Wizard of Wor - How IS the 5200 version?

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Just random thoughts upon seeing the recent and improved Homebrew version of Wizard of Wor Arcade for the 2600 on atariage store which looks absolutely amazing I began thinking about this title. I don't think I ever encountered it in the arcade bitd and if I did no doubt I passed it over to play other games. Now, these days I am not really in a position to pick up the great looking 2600 homebrew version and I thought well at least I could load up my harmony cart and try the old original 2600 release rom and I still plan to dig it out and do just that, I figured this was my only shot of playing Wizard of Wor since I don't own any other version or have an original cart. BUT THEN what do you know? The other day as I was literally digging through my boxes I happened upon al my 5200 stuff, one of the few systems I still have a few original carts for and lo and behold HERE IT IS! I have an original cart for the 5200! Cool! I do NOT have the original instructions or an overlay as I do for several other of my loose games (though I also have MOUNTAIN KING with both the instructions and overlay!) but still at least it's something, I look forward to trying it out, not expecting it to be as good as the new 2600 homebrew but was wondering, it might be a while until I actually have the time to hook up the old 5200 beast but for those who might know, how does the 5200 stack up? I mean at least in comparison to all the original homeports? Is it worthwhile? Anyone a fan of this game? Here is my cart - ??

 

[+cjherr]

I think it's a well done port, and lots of fun. No speech like the arcade had, but other than that, a nice conversion.

[+Ryan Witmer]

It's one of my favorite 5200 games.  I think it's a great port.

[zzip]

It's pretty faithful to the arcade game,  so it will compare favorably to the 2600 homebrew.

 

The original 2600 port wasn't bad either,  but the homebrew is closer to the arcade version and less flickery.  It also has speech.  I don't think 5200 version has speech.   The speech is just taunts in a 1980s "speak and spell" voice, it isn't critical to gameplay.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Yeap until the recent 2600 version from Champ, this was my favorite port of the game to play. It plays well with the stock controllers too. Also...just like the arcade and 2600 version, player 1 uses Player 2's controller. You might be able to start the game with a controller in port 1, but I seem to recall it have to use port 2 for single player.

 

 

[+Ryan Witmer]

47 minutes ago, -^CrossBow^- said:

Also...just like the arcade and 2600 version, player 1 uses Player 2's controller. You might be able to start the game with a controller in port 1, but I seem to recall it have to use port 2 for single player.

 

 

This is true, and it catches me every time.

[Goochman]

Its a good port, but def a candidate to enhance the graphics to be closer to the arcade.

[+Cafeman]

I played it quite a bit over the years, 5200 WoW is a good port. Lots of fun once you plug your stick into port 2!  I like the loud POKEY tune between levels. 

 

I seem to remember it is a medium resolution thus a bit blockier than the coin op version. But that doesn't affect the playability.

[phuzaxeman]

10 hours ago, OldSchoolRetroGamer said:

Just random thoughts upon seeing the recent and improved Homebrew version of Wizard of Wor Arcade for the 2600 on atariage store which looks absolutely amazing I began thinking about this title. I don't think I ever encountered it in the arcade bitd and if I did no doubt I passed it over to play other games. Now, these days I am not really in a position to pick up the great looking 2600 homebrew version and I thought well at least I could load up my harmony cart and try the old original 2600 release rom and I still plan to dig it out and do just that, I figured this was my only shot of playing Wizard of Wor since I don't own any other version or have an original cart. BUT THEN what do you know? The other day as I was literally digging through my boxes I happened upon al my 5200 stuff, one of the few systems I still have a few original carts for and lo and behold HERE IT IS! I have an original cart for the 5200! Cool! I do NOT have the original instructions or an overlay as I do for several other of my loose games (though I also have MOUNTAIN KING with both the instructions and overlay!) but still at least it's something, I look forward to trying it out, not expecting it to be as good as the new 2600 homebrew but was wondering, it might be a while until I actually have the time to hook up the old 5200 beast but for those who might know, how does the 5200 stack up? I mean at least in comparison to all the original homeports? Is it worthwhile? Anyone a fan of this game? Here is my cart - ??

 

The 2600 homebrew of W. O. W. is great.  The speech and intro screens are great, something the 5200 lacks. But the 5200 graphics minus the stars are still a little better than the 2600.  The 5200 doesn't have the speech like the latest 2600 homebrew but the sound effects are amazing and better than the 2600.  Plus the little 5200 music have a fuller sound than the 2600, especially when you get killed. Imagine if programmers worked on a modern day version. 

[zzip]

31 minutes ago, Goochman said:

Its a good port, but def a candidate to enhance the graphics to be closer to the arcade.

There's things that can be done to really make it "pop"..   Stars in the background, speech, maybe brighten the colors a little.  We can throw a lot more RAM/ROM at it nowadays...

 

But by the standards and cart limits BITD, it is an excellent port.

[Goochman]

26 minutes ago, zzip said:

There's things that can be done to really make it "pop"..   Stars in the background, speech, maybe brighten the colors a little.  We can throw a lot more RAM/ROM at it nowadays...

 

But by the standards and cart limits BITD, it is an excellent port.

Actually my biggest and only beef are the blue dragons - they look terrible on the 8bit port.  The 2600 port looks more faithful to the arcade monsters.  Other than that it plays and sounds great.  I played it a ton on my 800 BITD

[+Cafeman]

There is no flicker. The characters appear to be software sprites. I didnt check what graphics mode it uses, but if the game was redrawn using Antic mode 4 , you'd get more detailed graphics. 

 

Lol, I found my old review if the game. 

 

http://cafeman.www9.50megs.com/atari/5200wizardofwor.html

[Dutchman2000]

;*******************************
;*                             *
;*  ATARI 5200  WIZARD OF WOR  *
;*                             *
;* COPYRIGHT 1981 ROKLAN CORP. *
;* FROM BALLY/MIDWAY MFG. CO.  *
;*                             *
;*  16K ROM CARTRIDGE VERSION  *
;*          12/17/82           *
;*                             *
;*       * WRITTEN BY *        *
;* JOE HELLESEN AND JOE WAGNER *
;*                             *
;*******************************

Hmm.....

[+Cafeman]

You have the source code??

[Dutchman2000]

Yes.

[BIGHMW]

Wizard Of Wor IS STILL great even now, 36 years after getting the original CBS cart in which I now have the ROM file of but obviously one of the better games you will find for Big Sexy. BTW, I never knew the arcade version had a voice on her, perhaps maybe someone can homebrew (or hack) the original to include a voice and their own share of other tidbits to make it more truer to the arcade version, but it's still a great port.

[TIX]

3 hours ago, Cafeman said:

There is no flicker. The characters appear to be software sprites.

Aha ! no wonder I didn't found anything to edit, when I investigate the rom for a sprite hack  ?

I'm definitely interested to try my hand on the monsters !!

 

 

Edited September 30, 2020 by TIX

[BIGHMW]

Just now, TIX said:

Aha ! no wonder I didn't found anything to edit, when I investigate the rom for a sprite hack  ?

I'm definitely interested to try my hand on the monsters !!

 

 

...and please incorporate some sort of voice in her so we can hear it just like in the arcade version, Berzerk couldn't go without it, and neither should this.

[+Cafeman]

I just checked the display list in Altirra.  5200 Wizard of Wor gameplay uses Antic D. This is a bitmap mode (not a character/redefined mode like Antic 4) with 4 colors.   It is half the vertical resolution that Antic E is (see 5200 Joust to compare against).  

 

Antic D -  160 cols x 80 rows  / or 160 x 86 .    It uses 2 scanlines per mode line. 

Antic E -  160 cols x 160 rows / or 160 x 192.   It uses 1 scanline per mode line. Thus needs double the memory compared to Antic D. 

 

It would be trickier to convert existing game code to use 5-color Antic 4 mode (character/tiles mode) but not impossible of course.  

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Interesting, thanks for all the feedback and info, glad to hear it's a good one! I find it interesting how different these CBS games carts look so different, looking forward to playing it AND Mountain King as well. 

[TIX]

14 hours ago, Cafeman said:

I just checked the display list in Altirra.  5200 Wizard of Wor gameplay uses Antic D. This is a bitmap mode (not a character/redefined mode like Antic 4) with 4 colors.   It is half the vertical resolution that Antic E is (see 5200 Joust to compare against). 

 

Hey @Cafeman do you know if there is a tile editor available, that could help me edit Antic 4/5/etc characters ?

 

Edited October 1, 2020 by TIX

[Goochman]

53 minutes ago, TIX said:

 

Hey @Cafeman do you know if there is a tile editor available, that could help me edit Antic 4/5/etc characters ?

 

You are just the person to make things right on 8bit WoW

[+Cafeman]

3 hours ago, TIX said:

 

Hey @Cafeman do you know if there is a tile editor available, that could help me edit Antic 4/5/etc characters ?

 

Excellent question! The app that I used to use for Adventure II can be found in the link below, programmed by @calamari. I think you have to run it in DOS box on Windows 10. Is calamari still around? It would be great to have a version that you could run in Windows 10.

 

 

 

Also these were recommended recently. I haven't tried them yet. 

 

> Graph2font:
> http://g2f.atari8.info/
> Atari graphics studio:
> http://madteam.atari8.info/index.php?prod=uzytki
> For char based gfx you can use my fontmaker:
> http://matosimi.websupport.sk/atari/2020/01/atari-fontmaker-1-5/
 

[TIX]

56 minutes ago, Cafeman said:

Excellent question! The app that I used to use for Adventure II can be found in the link below, programmed by @calamari. I think you have to run it in DOS box on Windows 10. Is calamari still around? It would be great to have a version that you could run in Windows 10.

.

.

Thanks for the suggestions,

just to be clear, I ask about editing existing games, not creating new from scratch  !

I haven't try most of them, but I have a small experience with fontmaker, and it can only load .fnt files..

I have to admit I'm completely clueless as to how I can export the character set from a game, in order to load it into an editor  ?

 

 

Edited October 1, 2020 by TIX

[+johnnywc]

I'm a huge fan of the 8-bit version of Wizard of Wor; my brothers and I played it on the 800 for many hours and it was the main reason why I decided to update the 2600 version.   I would welcome an updated 8-bit version too!