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darryl1970

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4 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

Popcorn music is in the first thread.

Just to clarify: is sound still TIA-only as mentioned in the first post?  I can get TIA audio without difficulty, but no POKEY sounds.  Ballblazer and Commando are working fine in that regard, so it doesn't appear to be a POKEY issue.  This is on a Concerto running current firmware, FWIW.

 

BTW: I did manage to do something on level 2 that I've never seen on the arcade (or other) versions: in attempting to break an ice block with a sno-bee egg inside of it, I inadvertently pushed the block while it was flashing instead of breaking it.  The block slid vertically down the screen as would be expected, but deposited the egg on the playfield while the it was still in motion.  The egg hatched as normal, and the ice block continued flashing in its new location until the egg hatched.  Not something I'd seen happen before :D

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6 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

Just to clarify: is sound still TIA-only as mentioned in the first post?  I can get TIA audio without difficulty, but no POKEY sounds.  Ballblazer and Commando are working fine in that regard, so it doesn't appear to be a POKEY issue.  This is on a Concerto running current firmware, FWIW.

The left difficulty switches between TIA and POKEY. The last I tried my Concerto, I had POKEY sound, but it wasn't perfect. The Concerto firmware has issues with POKEY. Make sure the left difficulty is switched to the correct position though.

 

The right switch is the selector between Popcorn and the good tune.

6 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

 

BTW: I did manage to do something on level 2 that I've never seen on the arcade (or other) versions: in attempting to break an ice block with a sno-bee egg inside of it, I inadvertently pushed the block while it was flashing instead of breaking it.  The block slid vertically down the screen as would be expected, but deposited the egg on the playfield while the it was still in motion.  The egg hatched as normal, and the ice block continued flashing in its new location until the egg hatched.  Not something I'd seen happen before :D

That's really cool that you noticed this. I added that by design. I know this happens on the 5200 version. I could have sworn I've had it happen on the arcade version before, which is why I implemented it that way. You have me wanting to check. Here we go.

 

Note: This is a very hard thing to coordinate, but it looks as if the game gets confused when this happens, based off of the two examples below:

 

This may be a complete FLUKE, but this is very interesting. I said it before, "The arcade has a lot of buggy behavior." It's possible that cheats could cause side effects, but I don't see how this would be connected.

 

1. It's almost as if there wasn't a place to hatch, so it hatched at the upper left of the playfield. Who knows?

 

 

 

2. It looks like it confused the game this time. A snow-bee was hatched, but it's not really there. Due to that, the last egg won't hatch. I forgot that I had cheat on. I wonder if it would have killed me if I turned cheat off.

 

I feel comfortable dismissing the fact there was a cheat code, because I have seen glitchy things like this in a normal Pengo game before. I have noticed these things in MAME. I also have Pengo on my Multi-Pac-Man arcade mod. I have seen weird things there too. Granted that they could each introduce their own issues, but they are pretty consistent across the board. It's just almost impossible to recreate this timing perfectly without getting killed first. That is another reason why I chose to create a hybrid of the arcade and 5200 version. I hope it turns out to be a little more fair and the best of both worlds.

 

This was fun. Hope you all enjoy.

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5 hours ago, Jaden (JRH) said:

Pengo just feels better when it's playing stolen copyrighted music in the background.

Seriously though, I think Popcorn is a much more fitting tune and I appreciate the option for it. This is shaping up to be one of my favorite 7800 homebrews ever!

I guess it depends on what strikes the  nostalgic chord inside. That is why I included it.

 

I was a little taken back when I first played a Popcorn machine. I do like the music, and I find it fitting. I just relate more to the Alternate music, because I grew up with that. Plus, I thought the maze drawing was a little distracting.

I also find the alternate tune to be special, because it was made specifically for Pengo. It didn't exist before the game. To me, one thing that makes actual classic games special is that they had sound effects and music that didn't exist before each game was created.

 

I have considered alternating between the two tunes. That way nobody will ever miss that there are different tunes.

If I knew that Concerto would someday be able to detect POKEY present, I would also code it to automatically switch between POKEY and TIA.

As of right now, some Concertos don't play well with the music.

 

Still trying to decide the best way to handle everything.

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3 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

The left difficulty switches between TIA and POKEY. The last I tried my Concerto, I had POKEY sound, but it wasn't perfect. The Concerto firmware has issues with POKEY. Make sure the left difficulty is switched to the correct position though.

Understood.  I'm pretty sure that I tried the switches in all four possible positions, but will double-check later.  If it works, I'll write an eating-my-words post :D

3 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

That's really cool that you noticed this. I added that by design. I know this happens on the 5200 version. I could have sworn I've had it happen on the arcade version before, which is why I implemented it that way. You have me wanting to check. Here we go.

Thanks, and that explains why it seemed new to me :D Having said that, I don't believe that I've seen it happen on the arcade version, but that doesn't mean that it couldn't.  More:

3 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

1. It's almost as if there wasn't a place to hatch, so it hatched at the upper left of the playfield. Who knows?

It almost looks as if the egg counter over- (or under-) flowed and that was the result.  The only thing I'm basing that on, though, is the behaviour when the 'last' sno-bee is crushed in the bottom right-hand corner of the playfield: the block that it was crushed with is flashing at the same time as the last sno-bee hatches in the upper-left corner, but the flashing stops while that sno-bee is moving towards the lower left-hand corner.  What's weird is that it seems like there's always one more sno-bee on the playfield than there should be based on the egg counter.  Kinda wonder what happened earlier on in the round.

3 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

2. It looks like it confused the game this time. A snow-bee was hatched, but it's not really there. Due to that, the last egg won't hatch. I forgot that I had cheat on. I wonder if it would have killed me if I turned cheat off.

I have seen behaviour like this in MAME with cheats enabled in Pengo before.  Don't want to go so far as to say that that was the cause in this particular instance, but it looks familiar to me.

3 hours ago, darryl1970 said:

I feel comfortable dismissing the fact there was a cheat code, because I have seen glitchy things like this in a normal Pengo game before. I have noticed these things in MAME. I also have Pengo on my Multi-Pac-Man arcade mod. I have seen weird things there too. Granted that they could each introduce their own issues, but they are pretty consistent across the board. It's just almost impossible to recreate this timing perfectly without getting killed first.

Agreed, and this is why I'm hesitant to definitively point the finger at cheats as the cause: Pengo is known to have some occasionally-glitchy (or at least unexpected) behaviour even on original hardware.  I've owned both the upright and cocktail versions at different times, and both have shown me their share of strangeness.

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Sorry for the double-update, but I got a lot of puzzle pieces and things just came together. I think this is worth updating over this morning's release.

 

The sound engine has been cleaned up a little, and this includes Popcorn music when Pokey is not present. It can be found in the first post!

 

I am concerned that some may eventually not realize that POKEY is available (those who have their left difficulty in one place), and some may not realize there is an alternate background tune (those who have the right difficulty switch in one place).

 

When I first tried Tower Toppler, my difficulty switch was in the position to skip levels. I just thought the game was unplayable and put it up.(It's still pretty unplayable IMO.)

 

The only change I see making is that I may possibly make the tunes alternate. That doesn't solve the POKEY problem. Since Pokey can't always be detected at this time, I have concerns using auto-detect.

Edited by darryl1970
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4 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

Understood.  I'm pretty sure that I tried the switches in all four possible positions, but will double-check later. 

You probably did.

4 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

If it works, I'll write an eating-my-words post :D

You won't eat your words.

 

POKEY doesn't play on my Concerto any more either. I don't know if there's much that I can do about it, because everything is properly executed.

 

My understanding is that there will be a future firmware to address the issue that Concerto has with POKEY at the $450 location. (I think that's the basic idea.)

I believe it has to do with the address location where POKEY is located and the cartridge scheme, which is why Ballblazer and Commando work fine.

 

I burnt it to a dedicated cart and play it on my Dragonfly without an issue.

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7 minutes ago, darryl1970 said:

My understanding is that there will be a future firmware to address the issue that Concerto has with POKEY at the $450 location. (I think that's the basic idea.)

I believe it has to do with the address location where POKEY is located and the cartridge scheme, which is why Ballblazer and Commando work fine.

Ah, yeah, known issue with the Concerto at this time.  I'd forgotten about it until you jogged my memory :D

 

Still, the port's coming along beautifully.  It's interesting for me to play because I'm very familiar with the arcade version, but not so much with the 5200 one.  That helps to keep things fresh, and it does have me coming back for more.

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2 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

Ah, yeah, known issue with the Concerto at this time.  I'd forgotten about it until you jogged my memory :D

Yeah. :(

2 hours ago, x=usr(1536) said:

Still, the port's coming along beautifully.  It's interesting for me to play because I'm very familiar with the arcade version, but not so much with the 5200 one.  That helps to keep things fresh, and it does have me coming back for more.

Thank you. The 5200 was a lot of fun. Mine is a hybrid. It's more forgiving, like the 5200, but you can still miss a snow-bee if it's not lined up perfectly.

 

The 5200 is funny, because 5200 Pengo can have multiple iceblocks moving at one time.

 

In the clip below, I even captured the rare occurrence, where Pengo is pushing the same block multiple times (Last star block).

I stuck to the arcade on this, but Pengo recovers faster in the 7800 version. I think it makes the game a little more fair.

This was a killer conversion for back in the day! The music and sound effects are great too.

 

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25 minutes ago, Jinks said:

Watching that last video I have no idea why someone would want the generic popcorn music in the background to cheapen the game.

Personal preference, and to each their own.  I prefer Popcorn, others prefer the alternate tune.  No big deal.

25 minutes ago, Jinks said:

Each game should have it's own music.

It does, across multiple ROM sets on the arcade version.  This one alternates between the two.  Best of both worlds.

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@Jinks & @x=usr(1536), thanks for the different viewpoints.

 

I get the "purist" mentality. I have it myself, but the original arcade version did use the Popcorn music. I figure kind of like the best of both worlds now.

 

There is a code that can allow players to override the alternating tunes, so I think I've covered all bases!

 

:)

 

If you notice, my video is a recording of my CRT. I can't stand the way the classics look without scanlines. I think it looks so much sharper (when full screen), as opposed to flat and blocky. I can deal with the focus issues at times, because it feels more authentic to me.

Edited by darryl1970
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1 hour ago, darryl1970 said:

@Jinks & @x=usr(1536), thanks for the different viewpoints.

 

I get the "purist" mentality. I have it myself, but the original arcade version did use the Popcorn music. I figure kind of like the best of both worlds now.

 

There is a code that can allow players to override the alternating tunes, so I think I've covered all bases!

 

:)

 

If you notice, my video is a recording of my CRT. I can't stand the way the classics look without scanlines. I think it looks so much sharper (when full screen), as opposed to flat and blocky. I can deal with the focus issues at times, because it feels more authentic to me.


Music tastes aside, you've done a fine job with TIA+POKEY harmonies.

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@darryl1970 Thanks very much for sharing your amazing port of Pengo! I have been meaning to post on this for a while. Tried it again this morning with my kids, and they loved it! This has been a missing masterpiece on the 7800. I think everything is rock-solid so far! I love both TIA and pokey sounds so far. I don’t know what people are talking about with this “Popcorn” tune, but I will give it a listen.

 

When are these latest two masterpieces going to be available in the AA store?

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2 hours ago, phattyboombatty said:

@darryl1970 Thanks very much for sharing your amazing port of Pengo! I have been meaning to post on this for a while. Tried it again this morning with my kids, and they loved it! This has been a missing masterpiece on the 7800. I think everything is rock-solid so far! I love both TIA and pokey sounds so far. I don’t know what people are talking about with this “Popcorn” tune, but I will give it a listen.

 

When are these latest two masterpieces going to be available in the AA store?

I think Popeye might be close.

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