4160 STe with TOS 2.06

[Randy]

I have this machine now, obvious upgrades to memory & TOS, running Dungeon Master off the Gotek, it seems as though DM is running faster, is that possible or am I imagining things?  I was more concerned that with 2.06 there would be compatibility issues, but so far the one game has worked fine.  thanks

[bfollowell]

If you'd like to get a real 4160STE case badge, Best Electronics still has NOS, 4610STE upgrade case badges that Atari used to use. I bought one for my machine several months ago.

 

Like you, I upgraded from 1 to 4MB. I also swapped out the U.K. keyboard for a U.S. keyboard, added a dual-TOS card with U.S. TOS 1.62/2.06 for the ultimate in compatibility, and installed a Gotek with a custom printed mount and an OLED screen. I also purchased an Ultrasatan drive which my wife just informed me finally arrived from Poland this afternoon after waiting for it for three months after International shipping shutdown everywhere!

 

You may also want to look into Exxos' mandatory fixes for the ST line. You can read about them here:

 

EXXOS' MANDATORY FIXES

 

I haven't completed all of them yet on mine, but plan to soon.

 

Enjoy! I hope you have as much fun with yours as I've had with mine.

 

[Randy]

Thanks b, I was a little concerned that having picked this STe up with 2.06 in it I would have problems with games compatibility, so I will see how that goes for my must-play 9.  Depending on how things go, I am planning an Ultrasatan for my Mega STe in the near future after my keyboard from Best Electronics comes in and look into Peter's fixed 1.62i/2.06i roms, that looks like a good way to have both good games compatibility and the best desktop for the ST.

[bfollowell]

I liked the idea of have the dual-TOS for the ultimate in compatibility but, honestly, from what I've heard, most of the compatibility issues have been corrected and patched over the years since, so we're much less likely to run into issues now than we would have been 30 years ago.

 

[Clint Thompson]

6 hours ago, bfollowell said:

If you'd like to get a real 4160STE case badge, Best Electronics still has NOS, 4610STE upgrade case badges that Atari used to use. I bought one for my machine several months ago.

Oh? I thought he has sold out a long time ago! How much was it?

[tjlazer]

You're imagining things.  

[Randy]

26 minutes ago, tjlazer said:

You're imagining things.  

yea, that would make more sense, but game play does seem snappier and more responsive, and being a gamer for many years, I kind of have a feel for that sort of thing...

[atarian1]

Maybe it's the disk access? Loading from flash storage is much faster than floppies.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

I guess that it's still talk about Dungeon Master (maybe some quoting would be good when reply on little earlier text) .

I remember that when I first time played it there was really slow loading from disk. Needed couple minutes to start at all. Reminded me on loadings from tape with Sinclair Spectrum.  In meantime DM became one of the most famous games, and analyzed a lot. So, we know now that the main reason for slow loading is two level packing of game data. That was needed to squeeze all it on single sided floppy (400 KB). And btw. they used special trick (did not see it in any other game) to make it work with 512 KB RAM. And that was important back in 1987 when game was launched.

When I made hard disk and floppy versions of it I used only 1 level packed files, and it loads much faster.  Later made DMA audio playback (needs STE and later), what makes gameplay little faster too.  So, I guess that it is what caused feeling it faster. Of course it needs then min 720 KB floppy and 1 MB RAM for DMA audio version.

http://atari.8bitchip.info/ASTGA/D/dungmast.php

 

Yes, lot of games is patched, fixed for later TOS versions, STE, etc. But not all, and there are disks around with old versions, so making it more compatible still have some sense.  Btw. I would not call 1.62i fixed ROM - there are few fixes, and many new features, added things - like TV test picture .

[bfollowell]

5 hours ago, Clint Thompson said:

Oh? I thought he has sold out a long time ago! How much was it?

Well, I guess it depends on how you define “a long time ago.” I’d have to double-check, but I think it’s only been six months or so since I ordered mine, and I believe it was about $20. I’ll try to confirm later.

 

[Randy]

9 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

I guess that it's still talk about Dungeon Master (maybe some quoting would be good when reply on little earlier text) .

I remember that when I first time played it there was really slow loading from disk. Needed couple minutes to start at all. Reminded me on loadings from tape with Sinclair Spectrum.  In meantime DM became one of the most famous games, and analyzed a lot. So, we know now that the main reason for slow loading is two level packing of game data. That was needed to squeeze all it on single sided floppy (400 KB). And btw. they used special trick (did not see it in any other game) to make it work with 512 KB RAM. And that was important back in 1987 when game was launched.

When I made hard disk and floppy versions of it I used only 1 level packed files, and it loads much faster.  Later made DMA audio playback (needs STE and later), what makes gameplay little faster too.  So, I guess that it is what caused feeling it faster. Of course it needs then min 720 KB floppy and 1 MB RAM for DMA audio version.

http://atari.8bitchip.info/ASTGA/D/dungmast.php

 

Yes, lot of games is patched, fixed for later TOS versions, STE, etc. But not all, and there are disks around with old versions, so making it more compatible still have some sense.  Btw. I would not call 1.62i fixed ROM - there are few fixes, and many new features, added things - like TV test picture .

Now that is interesting reply and gives me a new question.  Does the stereo RCA jacks on the back only work for newer audio chip or for both the old YM chip and the newer audio chip?  I think both as I loaded an old disk-based game, Breach, and the sound is coming out of the stereo jacks.  If the sound in the cracked version of DM (Dark Lord cracked it?) then by offloading the sound to the DMA would allow more processor for the graphics of the game which would/could result in a "snappier" feel, which I definitely get.  Thanks!

[jefffulton]

On 6/5/2020 at 3:23 PM, Randy said:

Thanks b, I was a little concerned that having picked this STe up with 2.06 in it I would have problems with games compatibility, so I will see how that goes for my must-play 9.  Depending on how things go, I am planning an Ultrasatan for my Mega STe in the near future after my keyboard from Best Electronics comes in and look into Peter's fixed 1.62i/2.06i roms, that looks like a good way to have both good games compatibility and the best desktop for the ST.

You can load the UltraSatan up with the 8bitchip.com HD game library that has been fixed to work with tos 2.06

[Randy]

OK, been trying to get this 4160 STe 2.06 UK machine to run properly with games WITHOUT US or any other flash card option as these are a future additions to the system when my finances improve.  So in the meantime I have tried an number of options with interesting results, to say the least.  The UK 4160 STe running TOS 2.06 UK is not game-friendly to say the least, particularly to any games ran off of the floppy drive.  Using a Gotek, which came with my 1040 ST, does better when the proper game/cracked file is used, otherwise it too gives bad results.  I cannot run most games from the floppy, even originals, and only unprotected games like Breach (which has some color issues) and PD games on various disks (STFormat, User, etc.), so there seems to be an issue with 2.06 as has been noted by PP and others.  One attempt was to try downloading "cleaned" games from PP that were to used on SD or CF card storage devices using a 1.44 floppy drive to copy the data onto when downloaded onto my Surface.  Two files were copied that were small enough to fit onto a DSDD drive, Elite and Bloodwych.  Elite did not work, and BW would not run from the DSDD drive.  However, I tried a replacement drive I had that was a converted Mitsumi DSHD drive and BW ran fine but still now Elite.  Looks like the Gotek is the only answer until I can afford a US : (

[MasterMotorola]

If Best Electronics is sold out of badges, this guy on Etsy mades them just like the originals for under $8 Cdn / $6 US with free shipping...

 

https://www.etsy.com/ca/listing/790514072/atari-4160-ste-color-label-logo-sticker?ref=shop_home_active_68&frs=1

[bfollowell]

Well, being brushed aluminum, they’re not just like the originals. Still, the way they’re painted, they are definitely the best of the newly made ones that I’ve seen on various sites like eBay and others. That’s definitely a good price too.

 

[Lynxpro]

On 6/6/2020 at 12:39 AM, ParanoidLittleMan said:

I guess that it's still talk about Dungeon Master (maybe some quoting would be good when reply on little earlier text) .

I remember that when I first time played it there was really slow loading from disk. Needed couple minutes to start at all. Reminded me on loadings from tape with Sinclair Spectrum.  In meantime DM became one of the most famous games, and analyzed a lot. So, we know now that the main reason for slow loading is two level packing of game data. That was needed to squeeze all it on single sided floppy (400 KB). And btw. they used special trick (did not see it in any other game) to make it work with 512 KB RAM. And that was important back in 1987 when game was launched.

When I made hard disk and floppy versions of it I used only 1 level packed files, and it loads much faster.  Later made DMA audio playback (needs STE and later), what makes gameplay little faster too.  So, I guess that it is what caused feeling it faster. Of course it needs then min 720 KB floppy and 1 MB RAM for DMA audio version.

http://atari.8bitchip.info/ASTGA/D/dungmast.php

 

Yes, lot of games is patched, fixed for later TOS versions, STE, etc. But not all, and there are disks around with old versions, so making it more compatible still have some sense.  Btw. I would not call 1.62i fixed ROM - there are few fixes, and many new features, added things - like TV test picture .

 

Was the DMA audio sourced from the Amiga version?

[ParanoidLittleMan]

1 hour ago, Lynxpro said:

 

Was the DMA audio sourced from the Amiga version?

PC version.