The 8-bit guy blows up IBM 7496 prototype(?)

[+OLD CS1]

1 hour ago, desiv said:

OLD CS1, perhaps you missed the part where he mentioned this video is unlisted??

This is a video people will only see if they are interested...  He has over a million subscribers and I would think he put it out because he thinks some of them would be interested and, if so, can click and view it.

Nope, and completely missing my point.

 

1 hour ago, desiv said:

I supposed an appropriate response to you might be:

What is it with the YouTube viewers who click a video with a specific title, and then complain about the content of said video?   ?

I did not watch it and do not care about that part.  I cannot watch 30 minutes of someone droning on when a two paragraph blog post would suffice.  Seems the YouTube ecosphere is not for me, which is fine as I guess it helps me avoid unnecessary drama like Charles whatshisname.  I mean, how can I argue against a millions subscribers?

 

20 minutes ago, Arnuphis said:

I really don't agree with them being dragged into the discussion especially when they have never entered his 8-bit channel at any time. As for the racism claim... not worthy of any kind of a response. 

Re: personal politics, 100% seconded.

[desiv]

5 minutes ago, OLD CS1 said:

I mean, how can I argue against a millions subscribers?

I never said you should think it is good or bad or agree with anyone.

I was just answering the question you posed:

"What is it with "YouTubers" and these long ass response and rebuttal videos?"

You were completely missing my point. 

 

Have a good one...

[+OLD CS1]

1 minute ago, desiv said:

"What is it with "YouTubers" and these long ass response and rebuttal videos?"

You were completely missing my point. 

hrmmmm Ok, I see what you mean.  Your statement works both ways for me: both complementary and contradictory to my point.  I get ya.

[YSG2020]

I appreciate and agree with most of David’s response video, but it should be uploaded to his 8-bit public YouTube channel, not just the private paying Patreon subscribers. He sets a bad precedent with this as it indicates he really only cares about people who create revenue for him.  
Where I do have a problem that he is missing the point completely is that he thinks carrying an automatic weapon in public scaring people and kids and not caring about their feelings is some kind of political statement.  THAT is the part that speaks volumes about David’s level of intelligence, thoughtfulness, and character. 

[desiv]

I don't think what his viewpoint is really what matters or should be talked about.

The question is really, do you (anyone) feel you can still watch a youtuber who thinks differently than you do on whatever issue you feel is that important.

Each person needs to make that choice for themselves, regardless of which side of whatever argument.

 

I know I significantly disagree with people on multiple levels, but the only ones I choose not to have anything to do with over it are my family, but that's a different story.

 

As for whether or not that vid should be on his public channel.  First, he gets revenue from both Patreon and youtube.    Also, if he had placed it on his main channel, some people would complain that it doesn't belong there...  No win situation that...  I'm glad he chose that route (and as a non-Patrean (and non-youtube subscriber) of his, I saw it, and it wasn't only linked publicly here.), but other people will have wanted it on the main page.  Either way.

Edited October 1, 2020 by desiv

[YSG2020]

His attitude has everything to do with who he is as a person, and that same attitude and person comes across pretty obviously on his 8-bit channel.  I’m simply making the case for what kind of person he is and why he does the things he does. 

[desiv]

24 minutes ago, YSG2020 said:

His attitude has everything to do with who he is as a person, and that same attitude and person comes across pretty obviously on his 8-bit channel.  I’m simply making the case for what kind of person he is and why he does the things he does. 

I'm still not sure why that matters.

His output is what it is.  Whatever the reason for it...

There could be multiple reasons for the kind of person he is.   I am not personally concerned what the reason is.

He is a youtuber.  If I enjoy his videos, I will watch them.  If not, I won't.  (For the record, I watch some of them when they cover an area that I am interested in.  So I didn't watch the IBM one.)

If I find out he is a mass murderer, I would probably stop watching him.

The fact that he believes in things I strongly disagree with and would never do myself...   Meh.

People are different.

 

But that is me... 

Edited October 1, 2020 by desiv

[The Usotsuki]

6 hours ago, YSG2020 said:

Where I do have a problem that he is missing the point completely is that he thinks carrying an automatic weapon in public scaring people and kids and not caring about their feelings is some kind of political statement.  THAT is the part that speaks volumes about David’s level of intelligence, thoughtfulness, and character. 

Now, if anything's problematic... That's literally terrorism.

 

And if anyone is so afraid of their own shadow they need something that powerful with them, they have serious mental issues and need therapy or they'd be better to be off the streets for everyone else's safety.

[+OLD CS1]

Going off the rails, here...

[wierd_w]

On the one hand, I can totally get down with many of the explanations he gives. (It really is not humanly feasible to respond to every post, etc..)

 

However, the "I was super duper busy" is an explanation for not getting to something, or not finishing something in a timely manner.  Not for throwing caution to the wind, and acting like you forgot how to do support for vintage machines.

 

I was literally half-awake, after being up all night on the graveyard shift chasing after senile old people in a nursing home for 9 hours, and the "Oh, that's system options not set!" recognition still fired.  I did the whole play-by-play post while in that state.

 

Granted, not everyone can function after being harried by endless tasks-- but things that are wore-in from years of having done them, should always come second nature. (it even happens if you develop dementia, for goodness sake!)  His video does not give a very good explanation for why he did not engage with that second nature.

 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by wierd_w

[+x=usr(1536)]

A few things about the rebuttal video:

• While I don't agree with him only making it available to Patreon subscribers, that is his prerogative.  Ultimately, though, this is something that could conceivably come back to bite him because the majority of his viewership aren't Patreon subscribers, so are unlikely to know that it was posted unless (as happened here) someone who does have access to the video makes it available.  The effectiveness of him being able to clarify his position is reduced simply because the majority of those who saw the initial video will be unaware of this one.
• The points he was making re: the paperclip incident and how that is common practice with diagnosing PC issues are valid.  I've even used that technique myself.  However, I'm less than impressed with how he skated around the fact that taking the approach that he did was irresponsible given the lack of documentation on these machines.  Sure, I agree that they're probably just dead-end products where the real value of them is as curiosities, but that's still no excuse for just jamming paperclips into power supplies and seeing what happens.  People take more care with common, everyday machines that are well-documented and easier to replace or source parts for.
• The 'I'm really busy' statements: well, we all get busy.  The trick is to not take on too much.  If you have to tell people, "hey, sorry about this, but there's some stuff going on the background that I can't talk about just yet.  It's nothing bad, but it will eat up a bunch of my time over the next few days/weeks/months/whatever, which means that I'm going to have to cut back on video output for a bit.  And no, I'm not just clamming up completely, but may release less frequently or do shorter videos until things are back to normal.  That said, I think you're going to enjoy the videos that'll come out of this period as projects complete.  Thank you, and I appreciate your understanding while I knock all of this out."  People can respect that.

Overall, my opinion is that he provided some useful backstory to what was going on, and why he made some of the decisions that he did.  I still don't agree with some of those decisions, but they are what they are at this point.

 

Not going to unsubscribe from the channel over this, but right now I am feeling a bit better about not putting my Patreon dollars into it.  That may change as things (hopefully) improve.

Edited October 2, 2020 by x=usr(1536)

[+acadiel]

Did he remove the comments? I did see the video in my feed and responded that the paper clip thing he did made me wince. Don’t see any comments on the video now.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[+acadiel]

I usually like his videos but that one was just painful. There were multiple basic warning signs that his paper clip idea was a terrible one. Hell, bridging unknown pins with a paper clip is always a terrible idea if you like your hardware to not be destroyed.

And I said so in the comments shortly after he posted the video... the comments which are now no longer there. Sigh,


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Hwlngmad]

18 hours ago, Arnuphis said:

But at the end of the day it's his future content that will be the judge of the channel and it's future. I am glad to say the next video posted with the Petscii game was back to the quality I have enjoyed so I will be sticking around for now. 

 

Just don't loan him any IBM stuff! 

Agreed.  Also, the Petscii video was pretty cool I thought.  Finally, I wouldn't recommend to loan him any 'rare but not valuable' IBM computers anytime soon either

[+OLD CS1]

4 minutes ago, acadiel said:

Did he remove the comments? I did see the video in my feed and responded that the paper clip thing he did made me wince. Don’t see any comments on the video now.

I recall mention above comments were turned off.  When that happens, existing comments are removed.

 

(Removed from public view.  The creator can still view them.)

[Keatah]

Armchair Warrior my ass.. Just because x amount of computers can be turned on by shorting the power sense stuff doesn't mean that same procedure would apply to an odd-ball machine. Common sense would say, "hey! It's different! It's gonna work different.."

 

Knock the pin out of the screw? My ass with crap smeared all over it! Imagine the physical shock to the 30 year old parts.

 

But he is right that the machine isn't valuable. It's just some engineering excrement from a big company.

[ChildOfCv]

51 minutes ago, Keatah said:

Armchair Warrior my ass.. Just because x amount of computers can be turned on by shorting the power sense stuff doesn't mean that same procedure would apply to an odd-ball machine. Common sense would say, "hey! It's different! It's gonna work different.."

Besides that, his reading was NOT a direct short.  Low ohms definitely, but if it's not in the low half of single digits, don't call it a direct short.  Even more than 2 ohms, if it really is a direct connection, is indicative of corrosion or oxidation that needs to be repaired or at least removed before taking a reading.  When reverse-engineering PCBs, I always read 1 or less, once I've scraped off enough of that ancient crust.

 

 And if it is a transformer, it was likely in series with whatever else was in the power supply.  Bypassing that was likely similar to plugging a 120V appliance into a 240V wall socket.  In other words, it's not necessarily a complex circuit, just one that needed the transformer in the monitor to leech some of the supplied power.  On the bad side, that means if the monitor has its own issue and isn't pulling any power for itself, it could fry the computer's power supply.

[+InsaneMultitasker]

On 9/26/2020 at 6:41 AM, wierd_w said:

Now that I am home from work---

 

This guy is a tool.  What he SHOULD have done:

--

Of course, he does not need to try that, since he has THE FREAKING DISKETTE FROM THE BOX RIGHT THERE. (Timestamp 8:11)  The advanced diagnostics diskette is EXACTLY what he needs.  (In fact, if he were a GOOD data historian, he would dump the contents of that disk and make it available, simply BECAUSE the "Allmighty Google" does not have any knowledge of that beast!!)

 

arggh, that video was painful to watch.  Made me nostalgic for the big stacks of rubber-banded disks of options/ADF/etc files that I carried around everywhere back in those days.  Not that I miss crawling around/under desks and teller lines and throughout god-forsaken wiring cubby holes filled with type2 cabling and dusty MAUs hunting for the one poorly inserted connection that was causing the whole floor to beacon at a site with no connection maps, hoping my white shirt and tie survived the days' ordeal. Nope, not one bit.

 

I hope he learned something from his IBM experience and is a bit smarter about these beasts the next time. 

[wierd_w]

You mean 10base2?

 

Had to use it at a few network installs we did because it had longer cable restrictions than 10baseT.

 

I would always be forthright about the signalling bottleneck it imposed, but they never seemed to care as long as the printers and fileshares worked.  I only ever used it except to bridge very distant switches that could not have a repeater put between. (Such as between hangars for aircraft)

.

I sometimes wonder what they replaced it with.

 

 

Or do you mean something more exotic and IBM specific, like Twinax?

Edited November 5, 2020 by wierd_w

[bluejay]

He's obviously more careful with stuff now, I'm pretty sure the old 8 bit guy would have tried the 99/4 game on the Tomy Tutor. He only tried plugging it in though, didn't power it on. Speaking of which, can you play a TI game on a Tomy Tutor?

[wierd_w]

The cartridge slot has a few very important lines that are different.  Mostly voltages.

 

 

[+x=usr(1536)]

4 hours ago, wierd_w said:

You mean 10base2?

 

It's possible he may have meant Cat2 - IIRC, that was what IBM used for Token Ring.

[+InsaneMultitasker]

6 hours ago, wierd_w said:

You mean 10base2?

...

Or do you mean something more exotic and IBM specific, like Twinax?

I intended to say Type 2. It was thick and unwieldy cable.   My company used both Type 1 and Type 2 cabling with token Ring 4mbps (and later 16Mbs) connectivity.  There doesn't seem to be a whole lot of detail info out there but if you look at this link for Type 1/Type 2 it has a reasonable description. 

 

" Type 2 (4716739), Type 2 Plenum (4716738): The cables contain
two data grade twisted pairs and four twisted pairs of AWG22 copper
voice-grade conductors for use with telephones. The telephone pairs
are color coded and are located outside the data pair shield to
minimize crosstalk and under the outer sheath for protection. The
cables are designed for use from wiring closets to receptacles in
work areas"

 

https://www-01.ibm.com/common/ssi/cgi-bin/ssialias?appname=skmwww&htmlfid=897%2FENUS184-068&infotype=AN&mhq=IBM Network Station 8361 Series 100&mhsrc=ibmsearch_a&subtype=CA

 

example of cables we used at the computer side.

 

 

[+x=usr(1536)]

1 hour ago, InsaneMultitasker said:

I intended to say Type 2. It was thick and unwieldy cable.   My company used both Type 1 and Type 2 cabling with token Ring 4mbps (and later 16Mbs) connectivity.  There doesn't seem to be a whole lot of detail info out there but if you look at this link for Type 1/Type 2 it has a reasonable description. 

 

" Type 2 (4716739), Type 2 Plenum (4716738): The cables contain
two data grade twisted pairs and four twisted pairs of AWG22 copper
voice-grade conductors for use with telephones. The telephone pairs
are color coded and are located outside the data pair shield to
minimize crosstalk and under the outer sheath for protection. The
cables are designed for use from wiring closets to receptacles in
work areas"

 

https://www-01.ibm.com/common/ssi/cgi-bin/ssialias?appname=skmwww&htmlfid=897%2FENUS184-068&infotype=AN&mhq=IBM Network Station 8361 Series 100&mhsrc=ibmsearch_a&subtype=CA

 

example of cables we used at the computer side.

 

 

 

Oh, God, I remember that cabling now.  Had some exposure to Token Ring when I worked for the Computing Services department while at University; they ran both kinds.

 

Last time I can put a finger on when I saw it was c.2003, still in use in a datacentre supporting local government.  If it ain't broke...

[Keatah]

9 hours ago, bluejay said:

He's obviously more careful with stuff now, I'm pretty sure the old 8 bit guy would have tried the 99/4 game on the Tomy Tutor. He only tried plugging it in though, didn't power it on.

Atari VCS cartridges plug into the Apple II slots.

 

9 hours ago, bluejay said:

Speaking of which, can you play a TI game on a Tomy Tutor?

Isn't the architecture different? Different CPU, different "bios" ROMs?