guSTaw Posted May 21, 2021 Share Posted May 21, 2021 Great news!!! Next games Bitmap Brothers: Chaos Engine 2, Z ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 21, 2021 Share Posted May 21, 2021 4 hours ago, guSTaw said: Great news!!! Next games Bitmap Brothers: Chaos Engine 2, Z ? Z was a PC game, right? Interesting that The Chaos Engine 2 only ever released on the Amiga. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cobra Kai Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Was The Chaos Engine renamed Soldiers of Fortune for the US (SNES/GEN)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+CyranoJ Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 4 minutes ago, Cobra Kai said: Was The Chaos Engine renamed Soldiers of Fortune for the US (SNES/GEN)? Yes, it was. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 8 hours ago, CyranoJ said: Yes, it was. Yeah, always wondered what the logic behind name changes like this is. Another World became Out of this World, for example. The Chaos Engine is what I knew it as, as I played it first on the Amiga. I think Leander's name was changed to something else as well... Galahad. An odd choice for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evisu Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Awesome news. Gods is really a great platform action game. It´s not easy, but if you learn the patterns... And I loved Chaos Engine on the Amiga. Guess, I have to order them both 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 13 minutes ago, evisu said: Awesome news. Gods is really a great platform action game. It´s not easy, but if you learn the patterns... And I loved Chaos Engine on the Amiga. Guess, I have to order them both I have the Gods intro music as my ring tone on my phone. Never have beaten the game though... it is rather difficult. The Amiga version only uses one button, so you have to switch between items by crouching. Genesis version doesn't do that. Question is, with the Jag port, is that an option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlidellMan Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Fun fact about The Chaos Engine 2: A Genesis/Mega Drive port was completed, but not released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldSchoolRetroGamer Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, SlidellMan said: Fun fact about The Chaos Engine 2: A Genesis/Mega Drive port was completed, but not released. Was it? Last I heard only 1 level was completed. From a 2017 video demonstration "The full game of Engine 2 was only released on the Amiga and sadly it wasn't in the same league as the original, the gameplay had changed, the rules had changed, the graphics had changed and sadly that resulted in this sequel not being fondly remembered. Only 1 level of this game exists on the Megadrive / Genesis which is shown here before the software house decided to pull the plug." To be clear, I am not saying you are wrong, this is just the info I have but if it was completed that great, especially if a full rom is available somewhere? Edited May 23, 2021 by OldSchoolRetroGamer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlidellMan Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Oh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoboz Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, OldSchoolRetroGamer said: The full game of Engine 2 was only released on the Amiga and sadly it wasn't in the same league as the original Yes I played the Amiga AGA version of Chaos Engine 2, and it was a big disappointment. Chaos Engine (1) is a much better game that was ported to multiple platforms. Even if Chaos Engine 2 was an AGA game (supposedly more colors), didn't even look as good as the standard version of Chaos Engine (1). Edited May 24, 2021 by phoboz 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 32 minutes ago, phoboz said: Yes I played the Amiga AGA version of Chaos Engine 2, and it was a big disappointment. Chaos Engine (1) is a much better game that was ported to multiple platforms. Even if Chaos Engine 2 was an AGA game (supposedly more colors), didn't even look as good as the standard version of Chaos Engine (1). On the otherhand, the AGA version of Chaos Engine (1) does have some more colors and looks pretty sweet. Question is, which version is the Jag one going to be based upon? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoboz Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 hours ago, leech said: Question is, which version is the Jag one going to be based upon? I guess @CyranoJ knows the reply to this, Atari ST port, or Amiga AGA port? The second one would a new thing for the Jaguar homebrew community, so my guess it's the first one. However, I've seen a video showing that it would not be a straight port, rather there was some improved music for the intro. In the game I would really like to hear the original Amiga music for "the Forest", as it is still stuck in my mind to this day. (I never player the Atari ST version, so I don't know which music is there, but on the Amiga it's probably ProTracker MOD music, which there are libraries for the Jaguar to handle. Although I have no idea if it's easy to integrate the protracker module together with the rest of the code for an Atari ST port?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 hours ago, phoboz said: I guess @CyranoJ knows the reply to this, Atari ST port, or Amiga AGA port? The second one would a new thing for the Jaguar homebrew community, so my guess it's the first one. However, I've seen a video showing that it would not be a straight port, rather there was some improved music for the intro. In the game I would really like to hear the original Amiga music for "the Forest", as it is still stuck in my mind to this day. (I never player the Atari ST version, so I don't know which music is there, but on the Amiga it's probably ProTracker MOD music, which there are libraries for the Jaguar to handle. Although I have no idea if it's easy to integrate the protracker module together with the rest of the code for an Atari ST port?) I think he usually pulls music from the Amiga version, or allows it as an option. But you're right, I don't think he's done any Amiga -> Jaguar ports. I wouldn't think it'd overall be more difficult to port that way (though I have no real idea, I'd just think he's still doing 68k to Jaguar stuff, so you'd still have 68k as the Amiga base) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoboz Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, leech said: I think he usually pulls music from the Amiga version, or allows it as an option. But you're right, I don't think he's done any Amiga -> Jaguar ports. I wouldn't think it'd overall be more difficult to port that way (though I have no real idea, I'd just think he's still doing 68k to Jaguar stuff, so you'd still have 68k as the Amiga base) From what I understand, the Atari ST has some kind of framebuffer, and most of the graphics operations are done by code on the 68000 CPU towards the framebuffer (the same CPU as in the Jaguar). The Amiga, on the other side has a custom chipset for graphics, and sound. So I guess much more things would need changes in an Amiga port, or some software that emulates the Amiga custom chipset would be needed. Althogh the Atari STE had a blitter just like the Amiga (which is a custom chip) I don't know if Chaos Engine took advantage of that? Please take my statements on the Atari ST with a grain of salt, but for the Amiga I know what I am talking about. Edited May 24, 2021 by phoboz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DrTypo Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 Early Amiga games, which are ST ports and do not use the custom chips, could maybe made to work on a Jaguar by patching the binary. But I don't how you could make Amiga game that use the custom chips work on a Jaguar by merely patching the binary. The Amiga blitter is a very different beast from the Jaguar blitter. And there is the copper, which is a very simple programmable processor in itself. You would need cycle exact emulation of these co-processors for Amiga games to work. The Amiga also has hardware sprites and dual playfield. A clever use of the Object Processor could maybe done to emulate those features but I doubt it is possible. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, DrTypo said: Early Amiga games, which are ST ports and do not use the custom chips, could maybe made to work on a Jaguar by patching the binary. But I don't how you could make Amiga game that use the custom chips work on a Jaguar by merely patching the binary. The Amiga blitter is a very different beast from the Jaguar blitter. And there is the copper, which is a very simple programmable processor in itself. You would need cycle exact emulation of these co-processors for Amiga games to work. The Amiga also has hardware sprites and dual playfield. A clever use of the Object Processor could maybe done to emulate those features but I doubt it is possible. I am just going by what I remember being discussed on what the ports usually are; ST ports, that he takes and does various code changes to for adding in Amiga music / sound, or he has even ripped it from other platforms to pick the best one. Even if he doesn't use the Amiga' AGA code, ripping the sprites from the Amiga version that has more colors would be quite possible, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoboz Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 24 minutes ago, DrTypo said: A clever use of the Object Processor could maybe done to emulate those features but I doubt it is possible. It would probably be more like a full featured emulator, like on the PC (except 68000 emulation) I guess Jaguar titles like Cannon Fodder, Syndicate, Zool 2, and Pinball Fantasies were made by those who had the original source code. They could have had some abstaction layer towards that hardware (for the Amiga), and changed that layer to use another hardware abstraction layer towards the Jaguar hardware. However, the different hardware abstraction layers might not have had a one-to-one mapping between the APIs, so some adaptions might have been needed in that area as well. All still doable if you have the source code, and game assets, very difficult only working with a binary (without access to the source code, and the original game assets) Edited May 24, 2021 by phoboz 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoboz Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 28 minutes ago, leech said: ripping the sprites from the Amiga version that has more colors would be quite possible, right? This might be tricky to locate the graphical data in an Amiga binary, and convert it to another format. I remember that I used a tool to covert an image file to some code, and binary data used directly by the Amiga blitter. This file I just linked with the assember code, and gave the instruction to the Amiga to do that magical thing created by the tool. So it's not like taking a .png file and covert it to the Jaguar using the Jaguar image converter tool. Even if it's possible to locate the graphical data you would need to reverse the operation of the tool above to covert it back to a standard image format. Note that many Amiga games were hacks, targeting the hardware directly. Not using the Amiga's API in ROM. Becuase people could do more cool things talking directly to the hardware. But the code would not be very portable in the end. Edited May 24, 2021 by phoboz 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leech Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 2 hours ago, phoboz said: It would probably be more like a full featured emulator, like on the PC (except 68000 emulation) I guess Jaguar titles like Cannon Fodder, Syndicate, Zool 2, and Pinball Fantasies were made by those who had the original source code. They could have had some abstaction layer towards that hardware (for the Amiga), and changed that layer to use another hardware abstraction layer towards the Jaguar hardware. However, the different hardware abstraction layers might not have had a one-to-one mapping between the APIs, so some adaptions might have been needed in that area as well. All still doable if you have the source code, and game assets, very difficult only working with a binary (without access to the source code, and the original game assets) I kind of thought original Jag development was all done on the Falcon / TT? A dude I know somehow got a hold of a Jag dev unit (it was just the Jaguar) I asked to buy it off him, and he said no. Then I asked him a while later what happened to it and he said he sold it... I was pretty pissed. But for sure the ones who were doing ports would have had the source (or at least highly likely) Syndicate at least was an improved version and tweaked to use the controller. Wonder if Sydicate Wars would require too much for the Jag to handle... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoonablehippo Posted August 14, 2021 Share Posted August 14, 2021 Sorry, bit behind the times but have these been released yet? Did I miss them? lol Thanks :-) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari_JaguarVCS Posted August 14, 2021 Share Posted August 14, 2021 I don’t think they have yet to my knowledge. I’m looking forward to buying these having recently done a play through of Gods Remastered on the PS5! It’ll be nice to see both games on the Jaguar, definitely one for the collection. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColecoGamer Posted August 15, 2021 Share Posted August 15, 2021 @AlbertMy two most favorite games by the Bitmap Brothers is coming to the Jaguar? Please, take my money! (When can we pre-order both titles?) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sn8k Posted August 25, 2021 Share Posted August 25, 2021 Wish I had a Jaguar to play these. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evisu Posted December 30, 2021 Share Posted December 30, 2021 Hi @Albert, 2021 is over tomorrow ... so no chance to see Gods and Chaos Engine this year, I guess? Any progress with the conversion? Will they come in 2022? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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