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Leeroy ST

Was not releasing with CD at launch the biggest mistake Atari made with the Jaguar?

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3 hours ago, Sauron said:

Fine, you can disbelieve me all you want, but let's see what Sam Tramiel had to say about it back in his interview with Next Generation magazine in 1995:

 

1694062553_ScreenShot2021-08-15at9_23_09AM.png.acfbae715353a91c798acf8814c37b06.png

 

Keep in mind that this interview was well more than a year after the Jag's initial launch. He himself is saying that a Jag with a CD drive would be $300 - $400 in comparison with its then price of $159. As we know, the Jag CD that launched in September of 1995 cost $149, although it did come with a separate power supply plus some pack-in software. So, let's be generous here in regards to price, and assume that integrating the CD drive into the system would cost Atari no more than $100 more than a year before this interview. That would give the Jaguar a base price of $350, which at the time would've made it significantly more expensive than most other previous console launch prices, with the few exceptions being systems that didn't exactly set the world on fire. Atari had been clear from the outset that they had a price target for $200 to $250 for the Jag's launch price. 

 

I think it's safe to say that the Jag with an integrated CD-ROM drive AT THE BARE MINIMUM would have cost $350, or more likely $400 at launch. Again, a far cry from the "minor bump" in price that you seem to be clinging to.

 

Sega cd and turbo cd were add on both in 300 range, sega xeycdi and 3do were 600 to 700 launch price, how is Atari using IBM, releasing a magic cd based unit and not being 500 range is crazy in 93, believing that 3do and cdi didn't bring out the systems as cheaply as they could at launch is another crazy thought.

 

The only point that would change is manufacturing of cds should be cheaper than carts, but believing that Atari would suddenly get more of those supposed 300 independent software makers on board to support a machine with a user base less than a million is 🤪crazy.

 

I do believe you may of got more straight sega ports, and fmv games but nothing g to push the machine, atari had no money, the only progression to get an extension on their life, was them becoming a software company but the stock price wouldn't of held up for that.

 

Atari turning the Falcon into a low price pc clone would of been a better avenue as well.

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3 hours ago, Sauron said:

Fine, you can disbelieve me all you want, but let's see what Sam Tramiel had to say about it back in his interview with Next Generation magazine in 1995:

 

1694062553_ScreenShot2021-08-15at9_23_09AM.png.acfbae715353a91c798acf8814c37b06.png

 

Keep in mind that this interview was well more than a year after the Jag's initial launch. He himself is saying that a Jag with a CD drive would be $300 - $400 in comparison with its then price of $159. As we know, the Jag CD that launched in September of 1995 cost $149, although it did come with a separate power supply plus some pack-in software. So, let's be generous here in regards to price, and assume that integrating the CD drive into the system would cost Atari no more than $100 more than a year before this interview. That would give the Jaguar a base price of $350, which at the time would've made it significantly more expensive than most other previous console launch prices, with the few exceptions being systems that didn't exactly set the world on fire. Atari had been clear from the outset that they had a price target for $200 to $250 for the Jag's launch price. 

 

I think it's safe to say that the Jag with an integrated CD-ROM drive AT THE BARE MINIMUM would have cost $350, or more likely $400 at launch. Again, a far cry from the "minor bump" in price that you seem to be clinging to.

 

It may very well be the truth, but we do know that Atari in this era made some pretty incredible claims at the time to try and make things sound better than they really were like the Jaguar's power relative to the Saturn and PS1 and other infamous statements. This could very well be the same type of marketing spin to make their lack of vision and/or inability to get the CD out earlier seem like a good thing they were doing for consumers more than anything else. In other words, while that is indeed something they officially stated, it doesn't mean it's the truth with something like this.

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I see no links to counter the historically accurate links clearly showing or referencing cd drive prices.

 

The only objectively cited information, across years btw, posted so far, shows CD drives were cheap even "ahead of time".

 

Of course expect no counters to "objective" links providing evidence of historical CD drive prices (just for consumers not even companies!) and instead expect more unsourced desperation by those who have no real knowledge of CD drives or the industry in general. 

 

Again.

 

Part 1:

 

  Quote

Now a CD-ROM player can be had for as little as $200.

Article showing CONSUMER cheap prices in 92, 3 years before JagCD addon released "ahead of time". Corp would be cheaper in bulk.

 

Then there is this:

 

https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/old-ads-best-buy-july-1994-2-5a210559664ac__880.jpg

 

Even with CD players, in (July!) 1994, around a year BEFORE JagCD, you see a price of $89 WITH extras. How cheap is the individual player? Where is the proof of massive costs? This is the year of the cartridge Jag launch too.

 

Part 2:

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w18931/w18931.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiuoPKT1bPyAhVmKVkFHb6wCd04ChAWegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw0IS2-WTtEiFmzTq7OE8Lef

 

8c6J8ZN.png

 

  Quote

Rapidly falling prices clearly explain much of the increase in sales. In 1988, the average sales price for a CD‐ROM was about $500. In 1990, average unit price was about $300, and by 1995, under $100 This amounts to a fall in average unit price of about 20.5% annually. Moreover, this is a lower bound on the rate of quality‐adjusted price decline, because the CD‐ ROM drive sales depicted in the later years in the above figure also capture dramatically higher quality drives than the original CD‐ROM units.

Yes under $100 by 95. But that's for 4X drives, not 2x drives as 4x drives became the new standard. So 2x drives were, wait for it, even cheaper.

 

As shown here:

https://tidbits.com/1995/07/24/the-quad-speed-quandary/

  Quote

If you’ve paid any attention to the CD-ROM market in the last few months, you’ve noticed one thing: quad-speed (4x) CD-ROM drives are all the rage. Third-party, quad-speed drives for the Mac have been available from manufacturers such as NEC and Sony for some time, and Apple will be including quad-speed drives in desktop Macs. Double-speed CD-ROM drives are going the way of the 800K floppy drive, and quad-speed drives look to be the next step up the ladder. To make matters more complicated, there are also triple-speed (3x) and sextuple-speed (6x) CD-ROM mechanisms on the market.

2x drives were again, even cheaper. These are still consumer prices, corporate would receive a bigger discount in bulk going back to 92 onward. Years of low costs while riding the decline in prices.

 

 

 

 

You will not see any from the usual clique debunk this because these are historical prices, the CD drives actually costed this so it shows they never knew what they were taking about. They will not counter with a breakdown with their own sources because there's nothing counter. 

 

Instead you will likely not see any address these links, they will likely be the only cited sources, and you will see them skip or ignore this information. It just happened a few posts ago, nothing was addressed.

 

The nonsensical magical CD drive premium that apparently only impacted Atari (?) Has been debunked with actual prices of CD drives. The $100 past the "price target" is also imaginary and wouldn't have happened because we actually have prices of what CD drives cost then and before. Just for consumers too, we haven't even touched the corporate B2B discount and buying in bulk.

 

 

Edited by Leeroy ST

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29 minutes ago, Bill Loguidice said:

It may very well be the truth, but we do know that Atari in this era made some pretty incredible claims at the time to try and make things sound better than they really were like the Jaguar's power relative to the Saturn and PS1 and other infamous statements. This could very well be the same type of marketing spin to make their lack of vision and/or inability to get the CD out earlier seem like a good thing they were doing for consumers more than anything else. In other words, while that is indeed something they officially stated, it doesn't mean it's the truth with something like this.

As posted above, it just doesn't match the historical prices of CD drives. It's more likely they were saving face for the Jag CD delay assuming they even started when they announced it.

 

Even in 95 when it came out you could get 4x (speed) more reliable drives than the Jaguars unstable poorly built 2X drive. Even then 2X drives were also super cheap. This also applied to the year it launched (1994) and those are consumer prices, not corporate buying in bulk. Leading to bigger discounts per unit.

Edited by Leeroy ST

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It doesn't matter if the CD would have added $500 or $5 to the total cost, the Jaguar was not designed to be a CD system....  but carry on.

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22 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

  Quote

Now a CD-ROM player can be had for as little as $200.

Article showing CONSUMER cheap prices in 92, 3 years before JagCD addon released "ahead of time". Corp would be cheaper in bulk.

Yeah. $200. Not $2, or even $20.

 

How much cheaper in bulk would those have been?

What's the retail-price-vs-manufacturing-cost ratio? (The distributors and retailers don't use fixed margins. "$X more to manufacture" means "$Y higher retail price". Y is significantly higher than X.)

How much are the integration and development costs? (Yes, those need to be recouped too.)

How long would it have taken to integrate the CD drive? What would have been the economic cost of delaying the console launch by that much?

 

Do you have those numbers? You know, those that actually matter when talking about integrating a CD-ROM into a console, as opposed to adding a CD-ROM drive to a standard computer?

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Just as I said, didn't address the links at all (partially one I guess), ignored most of the post, and also ignored that the price was for consumers buying an individual unit, not corps buying in bulk. 

 

No comment on the below $100 consumer price in 95 either, since 1995 JagCD "had" to be that price because "cds were still expensive" which was proven false but strangely omitted. Hmm.

 

And considering it's not just pc drives but pretty much any device using cds, this tax that only applies to Atari (for some reason?) Doesn't add up. 

 

Still no explanation how one CD drive in cheap times in 94 would make Jag launch at a post launch 93 3DO price of $500.

 

or even match a 94 3DO drop price of $400. 3DO was expensive for a reason and the CD drive was not the cause, so why would Atari lacking the issues the 3DO had that inflated it's price, match the 3DOs price in either case because of a single CD drive which consumers could get dirt cheap and companies should get even cheaper? Doesn't make sense. Where is this $300 or $200 premium coming from? 

 

Nowhere.

 

I like how Atari is also the only one with this problem too. Every other CD devices drives dropped in price or didn't launch with $300 premiums. How odd.

 

 

Edited by Leeroy ST

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1 hour ago, Bill Loguidice said:

It may very well be the truth, but we do know that Atari in this era made some pretty incredible claims at the time to try and make things sound better than they really were like the Jaguar's power relative to the Saturn and PS1 and other infamous statements. This could very well be the same type of marketing spin to make their lack of vision and/or inability to get the CD out earlier seem like a good thing they were doing for consumers more than anything else. In other words, while that is indeed something they officially stated, it doesn't mean it's the truth with something like this.

There's a big difference between making fanciful claims of the Jag's power relative to its competitors and talking about the probable retail price of a system with an included CD drive. Where Sam got his information regarding how powerful the Jag was, we'll never know, but him saying the Jaguar's retail price with a built-in CD drive was too expensive is another matter entirely. I don't buy it being a lack of vision as it was well known that a CD drive would be coming well before the Jag first launched. Just look at Atari's first official Jaguar announcement here.

 

4 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

Just as I said, didn't address the links at all, ignored most of the post, and also ignored that the price was for consumers buying an individual unit, not corps buying in bulk. 

 

No comment on the below $100 consumer price in 95 either, since 1995 JagCD "had" to be that price because "cds were still expensive" which was proven false but strangely omitted. Hmm.

 

And considering it's not just pc drives but pretty much any device using cds, this tax that only applies to Atari (for some reason?) Doesn't add up. 

 

Still no explanation how one CD drive in cheap times in 94 would make Jag launch at a post launch 93 3DO of $500 or a 94 3DO drop price at $400. 3DO was expensive for a reason and the CD drive was not the cause, so why would Atari lacking the issues the 3DO had that inflated it's price, match the 3DOs price in either case because of a single CD drive which consumers could get dirt cheap and companies should get even cheaper? Doesn't make sense. Where is this $300 or $200 premium coming from? 

 

Nowhere.

 

I like how Atari is the only one with this problem too. Every other CD devices drives dropped in price or didn't launch with $300 premiums.

 

 

Again, you're flailing about in circles with your argument, and seem to be forgetting that Atari launched the Jaguar in 1993. None of the links you have provided have done jack in proving that the Jaguar could've launched with a low-cost CD-based console at the same time as the Jag's actual launch.

 

 

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34 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

...

Once again: when asked for hard data and facts that go deeper than consumer-level stuff, @Leeroy ST can't provide any. Yet he expects others to address his long, rambling posts point-per-point.

 

Also, he seems to think that the Jaguar (from a cash-strapped company that no longer had anything else to sell) can be compared to the 3DO (backed by big companies like Panasonic, who could afford to invest a lot and sell at a loss).

Edited by Zerosquare
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10 minutes ago, Zerosquare said:

Also, he seems to think that the Jaguar (from a cash-strapped company that no longer had anything else to sell) can be compared to the 3DO (backed by big companies like Panasonic, who could afford to invest a lot and sell at a loss).

To be fair, 3DO's business model hindered the price point of the system. Had 3DO manufactured the system themselves, it could've been sold at a loss, but you simply couldn't expect a 3rd party like Panasonic to do so. Panasonic, to the best of my knowledge, wasn't getting royalties of all 3DO games sold. Hence, why it cost so much when it was first released. 

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Still no links, still not addressing the (only) sources posted, or the false previous claim cd drives were expensive in 95, you have zero(hmmm) ground, nothing at all.

 

Also the 3DO initial high price was to try and prevent bleeding money but you lie and deceive a lot. Also have no clue what you're talking about. Regardless still no sources or links, still not addressing what was posted. Poor guy, it must be hard.

 

Let me when you have any sourcess I mean you won't but if a miracle happens....

 

34 minutes ago, Sauron said:

Again, you're flailing about in circles with your argument, and seem to be forgetting that Atari launched the Jaguar in 1993. 

I mean at this point you might as well just say you have no clue what you're talking about. Why even try if you cant get this basic information right?

 

The only thing they did in 93 was a market test.

 

 

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8 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

Still no links, still not addressing the (only) sources posted

Remember: the burden of proof is on you. Waiting for your answers to the following questions:

1 hour ago, Zerosquare said:

How much cheaper in bulk would those have been?

What's the retail-price-vs-manufacturing-cost ratio? (The distributors and retailers don't use fixed margins. "$X more to manufacture" means "$Y higher retail price". Y is significantly higher than X.)

How much are the integration and development costs? (Yes, those need to be recouped too.)

How long would it have taken to integrate the CD drive? What would have been the economic cost of delaying the console launch by that much?

 

Do you have those numbers? You know, those that actually matter when talking about integrating a CD-ROM into a console, as opposed to adding a CD-ROM drive to a standard computer?

Edited by Zerosquare
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2 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

Still no links, still not addressing the (only) sources posted, or the false previous claim cd drives were expensive in 95, you have zero(hmmm) ground, nothing at all.

 

Also the 3DO initial high price was to try and prevent bleeding money but you lie and deceive a lot. Also have no clue what you're talking about. Regardless still no sources or links, still not addressing what was posted. Poor guy, it must be hard.

 

Let me when you have any sourcess I mean you won't but if a miracle happens....

 

I mean at this point you might as well just say you have no clue what you're talking about. Why even try if you cant get this basic information right?

You truly do live in a fantasy world. The information I already provided serves as proof enough that your claims are simply wrong, and nothing that you provided proves otherwise. 

 

4 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

The only thing they did in 93 was a market test.

A "test release" of finalized hardware, and most of the resellers ignored any test market restrictions that Atari intended anyway. One of the members of my Atari user group in Austin, TX purchased the Jaguar the weekend of its "test release" at a local store. Furthermore, as best as I can tell, there was no official nationwide release later on, so for all intents and purposes, the Jaguar's official release was in November of 1993.

 

 

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12 minutes ago, Sauron said:

To be fair, 3DO's business model hindered the price point of the system. Had 3DO manufactured the system themselves, it could've been sold at a loss, but you simply couldn't expect a 3rd party like Panasonic to do so. Panasonic, to the best of my knowledge, wasn't getting royalties of all 3DO games sold. Hence, why it cost so much when it was first released. 

Fair point, indeed.

But comparing the Jaguar and the 3DO still doesn't make much sense. The financial situations were completely different.

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This guy is still on about this? He's like the Energizer bunny of nonsense, he keeps going and going. I don't even know what he's arguing anymore. That CD drives for computers were cheap in 1995 so Atari could've released the Jag with a CD in 1993?

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Something like this.

 

Also, according to him, the $150 JagCD in 1995 is a proof that Atari was incompetent (hey, can't argue there).

But the very same incompetent Atari could have added the CD to the Jaguar in 1993 for a few dollars, because... magic?

Edited by Zerosquare

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12 minutes ago, Zerosquare said:

has failed to convince anyone that his argument has any merit. 

Hmmm

On 7/23/2021 at 11:35 PM, Major Havoc 2049 said:

I do think the Jaguar would have been better off as a CD system from the get go, as I think 3rd party support would have been slightly better for the Jag.  Cybermorph would of had music and maybe a few more textures.  

There's more than that too, but just wanted to show you put your foot in your mouth again, one last time. But as you have no sources I'm afraid your posts are pointless until you find some. As right now only one post has sources for objective prices people paid for cd drives, me. Good day.

 

/

9+ posts later it's as I predicted, the (frankly obsessed) individuals haven't posted a single link because they dont have anything. Yet they ignore the ONLY sources posted in the thread so far showing historical CD prices from 92-95, and all they are doing is ignoring the sources, lying about them, or trying to change the subject around them.

 

(One made the claim cd drives were expensive in 95 and hasn't acknowledged that being wrong since either)

 

If there's someone who disagrees that actually has sources to post (like I did) feel free because the other guys seem to be cowards. Gave them plenty of time to prove my prediction wrong but they did exactly as I expected and won't touch the sources because they know it's over for them.

 

Here is the sourced quote from post #778 again for anyone else:

 

Quote

Of course expect no counters to "objective" links providing evidence of historical CD drive prices (just for consumers not even companies!) and instead expect more unsourced desperation by those who have no real knowledge of CD drives or the industry in general. 

 

Again.

 

Part 1:

 

  Quote
  Quote

Now a CD-ROM player can be had for as little as $200.

Article showing CONSUMER cheap prices in 92, 3 years before JagCD addon released "ahead of time". Corp would be cheaper in bulk.

 

Then there is this:

 

https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/old-ads-best-buy-july-1994-2-5a210559664ac__880.jpg

 

Even with CD players, in (July!) 1994, around a year BEFORE JagCD, you see a price of $89 WITH extras. How cheap is the individual player? Where is the proof of massive costs? This is the year of the cartridge Jag launch too.

 

Part 2:

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w18931/w18931.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiuoPKT1bPyAhVmKVkFHb6wCd04ChAWegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw0IS2-WTtEiFmzTq7OE8Lef

 

8c6J8ZN.png

 

  Quote
  Quote

Rapidly falling prices clearly explain much of the increase in sales. In 1988, the average sales price for a CD‐ROM was about $500. In 1990, average unit price was about $300, and by 1995, under $100 This amounts to a fall in average unit price of about 20.5% annually. Moreover, this is a lower bound on the rate of quality‐adjusted price decline, because the CD‐ ROM drive sales depicted in the later years in the above figure also capture dramatically higher quality drives than the original CD‐ROM units.

Yes under $100 by 95. But that's for 4X drives, not 2x drives as 4x drives became the new standard. So 2x drives were, wait for it, even cheaper.

 

As shown here:

https://tidbits.com/1995/07/24/the-quad-speed-quandary/

  Quote
  Quote

If you’ve paid any attention to the CD-ROM market in the last few months, you’ve noticed one thing: quad-speed (4x) CD-ROM drives are all the rage. Third-party, quad-speed drives for the Mac have been available from manufacturers such as NEC and Sony for some time, and Apple will be including quad-speed drives in desktop Macs. Double-speed CD-ROM drives are going the way of the 800K floppy drive, and quad-speed drives look to be the next step up the ladder. To make matters more complicated, there are also triple-speed (3x) and sextuple-speed (6x) CD-ROM mechanisms on the market.

2x drives were again, even cheaper. These are still consumer prices, corporate would receive a bigger discount in bulk going back to 92 onward. Years of low costs while riding the decline in prices.

 

 

 

 

You will not see any from the usual clique debunk this because these are historical prices, the CD drives actually costed this so it shows they never knew what they were taking about. They will not counter with a breakdown with their own sources because there's nothing counter. 

 

Instead you will likely not see any address these links, they will likely be the only cited sources, and you will see them skip or ignore this information. It just happened a few posts ago, nothing was addressed.

 

The nonsensical magical CD drive premium that apparently only impacted Atari (?) Has been debunked with actual prices of CD drives. The $100 past the "price target" is also imaginary and wouldn't have happened because we actually have prices of what CD drives cost then and before. Just for consumers too, we haven't even touched the corporate B2B discount and buying in bulk

All right there^ for anyone that actually has a valid disagreement with sources. Please ignore the frankly trolling clutter that may pop up. They clearly dont have any sources.

 

But anyone else who actually does have them feel free.

Edited by Leeroy ST

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2 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

9+ posts later it's as I predicted, the (frankly obsessed) individuals haven't posted a single link because they dont have anything.

And 32 pages into the topic, the topic creator has failed to convince anyone that his argument has any merit. Meanwhile, everyone else is eating popcorn.

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6 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

All right there^ for anyone that actually has a valid disagreement with sources. Please ignore the frankly trolling clutter that may pop up. They clearly dont have any sources.

I already provided the only source that matters - Sam Tramiel himself stating that the cost of including a CD drive in the Jaguar at launch would've made the console too expensive. Everything else is pure conjecture, and frankly, all of the sources that you've provided have only been you tilting at windmills. 

 

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10 minutes ago, Zerosquare said:

Something like this.

Also, according to him, the $150 JagCD in 1995 was a proof that Atari was incompetent (hey, can't argue there). But the very same incompetent Atari could have added the CD to the Jaguar in 1993 for a few dolalrs, because magic.

Putting reality and actual history aside, even if the Jag was released either as a CD/cart combo system or the CD was available at or near launch, it would not have mattered. Highlander, Blue Lightning and most of the rest of the CD library were turds in 1995 and those steamy piles wouldn't have smelled any better in 1993. 

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23 minutes ago, JagChris said:

Thread going on ignore.

Dont forget to invite the rest of your group. They dont have any sources either.

 

 

Edited by Leeroy ST

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( I like how one user brought up how taking sam's word at face value isn't the best idea and another user ignored it still posting it as a source when it's not. Either way Sam doesn't overwrite the actual prices people were paying for CD drives, that's not an opinion, those were the prices.)

 

It seems like I'll have to wait for the guy with the counter source to the so far only sources posted in the entire thread, showing objective historical prices for CD drives consumers paid for from 92-95.

 

For that guy, if you disagree and have actual sources here's the post again with the other sources to respond to:

 

Quote

Of course expect no counters to "objective" links providing evidence of historical CD drive prices (just for consumers not even companies!) and instead expect more unsourced desperation by those who have no real knowledge of CD drives or the industry in general. 

 

Again.

 

Part 1:

 

  Quote
  Quote

Now a CD-ROM player can be had for as little as $200.

Article showing CONSUMER cheap prices in 92, 3 years before JagCD addon released "ahead of time". Corp would be cheaper in bulk.

 

Then there is this:

 

https://static.boredpanda.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/old-ads-best-buy-july-1994-2-5a210559664ac__880.jpg

 

Even with CD players, in (July!) 1994, around a year BEFORE JagCD, you see a price of $89 WITH extras. How cheap is the individual player? Where is the proof of massive costs? This is the year of the cartridge Jag launch too.

 

Part 2:

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.nber.org/system/files/working_papers/w18931/w18931.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiuoPKT1bPyAhVmKVkFHb6wCd04ChAWegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw0IS2-WTtEiFmzTq7OE8Lef

 

8c6J8ZN.png

 

  Quote
  Quote

Rapidly falling prices clearly explain much of the increase in sales. In 1988, the average sales price for a CD‐ROM was about $500. In 1990, average unit price was about $300, and by 1995, under $100 This amounts to a fall in average unit price of about 20.5% annually. Moreover, this is a lower bound on the rate of quality‐adjusted price decline, because the CD‐ ROM drive sales depicted in the later years in the above figure also capture dramatically higher quality drives than the original CD‐ROM units.

Yes under $100 by 95. But that's for 4X drives, not 2x drives as 4x drives became the new standard. So 2x drives were, wait for it, even cheaper.

 

As shown here:

https://tidbits.com/1995/07/24/the-quad-speed-quandary/

  Quote
  Quote

If you’ve paid any attention to the CD-ROM market in the last few months, you’ve noticed one thing: quad-speed (4x) CD-ROM drives are all the rage. Third-party, quad-speed drives for the Mac have been available from manufacturers such as NEC and Sony for some time, and Apple will be including quad-speed drives in desktop Macs. Double-speed CD-ROM drives are going the way of the 800K floppy drive, and quad-speed drives look to be the next step up the ladder. To make matters more complicated, there are also triple-speed (3x) and sextuple-speed (6x) CD-ROM mechanisms on the market.

2x drives were again, even cheaper. These are still consumer prices, corporate would receive a bigger discount in bulk going back to 92 onward. Years of low costs while riding the decline in prices.

 

 

 

 

You will not see any from the usual clique debunk this because these are historical prices, the CD drives actually costed this so it shows they never knew what they were taking about. They will not counter with a breakdown with their own sources because there's nothing counter. 

 

Instead you will likely not see any address these links, they will likely be the only cited sources, and you will see them skip or ignore this information. It just happened a few posts ago, nothing was addressed.

 

The nonsensical magical CD drive premium that apparently only impacted Atari (?) Has been debunked with actual prices of CD drives. The $100 past the "price target" is also imaginary and wouldn't have happened because we actually have prices of what CD drives cost then and before. Just for consumers too, we haven't even touched the corporate B2B discount and buying in bulk

Feel free.

Edited by Leeroy ST

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11 minutes ago, Leeroy ST said:

Blah blah blah....pointless endless reposting of links that prove nothing...blah blah blah.

At this point you're simply arguing with yourself. If the President and CEO of Atari saying that it was too expensive isn't enough to convince you, then nothing will. Frankly, my patience has been completely eroded here. Go ahead and pat yourself on the back for getting the last word in, I'm done.

 

 

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My summary of this thread: If the Jaguar launched as the JagDuo, it would have cost some under debate amount of money more, and may or may not have saved the console. About 4 or 5 people here care a lot. Like, a lot a lot.

  • Haha 2

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