Making .st files?

[+Ripdubski]

My search fu is failing me, so I shall ask with a flame suit on.  How does one create (what software) an MSA or ST floppy image from a floppy disk?  Or convert a DIM image to MSA or ST?

 

Thanks

Wade

[Grazey]

Trans D-Bug Express does the biz for imaging. 

 

http://d-bug.me/releases/tde_105.zip

 

Grz

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Don't use TDE ! Avoid use of that program, as it is known to wipe out whole gemdos partitions without any sort of recovery!!!

 

Additionally, they claim that it is fastest - not true. Some reversed text, picture, music ... Yeah, that's what serious Atari user needs in first place ?

 

There is SW with regular GEM GUI, good overview of what happening, 100% ASM code, direct FDC access code (=speed), and diverse useful settings possible.

Get it on this page: http://atari.8bitchip.info/floimgd.php

Atari version is called TRACC or Trackcopy. There is PC version too on page.

 

[TGB1718]

3 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

Get it on this page: http://atari.8bitchip.info/floimgd.php

I keep an old PC with a floppy drive and use it for just this purpose, works great both ways i.e. creating new disks

or creating images.

At the moment I don't seem to be able to get any SD based devices working on my ST's, so this is the only

way I can get files to/from my ST's

[+SoulBuster]

Since I do not have a PC with a floppy port, I use MSA2.3 on the Atari to create a .MSA.  I then use NetUSB to transfer to the PC using uipv310. And finally, use MSA Converter to change them to .ST and zip them in one step.

 

So there are a couple of ways to choose from.

[Grazey]

7 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

Don't use TDE ! Avoid use of that program, as it is known to wipe out whole gemdos partitions without any sort of recovery!!!

 

Additionally, they claim that it is fastest - not true. Some reversed text, picture, music ... Yeah, that's what serious Atari user needs in first place ?

 

There is SW with regular GEM GUI, good overview of what happening, 100% ASM code, direct FDC access code (=speed), and diverse useful settings possible.

Get it on this page: http://atari.8bitchip.info/floimgd.php

Atari version is called TRACC or Trackcopy. There is PC version too on page.

 

Any evidence of speed tests then mr troll? Also I tried your s/W on my mste….. it fails as per usual. Thanks for the nice supportive comments anyway. 
 

if you delve into our 100% machine code you can then add our routines to your bloatware to make it more compatible with other diverse machines. 
 

gosh I post here maybe twice a year , and he jumps straight in as per usual. So sad but totally expected. 
 

grz

[ParanoidLittleMan]

What I wrote with fat letters is just quoting from Dbug site. They not only claim false thing, insult, but doing it as everything - overdone, with attitude 'we know and do all best'. One thing know best for sure: attracting brainless people to be their propaganda agents.

Thanx for your insults Mr. Fanboy - your post tells most about your level.

I made my first Atari ST floppy utility back in 1987. All what is published was used by plenty of people with success and I got lot of thanx from users. So much about 'fails as per usual' .

Next reply in same style will go to admins here.

 

 

[ijor]

10 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

Don't use TDE ! Avoid use of that program, as it is known to wipe out whole gemdos partitions without any sort of recovery!!!

Oh, come on. Stop this silliness.

 

1 hour ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

What I wrote with fat letters is just quoting from Dbug site.

 

If that is still true, then I agree that is about time that they would remove that reference. But that doesn't justify your reply here.

 

 

Edited June 8, 2021 by ijor

[ParanoidLittleMan]

This is on their site over 12 years.  http://d-bug.me/

then click on Extras and scroll to bottom.

And honestly, it is not so much shame of D-bug but rather of Atari ST retro community that it is still there. And believed by some, even if last sentence is absurd.

Thank you for your opinion Ijor, I agree to disagree ?

There is no better place where I can point on it. Then, this 'tried it and fails as usual' type 'test results' - it reminds on worst times in humanity history - when dictators ordered 'people opinion' then presented it as opinion of whole country, except few rebels, who must be removed ...   It was of course not opinion of majority, but majority remained silent, and that just helped bad to spread.

And worst of worst, humanity is now in total wrong direction.  There is saying: smart man learns on mistakes of others, stupid one on own mistakes. And what about those who do not learn even on own mistakes ? How to call them ?

There was big crisis, starting approx 100 years ago, mostly in Western part of our World. And now same thing happens, caused by same things - greed, vanity, 'we are best, über alles' attitude ... How low we can sink ?

[ggn]

2 hours ago, ijor said:

If that is still true, then I agree that is about time that they would remove that reference. But that doesn't justify your reply here.

Having my PC's boot drive FAT table wiped once is one times too many. So without trying, my recommendation is to still avoid. As for TDE, nobody has claimed any damage on their files, so it's just revenge claims from a spiteful man. Oh well.

 

BTW don't @ me, won't be reading or replying to this thread further.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

First of all: there is no any low level hard disk access in Windows program FloImg - low level access is only to floppy drive.

So, that it damaged someone's FAT table is complete nonsense. But what to expect from crew which claimed that I stole their code, concept of HW register saving - like they invented that it is needed for game state save. That's just elementary. And done state saves with Sinclair Spectrum back in 1986 already - with tape first.

TDE as Atari program  did not damage any PC files - that's really something admirable !

Anyway, it is clear now that they will not change anything in attitude. Also, their fan boys too.

Last words: when someone wants something  very much - so in this case that my SW work bad, or even 'better' that make some damage - will 'see  it' .  It is just matter of motivation. And all those 'damages' happened only by D-Bug and their supporters - that's fact. Now everybody can see who is really spiteful here.

I prepare some nice thing for Atari people,  with new approach. Just want to have some things behind me.

Those  who love to hate, lie, insinuate - just continue. It is time to make segregation by moral qualities - some want better SW, better World, some care only for own fame and narrow interest.

[+Ripdubski]

Thanks for the instruction.  I will give a couple a try and see what I like best.

 

What’s the difference in msa and cmr msa?
 

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Cmr - compressed or packed  MSA uses simple RLL packing method. In header is visible is it compressed or not.

So, cmr can be significantly shorter, best in case when floppy is only partially filled with files.

I'm sure that you can find some detailed description if interested for exact details.

Personally, I use mostly ST images, which are actually RAW images, so without header, without some packing option.

Storage space is now cheap.  MSA only if it is not regular FAT12 format, so can not see disk geometry (how many sectors/track, sides, cylinders) - then header of MSA is welcome.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Just to add one thing about that "FAT table wiped" - there are 2 FAT tables actually - so when they say "without any chance of recovery" - just use other FAT table - hey, it is not FAT table, just FAT (T is for table in abbrev.) - so much about 'best expert crew' level, again.

But I wanted just to say something what said already in past - if there was really some kind of wipe that could happen only from 2 reasons:

HW failure - disk, motherboard error.

More likely:  virus. And then geniuses did 'favor' to other D-buggers - sent them infected  Floimg to confirm that it really does wiping ???

 

[Grazey]

4 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

Just to add one thing about that "FAT table wiped" - there are 2 FAT tables actually - so when they say "without any chance of recovery" - just use other FAT table - hey, it is not FAT table, just FAT (T is for table in abbrev.) - so much about 'best expert crew' level, again.

But I wanted just to say something what said already in past - if there was really some kind of wipe that could happen only from 2 reasons:

HW failure - disk, motherboard error.

More likely:  virus. And then geniuses did 'favor' to other D-buggers - sent them infected  Floimg to confirm that it really does wiping ???

 

I was silent. Yet you still can’t stop the swipes can you. 
 

awaiting your speed comparisons between tde and your software, guess I’ll be waiting a long time. 

grz

 

[+Ripdubski]

7 hours ago, ParanoidLittleMan said:

Cmr - compressed or packed  MSA uses simple RLL packing method. In header is visible is it compressed or not.

So, cmr can be significantly shorter, best in case when floppy is only partially filled with files.

I'm sure that you can find some detailed description if interested for exact details.

Personally, I use mostly ST images, which are actually RAW images, so without header, without some packing option.

Storage space is now cheap.  MSA only if it is not regular FAT12 format, so can not see disk geometry (how many sectors/track, sides, cylinders) - then header of MSA is welcome.

Thanks, that helps me understand.

[ijor]

Some people will never grow. It's a pity. These silly fights is one of the reasons that many people left the Atari scene.

 

IMHO, it might be better if some moderator would lock this thread.

 

Edited June 9, 2021 by ijor

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Really mister Ijor ? I suggest that instead playing here some judge do something about your Pasti tools - for instance writing some detailed instructions about, then some page(s) about format, what it can do and like.

Lot of threads where people asking how to write STX images onto floppy disks - why not answering them. Now I could say - yeah, that's why many people left ...

 

But agree, this thread is best to close. 

For end, here are speed test results, asked by Grazey:

800 KB floppy, so 80 tracks, 2 sides, 10 sectors per track.

TRACC4_2 : 34.5 seconds

TDE_105 : 65 seconds. Then did test without music (to be same with my silent PRG) - same time.

And I wrote first version of TRACC in 1990 - when there was no even ST and MSA floppy image format established. So, in first versions I use own, special format - little similar to MSA - there was short header and some simple packing option.  Extension for packed was DSC .

And sorry if this harmed someone's sensitive heart. I wrote only facts here (except little joking at one point). Some don't care for facts. They like to insult, to judge.  For me being grown up is to say the truth despite what some self proclaimed experts, scene judges can say. I did much more for this community than anyone involved in this thread.  But no, I'm the reason why people leaving scene ...  At some places there would be ban because such claims. Shame on you ...