Video Capture on Monitor Port

[MrFSL]

Hello Atari Folks!!

 

I am trying to capture a video from the monitor output of my 800xl. My capture device works with every other analog device I can get my hands on --- but not either of my Ataris. I have tried capturing Composite as well as s-video. The picture is scrambled with lines or waves running through it baddly. I will attach a couple pictures. Anyone know what I am doing wrong here? 

 

[MrFSL]

Short video clip of the problem.

test.mkv

[Kitsune Sniper]

I had this same issue with the Sega Genesis.

 

 

Apparently the genesis outputs video that is just slightly different from a standard signal that some devices won't handle it properly. The only solution I found was to route the video through a VHS deck so it would stabilize the signal, and then feed that to my capture device.

[MrFSL]

1 minute ago, Kitsune Sniper said:

he only solution I found was to route the video through a VHS deck

I did that very thing! VHS plays back crystal clear --- atari is no change. --- But it plays back just fine on my television which is a modern Samsung LCD TV and a smaller LG TV I have as well.

 

 

[phaeron]

It looks like your video capture device or driver doesn't support non-interlaced video. It's interpreting all of the frames from the Atari as one field polarity of an interlaced frame, so the other field is never getting updated. Sometimes you can get around this by reducing the vertical resolution to 240 or 288 lines, if your driver and capture software support doing so.

 

[MrFSL]

Well the driver is the cx231xx - it does only support interlaced capture that is for sure. (The "Field" section has no other drop down option.) Any ideas on a work around?

 

 

 

 

 

[Rybags]

If there's no interlace mode setting and knocking resolution down doesn't work then that's probably about it.

 

Atari is nonstandard like most computers and consoles of that era.  Some modern devices just can't handle the signal properly.

Aside from not doing the fields with .5 of a scanline, the Atari also doesn't provide the short sync pulses halfway through the VSync scanlines, and also uses the same luma level for black and "blacker than black".

[MrFSL]

Well then that is that then --- probably not too big a deal. I see some really low price capture hardware out there for HDMI. I have a Sophia installed so I guess one of these will do the trick:

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B089F1S82P/?coliid=I1WNJ2E1J75LHD&colid=26V1G4XYNHXYB&psc=1&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it

 

https://www.amazon.com/Capture-Recording-Grabber-Camcorder-Windows/dp/B0888R8WTR/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

 

Thanks everyone for setting me straight!!

 

[Rybags]

You can buy USB capture devices on eBay for next to nothing - like 6 bucks.

 

The trick is though - find out what chipset yours uses and make sure you don't buy one with the same type otherwise you'll probably just get the same results.

[pseudografx]

I am looking for a cheap HDMI capture device myself (having RetroScaler 2x connected to my Atari), and I definitely want one that can do recording at full 50 fps (from my PAL Atari). RetroScaler 2x outputs 576p signal. I've seen USB 2.0 devices starting at about 10€ but I am really not sure they will record in 50 fps with good image quality.

[Gavin1968]

I am using a RetroTink and an Elgato HD60S and it works fine from the 8bit systems. I have used it on my Original 800, my 130XE and my 1200XL all stock machines and it looks great.

 

[MrFSL]

15 hours ago, Rybags said:

You can buy USB capture devices on eBay for next to nothing - like 6 bucks.

 

The trick is though - find out what chipset yours uses and make sure you don't buy one with the same type otherwise you'll probably just get the same results.

Well - if interlacing is the problem the DVI from the Sophia should work with most HDMI capture chips I would guess? If I am missing something here please let me know.

 

9 hours ago, pseudografx said:

I've seen USB 2.0 devices starting at about 10€ but I am really not sure they will record in 50 fps with good image quality.

The devices I linked above definitely won't work. I would be shocked if they reliably did 15 fps.  The junk composite capture interface that started this whole thread would have been good enough if there wasn't this very odd analog signal which only works on select devices. My LCD television works great. I have tried it now on a few and it doesn't work on them.

 

6 hours ago, Gavin1968 said:

am using a RetroTink and an Elgato HD60S and it works fine from the 8bit systems

I bet it works awesome --- you are just WAY WAY out of my price range. Good to know though for others that might trip across this thread.

 

Things are a bit tight financially with Xmas so soon. Perhaps after the holiday I will buy one of these super cheap deals on Amazon and post the results back here. I have a super inexpensive composite converter as well as the Sophia.

 

https://www.amazon.com/GANA-Composite-Converter-Adapter-Supporting/dp/B01L8GG6PW/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=GANA&qid=1608162974&sr=8-3

 

so I could try to capture from both - if I get around to it I will post back here.

[electronizer]

I have one of these; it worked fine to capture the composite output from an unmodded 800XL:

 

Diamond VC500 USB 2.0 One Touch VHS to DVD Video Capture Device

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000VM60I8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glc_fabc_JJ92FbCQG4QJ6

[MrFSL]

27 minutes ago, electronizer said:

I have one of these; it worked fine to capture the composite output from an unmodded 800XL:

 

Diamond VC500 USB 2.0 One Touch VHS to DVD Video Capture Device

 

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000VM60I8/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glc_fabc_JJ92FbCQG4QJ6

This is the exact capture device I am having problems with. Absolutely exact. I have tried it against 2 different Atari 800xl both show the noise pattern above.

[+bob1200xl]

I have a VC500. Works OK if you just run LUMA. Major 'jail bars' on composite.. This could be my cable. Fails on a 1200XL or an 800.

 

Bob

 

[MrFSL]

I suppose the manufacturer could have different chips inside them. 

[electronizer]

bob1200xl’s comment reminded me that I also ended up capturing from the luma output, which gave a nice, sharp picture. I may be remembering incorrectly, but I’m pretty sure the composite capture was still usable, just more blurry. I’ll have to dig out the setup I was using and try again.

 

Not sure if it makes a difference, but I wasn’t using the fancy video editing software included with the device. I got my VC500 as a freebie with a VCR I bought some time ago, and there was no software or key included. I used Diamond’s basic capture tool that’s free to download online.

[pseudografx]

On 12/17/2020 at 12:58 AM, MrFSL said:

The devices I linked above definitely won't work. I would be shocked if they reliably did 15 fps.  The junk composite capture interface that started this whole thread would have been good enough if there wasn't this very odd analog signal which only works on select devices. My LCD television works great. I have tried it now on a few and it doesn't work on them.

I took the risk and ordered one priced at 8€. According to youtube reviews it should be capable of 720p@50/60. I will report when it arrives.

[flashjazzcat]

I still use one like this:

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Ex-Pro-Grabber-Editor-capture-Windows/dp/B001HB9C1O

 

Unfortunately, there are unpredictable minor revisions between models; I bought a couple, and one only works with NTSC Ataris. The other one works with anything, though, and the s-video quality is pretty good.

 

[MrFSL]

3 hours ago, pseudografx said:

I took the risk and ordered one priced at 8€. According to youtube reviews it should be capable of 720p@50/60. I will report when it arrives.

Wow cool! --- I asked for one for Christmas myself; being inexpensive it gives my kids something they can get their father which isn't a terrible neck tie or another pair of gloves. I could open a glove shop with all the unworn gloves of Christmas past. I can't wait until the children are grown so I can gift them back the same gloves. LOL.

 

I just do not think these will do what the OP wants in terms of FPS.

 

2 hours ago, flashjazzcat said:

Unfortunately, there are unpredictable minor revisions between models; I bought a couple, and one only works with NTSC Ataris.

Yeah - the q & a on amazon mention the revisions; specifically saying the new one won't run on Linux. Not for anything, but unable to run in Linux usually tells me it isn't a good device even if it is my intention to run it in Windows. These days think - what could be the dependencies that would stop a video capture device from running in another operating system? --- Probably the same dependencies that will make this not work with the next version or update of Windows.

 

Besides, I don't think I have a Windows machine running currently... perhaps I could do a usb pass-through on the Windows Virtual Machine.... meh.

 

[MrFSL]

Cool!

 

Got this one for a Xmas present from the wife:

 

https://www.amazon.com/Capture-Recording-Grabber-Camcorder-Windows/dp/B0888R8WTR/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

 

 

Though it claims it can capture up to 60 fps with MJPG it is reality can't do past 30fps without dropping 50% of the frames. The other native capture format is YUYV but that is limited to 20 fps.

 

So it runs great in Linux. Works great with the Sophia rev C. There is no delay if using it as a remote viewer (Atari in a window on my laptop.) 

 

[+Larry]

On 12/17/2020 at 7:05 PM, bob1200xl said:

I have a VC500. Works OK if you just run LUMA. Major 'jail bars' on composite.. This could be my cable. Fails on a 1200XL or an 800.

 

Bob

 

Hi Bob-

How would you rate the software?  And can you use it with Win10?  Fixed picture size or scalable?  From my own experience, most of these less expensive units that I've tried fall apart with their software.  Could you post a screen shot or two?

[pseudografx]

So my HDMI video grabber has arrived today and so far I am quite happy with it. No issues with recording in 576p@50fps (720p@50 should also work). Image quality is fine. Example clip attached.

There are a few minor issue, such as slight echo in the audio for whatever reason, but hopefully I will sort that out. Also, the aspect ratio is a bit off, but that can be fixed in post-processing.

Overall, not too bad for an 8€ device!