DOS gaming PC - SOLD

[eightbit]

I can tell you that in my neck of the woods 386's (and 486's for that matter) are near impossible to find nowadays. The earliest machines found locally now are P4 and up.

 

Anybody who thinks "dosbox" is a suitable replacement for the real hardware experience obviously has no concept of the nostalgic tie some folks have to these machines. That is like saying "umm Stella" instead of using a real Atari 2600, controller, cartridge, CRT TV, paddles. It does not matter either if it is emulation or simulation. It is not the same as running on the real vintage hardware, period. Not nearly the same experience in the least. There is a reason people seek these machines. 

 

That said, what I wouldn't give to have a 386SX-16 again. My first PC running DOS was an 386SX-16. Mine was an IBM PS/2 model which model number escapes me (perhaps a model 70 as well). I believe it had been upgraded to 4MB of memory. What a blast I had with that machine. I even miss flicking that switch

 

Good luck with the sale. If I were local to you and the deal was right I might have been inclined to pick this one up myself.

 

 

Edited October 6, 2021 by eightbit

[Keatah]

It's one of the sub-reasons (good times and sentimentality being 1st) that I kept my 486, PIII, and Apple II material.

 

I have the hardware. But we do 90% or more of vintage gaming and activities through emulation on i9 SFF machines. There's a certain kind magical romance - pulling the software of yesteryear through the decades to present day. How close can we get? Running everything on ONE tiny box. The ultimate in signal-to-size ratio. Being PC on PC, it's a good experience overall. Perhaps better because of adjustable speed and configuration convenience.

 

In my world, emulation and real hardware are highly complimentary. Emulation lets me keep the miles off of the stuff I had as a kid.

[Asaki]

On 9/30/2021 at 11:12 AM, oo7 said:

the is nothing classic about it. Do your homework and you will see what I mean, heck you can even enable native 16 bit support on Windows 10 32 bit. for this I would install secondary os 32 bit in dual boot and enable native 16 bit. then you have a system with true 32 bit and true 16 bit with modern hardware easy to find and the ability to then even drop to native dos mode.

I mean, sure, technically it might work, but how are you going to get audio support? Or gamepad support? Or MIDI? How do you slow the games down to a playable speed? What about VESA? Glide? 3D glasses? Composite CGA? Tandy color/audio? Floppy disk drive? LAN/modem?

[Keatah]

On 10/5/2021 at 7:56 PM, eightbit said:

Anybody who thinks "dosbox" is a suitable replacement for the real hardware experience obviously has no concept of the nostalgic tie some folks have to these machines. That is like saying "umm Stella" instead of using a real Atari 2600, controller, cartridge, CRT TV, paddles. It does not matter either if it is emulation or simulation. It is not the same as running on the real vintage hardware, period. Not nearly the same experience in the least. There is a reason people seek these machines.

Sure there are differences in DosBox vs a real 486.. But emulation may eventually be the only way to play the old games. I can't imagine anyone making those old motherboards and the necessary add-in cards in any kind of volume. There's an 8086 replacement I know of. But by and large, downloads of DosBox far exceed any production numbers.

[3DFXgamer]

Are you really comparing free downloadable software to physical hardware that costs money? For me, part of the fun of retro pcs, is being able to build and customize them to my liking. If those 8086 replacements were free downloads, I'm sure plenty of enthusiasts like myself would be all over them.

[bluejay]

1 hour ago, Keatah said:

Sure there are differences in DosBox vs a real 486.. But emulation may eventually be the only way to play the old games. I can't imagine anyone making those old motherboards and the necessary add-in cards in any kind of volume. There's an 8086 replacement I know of. But by and large, downloads of DosBox far exceed any production numbers.

Yeah, we can worry about the future in the future. For now, we have plenty of vintage hardware remaining and for many it’s a better way of enjoying old games than emulation. There no point in comparing.

[Keatah]

23 minutes ago, 3DFXgamer said:

Are you really comparing free downloadable software to physical hardware that costs money?

In a way I suppose so. The reasoning being that the physical hardware will be long gone some day. And either replacements will have to be made or a layer or two of emulators/virtualizers will need to be used. I do keep my vintage 486, P-III, and P-m around and in top shape. But I do my oldschool PC gaming on an i9 with whatever emu gets the job done. It's part of my "All-In-One philosophy" which I ramble on about from time to time.

 

23 minutes ago, 3DFXgamer said:

For me, part of the fun of retro pcs, is being able to build and customize them to my liking.

Oh sure. I used to do that for a long time. Got tired of all the stuff that kept accumulating. So I focused on 3 machines to stay period correct. They're rather set in stone so no major changes are expected.

 

23 minutes ago, 3DFXgamer said:

If those 8086 replacements were free downloads, I'm sure plenty of enthusiasts like myself would be all over them.

IIRC the docs and Gerbers are for free. But the parts and effort? That's on you!!

[Keatah]

2 minutes ago, bluejay said:

Yeah, we can worry about the future in the future. For now, we have plenty of vintage hardware remaining and for many it’s a better way of enjoying old games than emulation. There no point in comparing.

The future is now. We are time traveling there at the rate of one second per second. So I wanna be ready.

 

A fine advantage of emulation & virtualization is that the speed of the target platform can be adjusted. Zero need to have multiple machines spanning all kindsa MHz.

 

Setting up and adjusting emulators is the future of vintage hardware configuration. Some rules are different. Some the same. But I'm pretty much done with the screwdrivers and berg jumpers.

 

Having said that it is my intent to maintain my 3 vintage PCs along with the Apple II paraphernalia.

[derSammler]

17 minutes ago, Keatah said:

The reasoning being that the physical hardware will be long gone some day.

True, but for systems like a 386 and up, this will take many, many decades to happen. These were all made way into the 90s and there's even hardware around from the 60s that is still working fine. So even without knowing your age, I can safely assume that neither you nor I will witness the dying of the last working 386 or 486-based PC.

Edited October 8, 2021 by derSammler

[bluejay]

40 minutes ago, Keatah said:

The future is now. We are time traveling there at the rate of one second per second. So I wanna be ready.

 

A fine advantage of emulation & virtualization is that the speed of the target platform can be adjusted. Zero need to have multiple machines spanning all kindsa MHz.

 

Setting up and adjusting emulators is the future of vintage hardware configuration. Some rules are different. Some the same. But I'm pretty much done with the screwdrivers and berg jumpers.

 

Having said that it is my intent to maintain my 3 vintage PCs along with the Apple II paraphernalia.

Cool. Anyways, like all of us have been saying over and over, emulation is neat and all, but it’s not a perfect replacement for original hardware. We all still have our old hardware and there’s no reason for us to choose emulation over that hardware. It’s just not the same. It’s not like there’s gonna be an “emulator shortage” when the inevitable happens and all old hardware cease to function. Like I said, we can worry about jacking off alone after your partner’s already dumped you. 

Edited October 8, 2021 by bluejay

[Keatah]

Emulator shortage, my ass! That'll be the day..

 

 

[schnuth]

This is the worst example of thread crapping I've seen on here in quite awhile.  I'm pretty surprised a mod hasn't stepped in yet.

 

How much for the PC, and where are you located?

 

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by schnuth

[zzip]

On 10/5/2021 at 8:56 PM, eightbit said:

Anybody who thinks "dosbox" is a suitable replacement for the real hardware experience obviously has no concept of the nostalgic tie some folks have to these machines. That is like saying "umm Stella" instead of using a real Atari 2600, controller, cartridge, CRT TV, paddles. It does not matter either if it is emulation or simulation. It is not the same as running on the real vintage hardware, period. Not nearly the same experience in the least. There is a reason people seek these machines. 

I've got my old 486 and K6-2 PC's in the basement, but in all honesty I'd rather use Dosbox.   If these old systems are in high demand maybe I should sell them.  Seems like just a few years ago you couldn't give them away!

[Keatah]

53 minutes ago, schnuth said:

This is the worst example of thread crapping I've seen on here in quite awhile.  I'm pretty surprised a mod hasn't stepped in yet.

 

How much for the PC, and where are you located?

Bullshit. The thread is staying at the top thanks to all the off-topic discussion.

[cwilbar]

The PC has been sold.  But anyone else interested in DOS PCs can PM me.  I have lots of PC stuff and can put together another. 

 

In 386 generation stuff I think I have a 386 motherboard, a 486SLC motherboard, possibly one more, then I have a few 486 mainboards, and even more pentium mainboards.

I have some AMD Athlon/Duron boards, maybe a PPro or 2, and Pentium II/III stuff.  And I have a supply of cases.  So I can put something together for any of those generations.

 

 

[ClassicGMR]

On 10/5/2021 at 8:56 PM, eightbit said:

My first PC running DOS was an 386SX-16

Mmmmm... Tandy 1000 386SX-33 with the 512k Video RAM upgrade. Dammit now I want to go play 7th Guest and Star Control II again.

[eightbit]

7 hours ago, ClassicGMR said:

Mmmmm... Tandy 1000 386SX-33 with the 512k Video RAM upgrade. Dammit now I want to go play 7th Guest and Star Control II again.

 

By the rationale of some you should be able to get that same good old experience you did with that excellent Tandy 1000 with DOSBox. Now what do you think about that  

[ClassicGMR]

9 hours ago, eightbit said:

By the rationale of some you should be able to get that same good old experience you did with that excellent Tandy 1000 with DOSBox. Now what do you think about that  

Try telling that to Velocity's Jet Fighter II. AWESOME game that DOSBox never runs right. But what do I know?

[cwilbar]

On 10/15/2021 at 6:12 PM, ClassicGMR said:

Mmmmm... Tandy 1000 386SX-33 with the 512k Video RAM upgrade. Dammit now I want to go play 7th Guest and Star Control II again.

If I recall my Tandy line properly (and I've had a few), I believe it sounds like you are referring to the Tandy 2500 and not the 1000.  The 1000s were 8086 and 80286 machines I believe.  The 2500 was an 386SX-33 (I use one for running my DOS based EPROM burners).

 

The 1000 and 1000A are 8088, and the 1000TX is a 286.  There was also an HX, TL, RL, and probably a few others.  I'm not familiar with their specs offhand.

[cwilbar]

In a place where so many are into retro hardware, why is retro PC hardware so polarizing between emulation and real hardware ?

 

If you don't have the space, or aren't after the physical experience and want to .... use an emulator.  But I can't understand why those that are not interested in the physical experience keep 'bible thumping' about emulators.....  to each their own.

 

I prefer real hardware myself.  I've run emulators at various times.... and I use Altirra to verify operation of my own disk images I've made with a Supercard Pro.... 

 

Lets stop 'arguing' about it, and let each other enjoy the experiences they want to in the way they want to.

 

[+OLD CS1]

4 hours ago, cwilbar said:

In a place where so many are into retro hardware, why is retro PC hardware so polarizing between emulation and real hardware ?

Back in 1995, I got banned from #Amiga for asking about UAE.  Now it is all the rage!

[cwilbar]

At least for tings like the Amiga and some other platforms, I wonder if emulators have become more accepted because the price of entry for real hardware has shot up more than many are willing to pay.

 

Thanks all even for the back and forthing that occurred here.... it probably kept the post alive long enough for the new owner to find it ?

 

[Keatah]

On 10/16/2021 at 10:17 AM, ClassicGMR said:

Try telling that to Velocity's Jet Fighter II. AWESOME game that DOSBox never runs right. But what do I know?

What seems to be the issue with JF2 in DosBox? I hadn't noticed any problems in either the official build of DosBox or in the expanded DosBox-X.

 

Also have it working on my real 486 DX2-50.

[Keatah]

On 10/16/2021 at 5:40 PM, cwilbar said:

In a place where so many are into retro hardware, why is retro PC hardware so polarizing between emulation and real hardware ?

It's probably not as polarizing as it appears. Real hardware enthusiasts like to call emulation fake. And emulation enthusiasts like to boast about extraordinary convenience, reliability, and versatility. I love bragging about my SFF All-In-One PC, at every opportunity I get.

 

I don't doubt there's more dynamics at work here.

 

On 10/16/2021 at 10:09 PM, OLD CS1 said:

Back in 1995, I got banned from #Amiga for asking about UAE.  Now it is all the rage!

25 years is a long time. Things change. UAE has grown up and matured. Attitudes have matured.

 

On 10/17/2021 at 1:04 PM, cwilbar said:

At least for tings like the Amiga and some other platforms, I wonder if emulators have become more accepted because the price of entry for real hardware has shot up more than many are willing to pay.

That's one reason.  And then there's the reliability and repair factors. These old machines will require more and more technical expertise to keep them running in a reliable manner. Power supplies, re-capping, display and storage mods, and more, all of it takes some electronics knowledge.

 

Some people may just not want to play with all that. I know I don't. Not because of loss of interest or cost, but because of time and materials. With emulation I can just splurge on a tiny PC and poke away at setting up the various emulated systems on and off throughout the day. No cleanup or reorganizing afterwards. Just flip the power and segue into something else. And should anything go wrong with host hardware I can just throw it out and get new stuff.

 

Quote

Thanks all even for the back and forthing that occurred here.... it probably kept the post alive long enough for the new owner to find it ?

Possibly. Of course it did!

Edited October 18, 2021 by Keatah

[zzip]

6 hours ago, Keatah said:

It's probably not as polarizing as it appears. Real hardware enthusiasts like to call emulation fake. And emulation enthusiasts like to boast about extraordinary convenience, reliability, and versatility. I love bragging about my SFF All-In-One PC, at every opportunity I get.

 

I don't doubt there's more dynamics at work here.

And then there's the FGPA enthusiasts who believe what they are doing is superior to emulators and will also sneer at emulator users