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Ars Technica article on Amico

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9 hours ago, Hwlngmad said:

You could be very much right.  However, until (professional) independent previews/reviews can be done, afraid the speculations and naysaying will continue quite loudly for some time to come.

I'd wait until it's committed to manufacturing.  Delays give game developers more time to make changes.  I wouldn't expect a few naysayers to influence whatever marketing plans and schedules they have.

Edited by mr_me

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10 hours ago, bojay1997 said:

Kids are not morons and unless this thing has games polished to the same level as what's available on the Switch and other similar platforms and controllers that are super responsive and more fun to use than the competition, it might be something they will play on a demo unit at a store, but it's not going to be something they actually convince their soccer moms to buy.  

Yes they are.  I have 3, and they have friends, and give any of them a couple hundred bucks and, left unchecked, they’ll gladly blow it all on a hat for their roblox avatar for no other reason than --- they saw some youtuber streaming with that same hat, running down a street screaming and bellowing like a jackass because… I dunno… apparently that’s what’s cool these days, so a couple hundred dollars for that hat must be a good value in their minds.

 

Have the right youtube streamer playing Amico saying things like “ERHEHRH!!!   OMG!!OMG!!!OMG!!  AHHHHHH!!!!!!”  and the kiddos will be begging their “soccer moms” to buy one.
 

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1 hour ago, Razzie.P said:

Yes they are.  I have 3, and they have friends, and give any of them a couple hundred bucks and, left unchecked, they’ll gladly blow it all on a hat for their roblox avatar for no other reason than --- they saw some youtuber streaming with that same hat, running down a street screaming and bellowing like a jackass because… I dunno… apparently that’s what’s cool these days, so a couple hundred dollars for that hat must be a good value in their minds.

 

Have the right youtube streamer playing Amico saying things like “ERHEHRH!!!   OMG!!OMG!!!OMG!!  AHHHHHH!!!!!!”  and the kiddos will be begging their “soccer moms” to buy one.
 

Lots of us have kids and while I'll concede that they do love Roblox and Fortnite, they are also super smart and selective when it comes to what games they play and how they play them given all the other media choices they have access to.  If your kids really are easily duped by Youtubers and blow through money buying junk, I would just say that your experience differs from my own and what I've observed from the kids that they hang around with. 

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5 hours ago, bojay1997 said:

Lots of us have kids and while I'll concede that they do love Roblox and Fortnite, they are also super smart and selective when it comes to what games they play and how they play them given all the other media choices they have access to.  If your kids really are easily duped by Youtubers and blow through money buying junk, I would just say that your experience differs from my own and what I've observed from the kids that they hang around with. 

I'll second this. When I play retro games, my kids laugh about me playing "boomer games."  Let me be blunt, if they aren't interested in the best games of the 16-Bit era, the Amico games we've seen so far have zero chance with them.  If they play one at a convention, they might say it's fun, but when they get home and it has to compete with VR or stuff like Gang Beasts, it would never get played.  Kids today have grown used to a level of interactivity older games don't have.  Simplicity is not considered a benefit to them.

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31 minutes ago, Agillig said:

I'll second this. When I play retro games, my kids laugh about me playing "boomer games."  Let me be blunt, if they aren't interested in the best games of the 16-Bit era, the Amico games we've seen so far have zero chance with them.  If they play one at a convention, they might say it's fun, but when they get home and it has to compete with VR or stuff like Gang Beasts, it would never get played.  Kids today have grown used to a level of interactivity older games don't have.  Simplicity is not considered a benefit to them.

My kids called them 'Grandpa games', lol.  When they were Littles they were playing games like Civ or Borderlands/etc; games being simple would've insulted them and they wouldn't have given them a second look.

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Absolutely. I managed to make my nephew (a little) interested in old video games, and I've also seen many kids intrigued by the history of video games during my association's exhibitions, but that doesn't mean they would be excited about Amico games since they're at best modern remakes.

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12 hours ago, mr_me said:

I'd wait until it's committed to manufacturing.  Delays give game developers more time to make changes.  I wouldn't expect a few naysayers to influence whatever marketing plans and schedules they have.

It's whatever IE decides to do.  However, obviously, having review units in the hands of (professional) reviewers might (potentially really) help things.  It looks like it really benefited the Playdate.

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56 minutes ago, Hwlngmad said:

It's whatever IE decides to do.  However, obviously, having review units in the hands of (professional) reviewers might (potentially really) help things.  It looks like it really benefited the Playdate.

Unless it goes like the IGN ME article did. That wasn't a great look.

 

It did really benefit the Playdate as I've heard they have around 70k preorders. I'm still waiting to know how much their speaker is. I really want the speaker combo.

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1 hour ago, Hwlngmad said:

It's whatever IE decides to do.  However, obviously, having review units in the hands of (professional) reviewers might (potentially really) help things.  It looks like it really benefited the Playdate.

Indeed.  There's a point at which you have to let the product stand on its own, and that means letting reviewers set it up as if they'd just bought it at Target.  On their own equipment.  That point should be no later than six months prior to launch. Generously, I could say that's would be April of this year.  Realistically, to be consistent with Intv's own account of the development, it should have been April of last year.

 

To not be taking that step as of now is a huge miss.

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10 hours ago, bojay1997 said:

Lots of us have kids and while I'll concede that they do love Roblox and Fortnite, they are also super smart and selective when it comes to what games they play and how they play them given all the other media choices they have access to.  If your kids really are easily duped by Youtubers and blow through money buying junk, I would just say that your experience differs from my own and what I've observed from the kids that they hang around with. 

Well, thank goodness there’s hope for the future somewhere  😄   Hopefully some of that “super smart and selective” mentality will spread to those groups who are convincing their parents to spend millions on digital trinkets because they "saw it on youtube."

 

 

4 hours ago, Agillig said:

I'll second this. When I play retro games, my kids laugh about me playing "boomer games."  Let me be blunt, if they aren't interested in the best games of the 16-Bit era, the Amico games we've seen so far have zero chance with them.  If they play one at a convention, they might say it's fun, but when they get home and it has to compete with VR or stuff like Gang Beasts, it would never get played.  Kids today have grown used to a level of interactivity older games don't have.  Simplicity is not considered a benefit to them.

Mine aren't interested in the 16 bit stuff either, because they're "old and clunky" -- but the strange part, to me at least, is some of the crap they play looks and plays much, much worse.

 

Well, my oldest is a fan of all things retro, but he's not into gaming much at all.  He loves the look and the "idea' of a lot of older games n' characters, but doesn't play anything.

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15 minutes ago, godslabrat said:

Indeed.  There's a point at which you have to let the product stand on its own, and that means letting reviewers set it up as if they'd just bought it at Target.  On their own equipment.  That point should be no later than six months prior to launch. Generously, I could say that's would be April of this year.  Realistically, to be consistent with Intv's own account of the development, it should have been April of last year.

 

To not be taking that step as of now is a huge miss.

Why six months and not two months (or less even)?

Edited by mr_me
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2 minutes ago, mr_me said:

Why six months and not two months (or less even)?

Because six months prior to your retail release, your hardware should be finished, tested, and mass production ready.  You can't get it into customer's hands because of the realities of fabrication, but you're in a position to show reviewers exactly what is about to hit store shelves.  And the sooner you can do that, the better, because you'll not only gain media allies, but attract customers who didn't previously know about the upcoming console.  

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29 minutes ago, godslabrat said:

Because six months prior to your retail release, your hardware should be finished, tested, and mass production ready.  You can't get it into customer's hands because of the realities of fabrication, but you're in a position to show reviewers exactly what is about to hit store shelves.  And the sooner you can do that, the better, because you'll not only gain media allies, but attract customers who didn't previously know about the upcoming console.  

Yeah I'm not sure why everyone expects things to be last minute. Things should be done in advance. Even to get consoles out by the end of 2021 they need to be manufacturing soon. You can't wait until last minute to do that.

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51 minutes ago, godslabrat said:

Because six months prior to your retail release, your hardware should be finished, tested, and mass production ready.  You can't get it into customer's hands because of the realities of fabrication, but you're in a position to show reviewers exactly what is about to hit store shelves.  And the sooner you can do that, the better, because you'll not only gain media allies, but attract customers who didn't previously know about the upcoming console.  

Being able to do it is not in question because they have shown it to lots of people already.  

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Pretty much nothing gets last two weeks of december to the first week of January.  
 

As of today. They have about 18 weeks to to get into hands of people who preordered to meet the christmas season as mentioned in the email. 
 

Can it be done?  I really hope so!  

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23 minutes ago, mr_me said:

Being able to do it is not in question because they have shown it to lots of people already.  

Being able to do it is not what I'm talking about.  That shouldn't even be in the discussion by now.  What I'm talking about is getting your console into the hands of people who can talk about how much they enjoy the experience, how they rate it against competing consoles, what their user experience is.  Console makers send out review units when the machine is production ready.  

Edited by godslabrat
missed a word
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7 minutes ago, godslabrat said:

Being able to do it is not what I'm talking about.  That shouldn't even be in the discussion by now.  What I'm talking about is getting your console into the hands of people who can talk about how much they enjoy the experience, how they rate it against competing consoles, what their user experience is.  Console makers send out review units when the machine is production ready.  

Exactly!  Having review and/or production ready units in the hands of (professional) reviewers at places like Engadget, Ars Technica, CNET, etc. would (or at least potentially could) really help the Amico out.  Having random Johns and Jills give their opinions ain't going to cut it at this point imo.

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Sure, but why not do it when they have more games finalised.  The hardware is being reviewed but ultimately it's about the games.  Still don't see the importance of the timing especially when it currently has no release date.

Edited by mr_me

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14 minutes ago, mr_me said:

Sure, but why not do it when they have more games finalised.  The hardware is being reviewed but ultimately it's about the games.  Still don't see the importance of the timing especially when it currently has no release date.


But there is hope for a soft Christmas launch. What are your thoughts on reaching that goal?   

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15 minutes ago, mr_me said:

Sure, but why not do it when they have more games finalised.  The hardware is being reviewed but ultimately it's about the games.  Still don't see the importance of the timing especially when it currently has no release date.

Because not having the games finalized (10 months after your launch date) is a problem all of its own.

 

It has a release date. It's actually had three.  That in and of itself is a problem.

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It's not ten months after their launch date.  Their last launch date hasn't even passed and has been pushed back.  Any game that's ready can potentially be changed once you give developers more time.   So nothing is final even if they are ready for release. 

 

50 minutes ago, Rev said:


But there is hope for a soft Christmas launch. What are your thoughts on reaching that goal?   

I don't see any benefit for them doing a soft launch with inflated manufacturing costs, might as well wait.  There could be an internal debate between the CFO and CEO on that one.

Edited by mr_me

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1 minute ago, mr_me said:

It's not ten months after their launch date.  Their last launch date hasn't even passed and has been pushed back.  Any game that's ready can potentially be changed once you give developers more time.   So nothing is final even if they are ready for release.

Pretty sure 10/10/2020 is in the past.  I'm almost positive.  The fact that nothing is final right now is exactly the problem.  This is not how you release a console.

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How do you release a console when your manufacturing costs have ballooned, temporarily, but for an undetermined length of time.  If you know the answer, Intellivision Entertainment might have a job for you.

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6 minutes ago, mr_me said:

How do you release a console when your manufacturing costs have ballooned, temporarily, but for an undetermined length of time.  If you know the answer, Intellivision Entertainment might have a job for you.

They couldn't afford me.

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2 hours ago, godslabrat said:

Console makers send out review units when the machine is production ready.  

Are you sure about that? I don't remember Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo ever doing this.

 

Anyway, in the case of Intellivision, sending review units as soon as production starts would be interesting only if there were no pre-orders or if Intellivision's production capacity was superior to the current demand.

 

My wild guess is it will probably take two or three months of production to fulfill all pre-orders. This means advertisement (reviews are a form of advertisement) should start only two or three months after production starts, not when the product is ready for production.

 

2 hours ago, godslabrat said:

Because not having the games finalized (10 months after your launch date) is a problem all of its own.

From a developer's point of view, games are never really "finalized". It's the publisher who decides when he pulls the plug.

 

47 minutes ago, godslabrat said:

They couldn't afford me.

You believe Intellivision is not able to pay minimum wage to an employee?

Edited by Papy
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