BASIC 10 Liner Contest 2021

[Preppie]

Full list of Atari entries, unless there's any last minute entries not added to the folder yet:

 

Patrol
Nanorogue
Hubert
JUMP
The Children
Mandelbrot Set Explorer
AstroInvaders
Purge
Fuji Golf
Noxious
Crasher
Floh
Rockfall
The Matrix Red Pill
The Matrix Red or Blue

 

 

 

Most entries:

 

1st C64 = 30

2nd MSX = 18

=3rd Atari 15

=3rd Spectrum 15

Edited March 27, 2021 by Preppie

[vitoco]

33 minutes ago, carlsson said:

I forgot the deadline. ?

It almost happens to me. On Thursday, I read somewhere else about the deadline, and I had to go to the Wix site to confirm. I had to write the docs for 3 entries in 2 days, which I'd planned to do this weekend.

 

Of course, while I was doing that, I found bugs or things that I could do better... and changed them!!!

 

If this there are no more entries in @Bunsen's mailbox, those 15 entries are the 10% of 144 total.

 

5 hours ago, erichenneke said:

It's great to see how successful and popular this annual event has become, but I do wish there was a better Atari presence. It originated as an Atari-only event after all!

I'm missing an entry from @Savetz ?

 

This year, there are many very interesiting non-Atari games I'd like to try. It will be hard for Atari entries to get a place at the podium in all the categories.

 

[erichenneke]

5 hours ago, vitoco said:

I'm missing an entry from @Savetz ?

Yeah, no entry from Kay.    

 

5 hours ago, vitoco said:

This year, there are many very interesiting non-Atari games I'd like to try. It will be hard for Atari entries to get a place at the podium in all the categories.

Well, I just ignore anything else other than Atari. 

 

Just kidding (sort of).  There really ARE a lot of cool looking entries on other systems this year. 

I actually have a couple or C-64 systems (yes, blasphemy! I know.) that I acquired purely out of curiosity, but I never use them really...just collecting dust.  This will give me a reason to turn them on! 

 

[+Philsan]

@Preppie Craig's Rockfall 10liner is another FastBasic's gem.

[Preppie]

43 minutes ago, Philsan said:

@Preppie Craig's Rockfall 10liner is another FastBasic's gem.

Thanks   From what I've seen so far, Vics 'The Children' is gonna take some beating.

 

 

[vitoco]

8 hours ago, erichenneke said:

I actually have a couple or C-64 systems (yes, blasphemy! I know.) that I acquired purely out of curiosity, but I never use them really...just collecting dust.  This will give me a reason to turn them on! 

A friend, who is fan of C=64, gave me a SoC some years ago, trying to convert me!!! It is a plug&play joystick that I've used from time to time, just trying to understand the design of that line of computers (when I see @8bitguy1 related videos). I really like the SIO architecture and the OS of our Ataris!!!  BTW, I was told that the SoC could be modded to make it read from SD cards or something like that...

 

2 hours ago, Philsan said:

@Preppie Craig's Rockfall 10liner is another FastBasic's gem.

Yes... another bit of code I'd like to see!

 

"Crasher" is also using, not one, but two asteroid-like ships. I'm curious about that!!!

 

"Floh" seems to be a port of the same author from the 2020´s MSX entry with the same name. Also curious...

 

[carlsson]

On 3/7/2021 at 2:57 AM, carlsson said:

Comx-35 BASIC doesn't seem to like A=(RND<0.5) or PRINT 1=2 at all.

For various reasons, I got back to this today and realized that A=(RND<0.5) can be replaced by A=SGN(SGN(RND-0.5)-1) if we assume that TRUE=-1 and FALSE=0. Obviously one would swap around the sign if the expression was based on that TRUE=1. This would be a rather simple expression, but the question is if there is an even smarter solution?

 

Besides the phenomenon to not accept truth values for assignments or printing seems to be common for all BASICs based on Quest Super BASIC by Ron Cenker. It means the same behavior appears on Comx-35, Pecom 32/64, Telmac 1800, various Cosmac Vip and the never released RCA Studio IV plus others in this family of 1802 based computers. I haven't investigated if there are alternative BASIC dialects for these, and this peculiar omission is something I haven't found anywhere else, not even EDU-BASIC on the Interact.

[vitoco]

On 4/1/2021 at 10:26 AM, carlsson said:

A=(RND<0.5) can be replaced by A=SGN(SGN(RND-0.5)-1) if we assume that TRUE=-1 and FALSE=0.

Quite smart expression!

 

 

I went to the contest site an found that there were two extra entries. The new total is 146 submissions:

PLATFORM                     EXTREM-256  PUR-120  PUR-80  SCHAU  WILD   TOTAL
Acorn Electron / BBC Micro                            1                    1
Amstrad CPC                        2         2               1             5
Apple //                                              1             5      6
Apple II                           1                                       1
Atari 2600                                   1                             1
Atari 800 XL                       5         6        3      1      1     16
BBC Micro                                    2        4                    6
C64                                          1        1                    2
Commodore 128                                2                             2
Commodore 16 / Plus/4              1         2        6                    9
Commodore 64                       1         2       20      5            28
Commodore 64/128                                             1             1
Commodore PET 2001                                    1                    1
Commodore VIC 20                                      2                    2
Commodore VIC20                              1        1                    2
Mattel Aquarius                                       3      1             4
MSX                                6                         2             8
MSX 1/2                            1                                       1
MSX 2                              5         1                             6
MSX2                               1                                       1
MSX2+                              1                  1                    2
Ohio Scientific Challenger 1P                         1                    1
Oric Atmos                                            5                    5
SAM Coupé                                    1        1                    2
Sharp MZ 80K                                          1                    1
Sharp MZ-80A                                          3                    3
Sinclair ZX 81                                        2      2             4
Sinclair ZX Spectrum               2         1        7      3      3     16
Tandy TRS-80 M100                            1                             1
Tandy TRS-80 MC10                  3         3        1                    7
Videoton TV Computer                                  1                    1
TOTAL                             29        26       66     16     9     146

This is a raw copy of the data from the listing in the web page, so there are some repeated platforms spelled differently.

 

One of the new ones is the original DLI version of "Golf in Mt. Fuji" from @OxC0FFEE but in the WILD category, and the other is a ZX Spectrum game for the PUR-80 category.

 

 

[carlsson]

By the way, I had a brief look into The BASIC Handbook by David A. Lien, but I didn't find much about truth values except for the obvious IF statements. At one point he suggests that some BASIC dialects use + and * as logical operators:

 

IF (A=6) + (B=4) THEN PRINT"AND TEST WORKS"

IF (A=6) * (B=4) THEN PRINT"OR TEST WORKS"

 

Unfortunately on the majority of dialects these tests will work the other way around, i.e. 1+0, 0+1 or 1+1 all are non-zero but in the case of 1*0, 0*1 or 1*1 only the later case it would yield a non-zero result. He never mentions on which systems you can expect + to be AND and * to be OR, and if a such system ever is encountered, it would confuse the bejeezus out of people trying to understand or port the program as the logic would be swapped around from what we know, whether or not our truth is 1 or -1.

[erichenneke]

1 hour ago, vitoco said:

Quite smart expression!

 

 

I went to the contest site an found that there were two extra entries. The new total is 146 submissions:

PLATFORM                     EXTREM-256  PUR-120  PUR-80  SCHAU  WILD   TOTAL
Acorn Electron / BBC Micro                            1                    1
Amstrad CPC                        2         2               1             5
Apple //                                              1             5      6
Apple II                           1                                       1
Atari 2600                                   1                             1
Atari 800 XL                       5         6        3      1      1     16
BBC Micro                                    2        4                    6
C64                                          1        1                    2
Commodore 128                                2                             2
Commodore 16 / Plus/4              1         2        6                    9
Commodore 64                       1         2       20      5            28
Commodore 64/128                                             1             1
Commodore PET 2001                                    1                    1
Commodore VIC 20                                      2                    2
Commodore VIC20                              1        1                    2
Mattel Aquarius                                       3      1             4
MSX                                6                         2             8
MSX 1/2                            1                                       1
MSX 2                              5         1                             6
MSX2                               1                                       1
MSX2+                              1                  1                    2
Ohio Scientific Challenger 1P                         1                    1
Oric Atmos                                            5                    5
SAM Coupé                                    1        1                    2
Sharp MZ 80K                                          1                    1
Sharp MZ-80A                                          3                    3
Sinclair ZX 81                                        2      2             4
Sinclair ZX Spectrum               2         1        7      3      3     16
Tandy TRS-80 M100                            1                             1
Tandy TRS-80 MC10                  3         3        1                    7
Videoton TV Computer                                  1                    1
TOTAL                             29        26       66     16     9     146

This is a raw copy of the data from the listing in the web page, so there are some repeated platforms spelled differently.

 

One of the new ones is the original DLI version of "Golf in Mt. Fuji" from @OxC0FFEE but in the WILD category, and the other is a ZX Spectrum game for the PUR-80 category.

 

 

okay, so we have 16 entries that REALLY matter!     

 

Go Atari !!

 

[AMSDOS]

14 hours ago, vitoco said:

I went to the contest site an found that there were two extra entries. The new total is 146 submissions:

PLATFORM                     EXTREM-256  PUR-120  PUR-80  SCHAU  WILD   TOTAL
Acorn Electron / BBC Micro                            1                    1
Amstrad CPC                        2         2               1             5
Apple //                                              1             5      6
Apple II                           1                                       1
Atari 2600                                   1                             1
Atari 800 XL                       5         6        3      1      1     16
BBC Micro                                    2        4                    6
C64                                          1        1                    2
Commodore 128                                2                             2
Commodore 16 / Plus/4              1         2        6                    9
Commodore 64                       1         2       20      5            28
Commodore 64/128                                             1             1
Commodore PET 2001                                    1                    1
Commodore VIC 20                                      2                    2
Commodore VIC20                              1        1                    2
Mattel Aquarius                                       3      1             4
MSX                                6                         2             8
MSX 1/2                            1                                       1
MSX 2                              5         1                             6
MSX2                               1                                       1
MSX2+                              1                  1                    2
Ohio Scientific Challenger 1P                         1                    1
Oric Atmos                                            5                    5
SAM Coupé                                    1        1                    2
Sharp MZ 80K                                          1                    1
Sharp MZ-80A                                          3                    3
Sinclair ZX 81                                        2      2             4
Sinclair ZX Spectrum               2         1        7      3      3     16
Tandy TRS-80 M100                            1                             1
Tandy TRS-80 MC10                  3         3        1                    7
Videoton TV Computer                                  1                    1
TOTAL                             29        26       66     16     9     146

 

 

I don't know how I missed that other EXTREM-256 Amstrad entry, though I'm only really competing with myself and my 2019 Entry. ?

[Preppie]

Quote

with awards on Saturday, April 10.

Is there a livestream of the awards?  What bat-time and bat-channel?

 

[vitoco]

1 hour ago, Preppie said:

Is there a livestream of the awards?  What bat-time and bat-channel?

We might ask @skr, as he did it last year.

 

Spoiler

 

 

Unfortunately, I do not use social networks, and I didn't know about that until it was published in the forum.

 

Spoiler

 

 

NOTE: I hide last year's links to avoid a confusion...

 

[carlsson]

Just seen on Twitter. It looks like there may not be a streaming event as Sascha does not have a voice right now.

 

[vitoco]

Oh... I hope @skr recovers from his ill.

 

Following that Twitter link (using a web browser), I found that one of the judges did some streams while reviewing the games.

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/978076391

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/969418408

 

Nice, but with bad news (at least for me): He is using emulators for every machine, including for the Atari games. And it is worst (also for me): NTSC. Most of my games are for PAL machines. I've included NTSC versions on the disks, but they are not seen.

 

OK, there is a lot of work testing 144 (146) entries, and the details are being obviously omitted for easy testing... Well, lets see what happens.

 

 

[erichenneke]

1 hour ago, vitoco said:

Oh... I hope @skr recovers from his ill.

 

Following that Twitter link (using a web browser), I found that one of the judges did some streams while reviewing the games.

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/978076391

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/969418408

 

Nice, but with bad news (at least for me): He is using emulators for every machine, including for the Atari games. And it is worst (also for me): NTSC. Most of my games are for PAL machines. I've included NTSC versions on the disks, but they are not seen.

 

OK, there is a lot of work testing 144 (146) entries, and the details are being obviously omitted for easy testing... Well, lets see what happens.

 

 

Yes, that was a bit painful to watch "our babies" submitted to that, especially at first!  

 

Happy he got Basic working finally.  That would have kind of made it hard for him to judge the PUR-80 entries without that. 

 

Yeah, I agree though.  With so many entries to judge across so many systems it almost guarantees they will need to use emulation.  And I imagine the judges can't spend much, if any, time learning any nuances of each games.  Not even the fundamentals of each game really, much less strategies and more subtle behaviors which are intended to make the games a deeper and more rewarding experience once the player "settles in" for a bit of extended play. 

 

Hmmm.  That's tough.  No doubt a VERY challenging workload for judges to tackle.   

 

Maybe a new category is needed called "Games that are only to be played for 10 seconds".  Ha!

 

 

[erichenneke]

On 3/22/2021 at 1:13 AM, erichenneke said:

Here's a teaser GIF of my PUR-80 (Atari BASIC) entry I'm finishing up called "Purge".  Just doing all the proper DOCs now.

 

 

Also attaching the user instructions.

 

I'll post the code soon.  

 

-Eric

 

 

As promised, here is my PUR-80 entry called "Purge".

 

 

ZIP file contains an autorun ATR image as well as the user instructions(with some hints)  and code walk-through docs. 

 

Boot on XL/XE machine with Basic on of course. 

 

-Eric

PURGE.zip

 

PURGE.ATR PURGEP80.LIS

[AMSDOS]

When I submitted my game I added extra detail about the problems or challenges while making it, so when the judges come to adjudicate my game, those explainations would clarify uncertainites.Of course any problems which I would of needed help with are also mentioned in my document.

[carlsson]

Hm, are you indicating that your BASIC games are so technically advanced that not even the latest crop of emulators properly run them, or are those simply tuned for CRT artifacts that normally don't show up if the emulator is set to perfect crisp pixels?

[Preppie]

4 minutes ago, carlsson said:

Hm, are you indicating that your BASIC games are so technically advanced that not even the latest crop of emulators properly run them, or are those simply tuned for CRT artifacts that normally don't show up if the emulator is set to perfect crisp pixels?

Apart from the PAL/NTSC problem one of Vics games is designed for paddles.

[carlsson]

Aha. I never looked into if/how emulators handle paddles but I know as much as since I don't own a pair myself, I skipped all paddle games previously when we played through them all in the High Score Challenge. Or well, I do own a single Coleco Gemini controller so I got 1 paddle for one of the directions, but most need 2 paddles for both X and Y.

[AMSDOS]

I had an old DOS Atari 2600 Emulator (PCAE I think it was called), which handled paddles through the Mouse without any hassle.

[vitoco]

I could reproduce in my real PAL Atari the problem that Josh had in his MiSTer FPGA with my "Red or Blue?" TurboBasic XL game:

 

 

This game uses graphics mode 28 (12+16). It is the ANTIC 4 mode built in the XL/XE without a text window, a full 5 color 40x24 screen which it is changed to a 32x24 by touching a system register.

 

The trick I used in this game to scroll the data is that I modified the display list of that graphics mode in order to point to a buffer in lower memory that it is managed by the game. This change is done using a DPOKE statement directly into the memory address where the vector should be after the GRAPHICS 28 statement is performed, but it seems that the emulator has a different OS ROM and the vector was moved in memory by one byte!!! I could not identify which OS ROM is the MiSTer using. I tried some I had in Altirra and I always got the display list where it should be, and the program run OK.

 

I guess that the solution is simple for the MiSTer: just change "DPOKE 48004,$8800" to "DPOKE DPEEK(560)+4,$8800" in line 2. This cannot be done easily in the (emulated) Atari, because the line was entered while it was abbreviated and it expands to more than 120 chars (3 lines) when LISTed. It can be retyped using abbreviations, and there is enough space for that in the line...

 

... but it seems it's too late ? 

 

[dmsc]

Hi!

1 hour ago, vitoco said:

I could reproduce in my real PAL Atari the problem that Josh had in his MiSTer FPGA with my "Red or Blue?" TurboBasic XL game:

 

 

This game uses graphics mode 28 (12+16). It is the ANTIC 4 mode built in the XL/XE without a text window, a full 5 color 40x24 screen which it is changed to a 32x24 by touching a system register.

 

The trick I used in this game to scroll the data is that I modified the display list of that graphics mode in order to point to a buffer in lower memory that it is managed by the game. This change is done using a DPOKE statement directly into the memory address where the vector should be after the GRAPHICS 28 statement is performed, but it seems that the emulator has a different OS ROM and the vector was moved in memory by one byte!!! I could not identify which OS ROM is the MiSTer using. I tried some I had in Altirra and I always got the display list where it should be, and the program run OK.

 

I guess that the solution is simple for the MiSTer: just change "DPOKE 48004,$8800" to "DPOKE DPEEK(560)+4,$8800" in line 2. This cannot be done easily in the (emulated) Atari, because the line was entered while it was abbreviated and it expands to more than 120 chars (3 lines) when LISTed. It can be retyped using abbreviations, and there is enough space for that in the line...

 

... but it seems it's too late ? 

 

 

Watching the video, it was not the only weird problem in the setup - other games also did not work.

 

Also, while loading TBXL, the screen got corrupted at the end of the loading - that does not happen in a real Atari.

 

Have Fun!

[vitoco]

55 minutes ago, dmsc said:

I could reproduce in my real PAL Atari the problem that Josh had in his MiSTer FPGA with my "Red or Blue?" TurboBasic XL game:

1 hour ago, dmsc said:

Also, while loading TBXL, the screen got corrupted at the end of the loading - that does not happen in a real Atari.

You are right and I was wrong. It was not the pointer for the data inside the display list the one that it was moved. The problem was that the Atari BASIC cartridge was there overwritting the display list even when Josh tried to disable it in MiSTer menu.

 

I've attached the Atari BASIC cartridge to Altirra in a way that TurboBasic XL couldn't disable it by setting bits into PORTB, and this was the result:

 

 

It is the same screen that Josh got!!!! (except that mine has PAL colors, with a red "red" instead an orange one that it is displayed on NTSC computers/emulators)

 

So, there is a config conflict in MiSTer... The suggested change for line 2 would not have any effect the result.

 

9 hours ago, Preppie said:

Apart from the PAL/NTSC problem one of Vics games is designed for paddles.

He could emulate the paddle for my "Noxious" game using a mouse, but I have to say that the experience of that game is very different (and better) when a real paddle is used.