), David Brown (Music & Sounds)
• Mental Kombat (2002) by Simon Quernhorst (@Simon)
• Blinky Goes Up (2012) by Jan Hermanns (@Jan Hermanns)

 

(SET VIDEO TO 1080P60 FOR FULL QUALITY)

 

Edited August 2, 2020 by ZeroPage Homebrew

[insertclevernamehere]

Note to the great John Champeau.  Much in the same way making Scramble made it easier to make Super Cobra Arcade, I'm hoping that making Robotron will make it easier to make Food Fight.  Hint hint.

[+johnnywc]

On 8/12/2020 at 6:20 PM, insertclevernamehere said:

Note to the great John Champeau.  Much in the same way making Scramble made it easier to make Super Cobra Arcade, I'm hoping that making Robotron will make it easier to make Food Fight.  Hint hint.

Note taken... FF is a great game and the Robotron engine would certainly lend itself nicely to that type of game!