Sony TU-1041U TV Tuner

[Lamprey]

Hi,

 

I've been running my RF consoles through a VCR to my CRT TV as my TV will not sync well enough and will only display Black & White for all my consoles. I recently picked up a Sony TU-1041U RF Demodulator/tuner. Using the "fine" tuning feature I am able to get it to produce color, but without messing with it, it always shows black and white. So, every time I turn a console on/off or switch consoles I have to fine tune every time.

 

I read through the manual, but I don't see anyway to retain that "fine" tuned setting. Is there a way to save the setting or some way to "dial in the default" in some way (like opening the case and adjusting a pot or something)?

 

Or is that just how it is or, possibly, the one I have isn't working right?

 

Thanks!

[+H454]

How many and what consoles do you have?

The B&W problem on two different tuners leads me to say its not the tuners.

[Lamprey]

I have a several:

• Atari 2600 Light Sixer is my main one. But, I also have a Heavy Sixer, 4 switch woody, Vader and a Jr. 
• Atati 5200 (4 port and 2 port)
• Atari 7800
• Atari Pong (6 different versions)
• Atari Pinball 
• Colecovision
• For grins I've also tried my NES and SNES using their RF out.

I have a 19" Panasonic TV in my garage that I use for testing and they all work just fine on the RF input on that. Not to muddy the water, but I also have a portable TV with a 5" crt screen and I have to use its "fine tuning" feature to get color like the Sony TU-1041U. 

 

Anything you might suggest I try to help eliminate potential problems?

[emerson]

If I understand correctly, you are having trouble getting color through both rf and composite video inputs? It almost sounds like your crt is having trouble syncing itself with the color burst frequency of the video signal.

[Lamprey]

2 hours ago, emerson said:

If I understand correctly, you are having trouble getting color through both rf and composite video inputs? It almost sounds like your crt is having trouble syncing itself with the color burst frequency of the video signal.

Yes and no.

 

Using my TVs RF input, it is unable to get a color signal. Using any non-RF input doesn't seem to have an issue.

 

Using the Sony TU-1041U RF Demodulator/tuner it produces a B&W signal via its composite output. But, I can use a fine tuning adjustment to get color.

 

I'll try using the Sony TU-1041U on a different TV and see if the TV is causing some issue.

[Lamprey]

I just did a check and using the Sony TU-1041U hooked to my 19" Panasonic composite input and it seems to work just great. But, still the same issue with my 36" Sony. So, perhaps it is a color burst frequency sync issue. I just tried on the front input, so I'll try using the ones on the back and see if that changes anything. It is odd that every other composite device (ie. NES) work just fine.

 

Assuming it is a color burst frequency sync issue, is there anyway to make it better (replacing capacitors or some adjustment or.. )?

[emerson]

This is a tough one. I dont see a quick/easy fix here. Just curious, have you tried a uhf amplifier before the demodulator?

 

I just read this which matches the issues you are having. For what it's worth your symptoms are expected, at least according to this person. https://atariage.com/forums/topic/189464-where-can-one-get-an-rf-demodulator/page/2/?tab=comments#comment-2910837

[Lamprey]

I have not tried an amplifier. I guess I could give it shot and see what happens.

 

Thanks for the link. That's discouraging, but at least I can still use my VCR. I guess I'll keep an eye out for a different TV...

 

Appreciate the help!

[+H454]

Are you using any old school rf switch boxes or switches?

Like this happens when - say you just hookup just a 2600 with a RCA to F-type (coax) adapter to the TV or the sony unit?

Any difference between using CH 3 or 4 - or 2 or 3 on older 2600s.

Is you stuff all from the same country too?

 

This problem your having Is pretty strange.

Most of the digital tuners from the 90's (like your sony thing), work great for this kind of thing.

Hell, My 1991 Phillips 19" has a great RF tuner, I have a PS3 tuned to CH 3 right now. Streaming older tv shows on thing look great.

My Model 1 genesis looks as good as composite on that tv.

 

You've got a real head scratcher.

[Lamprey]

I'm not using any of the old RF switch boxes, just an RCA to F-type adapter. I'm trying to remember if I tried an old RF switch box. I'm pretty sure I did when I was initial testing this a while back. I was attempting to play pong via the Antenna input and it was B&W. At first I didn't think anything of it. Then I was like, hold on I thought it was supposed to have a color gradient. Then I tested it on my 19" tv and, sure enough the colored background was there. I tried out an old VCR I had and although when I first turn it on I get B&W output, if I go to the VCR menu and exit out I get color on the TV. That works. It's not perfect, but OK. So I picked up the  Sony TU-1041U tuner, hoping it would be a better solution. Unfortunately, it wasn't (on this TV). 

 

I haven't tried messing with the channels. I can certainly give that a shot and see if anything changes.

 

As far as I know all my Atari stuff is from the US. I have several Nintendo consoles also and some are US and some are from Japan. I don't use the RF on the Nintendo consoles normally, but I have tried them using the RF output just to see what happens. I can try retesting those with RF to verify if they produce the same result as the Atari consoles.

 

Yeah, I was/am pretty perplexed too. When this TV didn't get color via it's RF input, I just figured it was a bit newer than the 80's TVs and the tolerance for syncing to a channel was tighter or something. But, even having issues with a signal converted to composite is a new one to me. Now that I know a little more about the issue I can try some other things (like a Amplifier) and see if anything helps.

Edited April 27, 2021 by Lamprey
Clarification

[emerson]

Some old rf switch boxes have impedance matching components inside that convert the 300 ohm antenna impedance to the 75 or 50 ohm coaxial cable impedance. Usually it's a few turns of wire wrapped around a ferrite core paired with small value capacitors. I wonder if that would help. Are you able to select input impedance on your demodulator? Do your consoles produce color through rf input using one of those switch boxes?

[Lamprey]

I did a quick check with an old switch box and it didn't seem to change anything.

 

If the demodulator has the ability to select impedance I'm not aware of it. 

[+H454]

You should read this:

Why is my TI-99/4A in Black and White?

https://www.pagetable.com/?p=672

 

So, you can try tuning the modulator in the individual consoles using tools like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/PACK-OF-2-Velleman-VTPT-6-Piece-Plastic-ALIGNMENT-TOOL-and-Tuning-Needle-Set/282051047122

 

And if that doesn't work, replace the crystals.

 

Or, you can get a cheap old VCR style tuner (with out the tape part). Those have memory buttons tuned with a little knob - making the "tuning" permanent.

something like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/193409251514

 

[Lamprey]

Thanks for the link to the TI-99/4A blog. Good read!

 

I had a Pong that was partially disassembled, so I was able to hook it up and adjusted the variable inductor. I was able to adjust it to the point where the TV would produce a color signal. However, turning the Pong off and on made it black and white again. Unfortunately, that doesn't seem to work the way I want...

 

I might track down some crystals and test on a Pong. But, at that point It'd be easier to get a TV that can handle Atari video signals (like my Panasonic does).

[+H454]

Are you using metal tool do the adjustments?

If you are trying to do the adjustment with the power ON, plastic tool need to be used.

Metal tools have interference issues when used on live units.

You can use them, but in tiny adjustments with it off.

[Lamprey]

No, I have plastic tools.

 

I come from more of an arcade background. Although, I'm not an expert, I can cap monitors, rejuvenate them, adjust convergence & focus, etc.. Basic tune-up stuff. Because of the time spent restoring arcade machines, I have some of the tools needed for other areas, like adjusting a variable inductor in a Pong. I just wish I had a better understanding of TVs.. 

[+H454]

Console5.com sells cap kit for a lot of consoles.

You may want to try a cap kit and voltage regulator on like a 2600, then a crystal.

 

Old age and being stored in hot closets, attics and garages can take there toll on caps. Long periods of non-use isn't great for caps either.

I've had some "junk" 2600 change color pallet or go from almost no color to normal after warming up.

[Lamprey]

Yeah, the Light Sixer that is my main 2600 I use and has been capped and the voltage regulator replaced. The signal from that 2600 is very clean. But, it may need a crystal to work with my current TV.

 

I'm on the hunt for a new TV.

[+H454]

If you like RF, Keep an eye out for 90's Phillips or Magnavox tvs. Their tuners are fantastic. -great picture.

If you lived in MN, I have one I'd give you.