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Do diehard Sega fans still hold a grudge on Sony?

Sony Vs Nintendo Vs Microsoft: Which company do diehard Sega fans dislike the most?  

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  1. 1. Sony Vs Nintendo Vs Microsoft: Which company do diehard Sega fans dislike the most?

    • I think diehard Sega fans dislike Sony more than the other 2
      19
    • I think diehard Sega fans dislike Nintendo more than the other 2
      8
    • I think diehard Sega fans dislike Microsoft more than the other 2
      2


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In Spain, many diehard Sega fans still hold a grudge on Sony since the PS2 "killed the Dreamcast" back in 2001.

 

I find this a bit weird, because the PS1 was the most similar console to the Saturn (with Namco taking the role of Sega) and the PS2 received some Namco and Sega games, but maybe many of them became Xbox fans when Panzer Dragoon Orta was announced as an Xbox exclusive. However, while the Xbox received around 50 Sega games, the PS2 received almost 200.

 

Has anyone in AtariAge perceived this in their own country or is this a Spanish phenomenon?

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I love Sega and I absolutely HATE Sony. I hate the Playstation and the only reason that I would buy one would be to make a video of me burning it. Lol. Maybe not. I just wont try sony ps.

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I would (at least historically) considered myself a Sega diehard. I don't have any ill feelings towards any company.  I like MS the least of the remaining big 3, but it has nothing to do with Sega, and even then it's more "like the least" than "actively dislike."

 

Sony didn't kill Sega or the Dreamcast.  I never thought they did, and I still don't.  I freaking LOVED the DC.

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Hating a corporation because they marketed a technically superior product seems foolish.  Do people hate Nintendo because the NES 'killed' the Atari?

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One of the most famous video game youtubers in Spain, a guy called Sasel, is a huge Sega fan and is constantly attacking Sony. He says he liked PS1 and PS2, but Sony started doing "bad things" since PS3. He is around 36 years old and the Dreamcast was one of his first consoles, so he's probably salty since then.

 

One of the most repeated anti-Sony arguments is that the bulk of its players are "casual" because they only play "FIFA and Call of Duty", as opposed to the games from Sega or Nintendo, which are "true games". Another common accusation is that Playstation games are often movies disguised as games, which is something I can't really disagree with.

 

However, the Xbox also does those things, so it's clear these guys love for the Xbox is more about how much they hate Sony since they killed Sega.

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"Diehard fans" of any platform usually hate at least one other console/microcomputer, it's in their DNA. This phenomena is by no means exclusive to Sega people. As for Sony, die hard fans of anything hate it in general, because it has barged into a well established scene out of nowhere and took over.

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I wasn't much a fan of the PS2 initially, but I eventually came around to it (honestly, it didn't take long--less than a year after the USA launch). Yeah, I was annoyed that people held off on the Dreamcast for it (because the DC was an amazing, flexible system at the time, it was affordable and more importantly, actually in stock at retail), and yeah, I wasn't impressed by its visuals or lineup initially. However, it quickly turned into an amazing platform and it didn't take long for it to solidify itself as a far more capable system than the Dreamcast.

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5 hours ago, Steven Pendleton said:

Sony did not kill Sega. Sega killed Sega.

 

Not entirely. Sega was really turning things around with the Dreamcast, at least here in the States. That said, there are many factors that resulted in the discontinuation of the system. Yes, Sega's previous bad decisions was a factor, but another major one was the hype for the PS2. The hype was unreal, to ridiculously idiotic levels that honestly hasn't been experienced since with a new console launch. Hype so great that, despite there already being this amazing system on the market with a couple hundred games and online play, people still held off for the PS2, even if it meant waiting another six to eight months to obtain one. It was stupid.

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I wouldn't say that waiting for system on which you could expect to play bigger-than-life franchises such as FF, MGS and Gran Tourismo (plus most likely a heap of new ones) was "idiotic" or "stupid". Not everybody could afford buying consoles on a whim (unlike now, when the demographic has shifted to include more people with incomes).

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17 minutes ago, youxia said:

I wouldn't say that waiting for system on which you could expect to play bigger-than-life franchises such as FF, MGS and Gran Tourismo (plus most likely a heap of new ones) was "idiotic" or "stupid". Not everybody could afford buying consoles on a whim (unlike now, when the demographic has shifted to include more people with incomes).

Many of these people waited because it was the cool thing to do, not because they were using their brains.

 

If I remember correctly, Sega discounted the Dreamcast to something crazy like $100 or so for that last holiday season it was on the market, yet people still waited. It was ludicrous.

Edited by Austin
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SEGA Killed SEGA...Us diehard SEGA fans can only hate SEGA and ourselves haha...Why they killed the Dreamcast when it was holding its own is beyond me, but the way they did it was even worse.   Becoming "software" only guys and giving up within 1 month, right after claiming (lying) that they would support Dreamcast for a full year (yeah right)...

 

That said, Sega fans, if they want to hate something hate Nintendo for the SNES/Genesis Wars,  not to mention their monopolistic practices against SEGA (And Atari) And their abuse of 3rd Party Devs which were "punished" with "Chip Shortages" if they made games for Genesis and NES.  SONY was viewed as the Champion that put Nintendo in their place following their surprise attack on SONY, when SONY developed the CD Add-On for SNES called The Nintendo "Play Station",  And then Nintendo jumped in bed with Philips behind their back to put out the God Awful CDI.  Nintendo made SONY look like fools at E3 (I believe it was) when they publicly abandoned the "Play Station" peripheral (previously) unbeknownst to SONY.

 

As many people had BOTH Genesis and SNES,  Also many people had BOTH SONY PS2 and Dreamcast;  As video game fans in general I think we were prepared to support both systems when SEGA gave up without a fight...

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Wasn't the ability to easily pirate DreamCast games also problematic for Sega? At that time, CD writers were more common place and affordable compared to the PC Engine/Sega CD days.

 

It seems like Sega did enough things to shot itself in the foot since the mid 90's to contribute to their exit from the hardware side of things. Yes, there was a lot of hype from Sony (remember "Toy Story" graphics... we still don't have those). The ability to play DVD discs was a killer feature though. It was our first DVD player.

 

I still enjoyed both systems. I still have a Dreamcast, but it is as dead as a door knocker. It is a Sega sports model, and I've intended to do a transplant, but not so much these days since games and controllers have gone to my son.

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I have reasons to dislike Sony and Microsoft and even Nintendo.

 

Sony because they developed a killer handheld like the Vita and let it rot, and because gimmicks like the Move, PSVR, the Vita’s horrible touch panels, and the PS5 controller gimmicks that ten games will ever use significantly and that the Switch did first, seem more important to them than games I care about. Also because they’re camping on an amazing historic Psygnosis library that really deserves more exposure. And because PS5 is not backwards compatible boo hoo hoo. My PS3 had better keep working forever.

 

Microsoft because they killed a lot of good studios and the Xbone had a travesty of a library.

 

Nintendo because they killed my favorite Japanese developers, Cing and Skip Ltd., and because their Switch success and the dwindling memory of Iwata seems to be leading to a lot of boring, mainstream games and not the weirdness I want in my gaming diet.

 

Sega is more to blame for Sega’s downfall than anybody else.

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I am a bigger SEGA fan than Atari fan. Although I did resent Sony for its competition, killing off the Saturn too early, it didn't stop me from buying a PS1, PS2, and PS4. And enjoying them all. 

 

Then the Dreamcast also was squashed but oh well. PS2 was my least favorite system among Dreamcast, GameCube, and Xbox. But I still owned them all. I remember the hilarious PS2 vs DC video, "what a disappointment!" :D

 

The public lost interest in Sega and spoke with their wallets. It did start with the 32X, or maybe with the Sega CD.  I loved my Sega CD, but I have friends who bought it later,  right when Sega was stopping support for it, and they felt burned.  Others felt burned by Saturn too but I didn't.  Concerning 32X, nobody else I knew ever bought one. 

 

But anyway, it is strange to keep holding a Sony grudge now. I'm much more disappointed with Sega, who don't seem to understand what a rich library they possess.  

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1 hour ago, Cafeman said:

I remember the hilarious PS2 vs DC video, "what a disappointment!" :D

 

It took me a while, but I was able to find that video. It was released by IGN (not sure if created by them) in May 2000.

 

 

In my case, the PS1 was my first home console and about a year after I bought it, the Dreamcast was announced. The hype was big but, when it finally came out in Europe almost 2 years later, I played it at the malls and was excited with the graphics, but I also noticed the controller felt harder to hold than the Dual Shock. A good friend of mine bought one and we played Virtua Tennis and some SNK/Capcom fighting games, but that's it. At one point I planned to buy it, but the PS1 had the soccer games, the party games... In the end, I decided not to save my weekly allowance to buy that console and simply marvel at its graphics, which were inspring back in 1998-2000.

 

So yeah, in the end it was a console with beautiful graphics but with a worse controller and less "must have" games for someone who's not into Shenmue or Sonic. The PS1 had its own Virtua Fighter, Daytonas and so forth, and sports and party games were generally better except for perhaps NBA 2K (but basketball games were never too popular in Spain).

Edited by IntelliMission
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One thing I would mention about the way (IMO) each company does things...While Nintendo relies on First Party Software, SEGA treated third parties right,  Microsoft threw money at each problem because they could, and SONY upon entering the video game market seemed to do their own thing,  I mean they were aware of the others, but seemed to look within. 

 

For example,  Nintendo had the NES controller;  PC Engine had roughly the same but with new variations, Sega had a near perfect controller for Genesis, when SNES came out and added shoulder buttons,  SONY then built off of that adding More shoulder buttons and eventually analog stocks until they reached Controller Perfection with the PS2 Dual Shock.  Other companies were clearly jealous because after PS2 almost every controller was like the Dual Shock, but ruined by putting the D-pad in the wrong spot and giving the sticks too much credit.  OK Sorry I'm a bit off on a tangent.

 

So,  give or take some inspiration from the others, SONY seemed to do their own thing.   When SEGA was IMO doing just fine with Dreamcast, if they would have just stayed the course they would have been fine or at very least stayed in the game for a while longer.  But rather than looking within and doing their own thing,  they kept looking at what SONY was doing. 

 

Now if they had stuck with the Dreamcast for, say, another year or so (maybe even a year and a half), they could have continued to sell software and would have made a profit...Then they could have decided whether or not they wanted to enter the console business again.  Very likely they would still have become "content providers" and not console makers, but you never know.  The mind can always reel with possibilities...I could imagine one alternate future where SEGA did the Nintendo thing and put out a console that was "powerful enough", but actually sold at a profit (for those of us who wanted a SEGA branded console again) and hosted First Party games, which I assume they would Also sell on other consoles,...So they could be console makers and software providers...Maybe have their cake and eat it too...

 

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2 hours ago, GoldLeader said:

One thing I would mention about the way (IMO) each company does things...While Nintendo relies on First Party Software, SEGA treated third parties right,  Microsoft threw money at each problem because they could, and SONY upon entering the video game market seemed to do their own thing,  I mean they were aware of the others, but seemed to look within. 

I think that sums up how I feel about modern high-powered consoles in general, beyond the Wii/PS3/Xbox 360 generation forward. From Odyssey 2 to the 2600 to the Vectrex to the TG16 to the SNES to the Jaguar to the Saturn to the Dreamcast to the Gamecube, almost every semi-successful system from almost every manufacturer had a kind of a personality to it. Even among third party games - for instance, an Activision 2600 game has a very different feel to an Activision Coleco game. The libraries seemed to attract certain groupings of standout games - the SNES was the RPG console, the Genesis was the run-and-gun shooter and sports console, the TG16 was the shmup console, and so on. Even the world-beating market titan systems - the NES, the PS1, the PS2, the Wii, the DS - had their certain feel to them that spanned across many games (and not just because of system gimmicks like motion controls and touch screens).

 

From the Xbone and PS4 to the Switch, and even on the Vita, I haven't felt that way. The Switch's library has so many PC ports (great ones for the most part) that it's been more about clearing my Steam backlog than playing the often janky but very personality-rich stuff that defined my Wii and Wii U and DS experiences. I suspect it's because of increasing use of cross-platform game frameworks like Unity, and because hardware limitations are sufficiently a thing of the past that any remaining limitations just seem bad instead of having a characteristic feel.

 

Which is even further from the topic. So anyway, Sega's titles were always suffused with the "house feel" to an extent that only Nintendo rivaled for three generations. That's what I miss the most about them.

Edited by jgkspsx
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Lol! Funny poll. I'm surprised actually by the results. Although Sony was arguably the main competition in the Saturn/PS1 and Dreamcast/PS2 era, I think most of us Sega fans lean towards Sony going forward, it has "harder" games, more exclusives. I find "sega" games on Nintendo weird (Panzer Dragoon remake... hmm) but also Microsoft X box is largely pointless if you have a PC.

 

Fifa and CoD is just one of those things you have to ignore, yes its for casuals, but the Sony library has a larger amount of variety. I'm surprised that people label Sony and not Nintendo as casual games (that's not to say that Nintendo players are casual players - quite the opposite they tend to be quite obsessed).

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On 11/23/2020 at 2:32 PM, Austin said:

Not entirely. Sega was really turning things around with the Dreamcast, at least here in the States. That said, there are many factors that resulted in the discontinuation of the system. Yes, Sega's previous bad decisions was a factor, but another major one was the hype for the PS2. The hype was unreal, to ridiculously idiotic levels that honestly hasn't been experienced since with a new console launch. Hype so great that, despite there already being this amazing system on the market with a couple hundred games and online play, people still held off for the PS2, even if it meant waiting another six to eight months to obtain one. It was stupid.

Absolutely. People should try to read what Kutaragi or even George Lucas said at the time about the PS2; it's hilarious. 🤦‍♂️ Even my elder sister who doesn't care about video games was confused about the Emotion Engine and assumed the PS2 would be "the first console to make you feel emotions". 😑

 

Also, the first PlayStation price war hurt SEGA a lot since Sony could afford losing money on it, unlike SEGA. Of course in the end it's just business, and SEGA couldn't afford it because of their past mistakes, but it's difficult not to hold a grudge against Sony for that as a fan. The Saturn/PlayStation battle was particularly sour to me because I was a teenager, at the moment of my life when I realized it wasn't always fair - actually life was almost never fair. 😔

Anyway, after the Dreamcast, I still held a grudge against Sony and chose the GameCube, because I had a lot of respect for Nintendo (one of my best friend was a Nintendo loyalist and we used to switch systems between us). My elder brother, who initially trusted Sony more than Microsoft, bought an Xbox because of the Jet Set Radio/SEGA GT bundle. He also bought a PS2 later... to play SEGA games. He only became a Nintendo fan with the Wii which had a lot of arcade-like games (light gun games especially). I finally bought my first Sony system in 2016, which was a PS4 slim, because my PC started to get old to play some AAA games. But after I played the Shadow of the Colossus remaster, I started God of War but quickly abandoned it. And from Spring 2018 until now I used my PS4 to watch Blu-rays and Netflix/Prime only. I recently purchased the RE2/RE3 bundle on sale and started playing the first one yesterday. I had forgotten how impressive the graphics were on some PS4 games, which helps me forgetting about the new generation. ;)

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Here's a funny Dreamcast Vs PS2 anecdote from 2001: One guy we used to know, who was the singer of a tiny grunge local band in Spain (he used to sing in English and had an English first name, I think his father was English/American), he was not a bad person but he clearly wanted to be "hard" and "cool" (typical 90s attitude). So one day, he made the following prediction using his characteristic "dude, I am an expert" tone: "The PS2 is going to be the end of Sony. It's going to be a disaster, the Dreamcast is going to destroy it."

 

I still had my PS1 around that time and, even if I didn't play nearly as much as in 1997-1999, I remember being confused by his words. Could it be the end of Sony after all the great moments the company gave to my 17-20 year old self? Does this guy really know what he's saying, with all the hype the PS2 is creating?

 

As I suspected, he was full of shit. But hey, the Dreamcast is still cool.

Edited by IntelliMission
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On 11/28/2020 at 12:07 PM, jgkspsx said:

Sony because they developed a killer handheld like the Vita and let it rot

Oh man, don't even get me started on its big-screen offspring, the PS TV. They burned a *lot* of people with that one. Sony makes some amazing hardware, but what they do with them in some cases is abominable at best.

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I don't hate any console makers. Nothing wrong with them trying to make their console become No.1, they are businesses after all.

 

I remember in a Dreamcast magazine that the people who wrote for it were always crying about big bad Sony, it just seemed childish to me.

 

I love the Dreamcast, didn't really have any plans on getting a PS2 as well at the time, but then when it was announced that the Dreamcast was going to stop being made, I thought it was a real shame, and that since there wont be any games being made for it anymore, maybe I should look into buying the PS2.

 

Eventually I saw advertisements for Gran Turismo 3 and GTA III, and I thought I've got to get me a PS2! And I'm so glad I did. I still love the Dreamcast though.

 

 

Edited by Ross PK
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