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Best RGB mod?


grips03

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5 hours ago, grips03 said:

With the current 3 RGB mods:

Unstablewarpfield

Yannick

Crayola

 

Which one is the best and available for purchase that works with OSSC?  I'm looking to buy two mod board one for Intv 1 and one for Intv 2 - NTSC.

Is Unstablewarpfield's RGB available yet? Last post about it stated he still wanted to test it on other scalers and TVs before releasing the project. In my case, I would need a source for pre made boards to buy and offer for installs and would need to test it for myself.

 

But between Crayola's and Yannicks which, I've installed and used both quite a bit here is my take.

 

Yannicks boards were less expensive but can ONLY do RGB output from them and still aren't currently available just yet. The one you saw in the ZPH stream is the 1.2 board and still required me to hand solder a few components on those initial boars to correct for some sync issues they had. However, Yannick has told me that his new v2 boards are done and tested and I should be able to get some in the near future. From what I've seen, his new boards look pretty much exactly the same as the 1.2 but with the fixes implemented that I did manually on the previous ones.

 

Crayon King's boards cost a little more, but his have more features. You can have both RGB and YUV Component as outputs. You can wire in a switch or repurpose the channel select switch (If you remove the RF) to handle the switching between them. If you purchase his expansion board, then you can also add a new composite and s-video output. Currently you give up the YUV component ability if you order his RGB board and expansion the way they arrive and install. There is also the ability to select between 2 different programmed palettes.

 

So I ask you  @grips03 which output connection and cable will you be using or need to use?

 

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10 hours ago, grips03 said:

I will only use RGB SCART.  Mostly to OSSC and sometimes to Sony PVMs.

Then I would think that either Yannick's or Crayolas should work fine for you. But given the current situation, Crayola's is the only one that is actually currently available to the best of my knowledge. I know that Yannick's new v2.0 board is done and tested, but initial shipments of that board haven't gone out to distros just yet.

 

21 hours ago, Black_Tiger said:

Do the Yannick and Crayola boards both have correct color?

 

My SVA has an RGB mod by that juicebox guy. The colors are off and the picture becomes unstable after a while with my framemeister. It worked fine on my crt transcoded to component.

Both Yannick's and Crayola's boards provide a stable picture for me on my setup at least. I don't have an FM but my understanding is that the FM is much more tolerant of odd signals vs most other devices. At this point I would say it is safe to assume that anything that is stable on the OSSC and Tink devices is likely to work just fine on the FM as well?

 

As for colors, that is speculative. I find that Yannick's colors are more accurate to what we see in emulation. Whereas Crayola's palettes do make some games look better.

 

Another thing to be aware of between these two boards, is that if you plan to use sega RGB SCART cables, then you are likely better off with Yannick's board for that. If you go with Crayola's board and use his default palette, it will produce a darker image compared to most. You either have to remove the resistors from within the SCART housing or what I've been doing is using the alternate palette on his board as it seems to produce brighter colors for some reason. Yannick's board allows for you to easily bypass the output resistors on his board with vias in front and behind those resistors so you can bypass them if you find the output too dark. I actually don't and leave them in place even with my Genesis RGB cables I've been using.

 

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My rgb mod was only a prototype. It works on my setup but instead of completing it I went on and changed the design from two pld's to an fpga. Formfactor remains thesame. I am in the process of writing code but things got interrupted by some house remoddeling. Feels like something to complete around the holidays. I have some more free time then. I also still have the replacement power supply for the intv 1 to complete... so many projects...

Verstuurd vanaf mijn SM-N960F met Tapatalk

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21 hours ago, grips03 said:

Is there a timeframe for Yannick board to being in stock? 

Is Yannick a username on AA and do we send a PM to order?

I do not have an exact timeframe and yes Yannick is a member here. However, Yannick's boards will only be available through Console5.com once they do become available. I'm sure I will be one of the first to know when C5 has that first initial shipment of his new boards in stock.

 

If you need RGB now, then Crayon's board is available to buy on ebay. While I only did an install video for his older version board and used YUV component output. His current board installs in the same fashion with the same pad/pinouts as the previous and the RGB install is the same minus wiring up for YUV and including the +5 and Sync to the RGB output mini din or output port of your choosing.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/284134846315?hash=item4227c1af6b:g:Gl0AAOSw7G9g5N8S

 

I'm hoping I get another request soon to install one of Crayon's boards again into a model 1 type Intellivision so I can video that process along with Yannick's that I have now.

 

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Hi,

 

I’m Yannick.

The new v2.0 boards production is finished and will be shipped to Console5 after final inspection is done.

 

There will be certainly some time needed for them to gather the other parts (cables and connectors) before they will have them available for purchase.

 

Edited by YannAros
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@grips03 I haven't tried YannAros mod yet, but I plan to. However, I do have a couple of Crayola's RGB mods installed (in both the Inty model II & a model 1 2609/SVA) and I'm very pleased with them both. I'm also running RGB Scart, pretty much exclusively (though YUV/component also looks great), 8-pin mini din (XRGB style) to Scart, into an OSSC, on a generic 4:3 profile and it looks incredible! ..Much better than the Kono RGB mod. The 2 color pallets are a nice option too and I tend to switch back & forth, depending on the game. Colors are accurate from what I can tell.

 

You can find Crayola's mod on ebay & he's quick to ship. Highly recommend!

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/RGB-YPbPr-Video-Kit-for-Intellivision-/284134846315?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m2548.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

 

Not sure if you plan on using a Genesis 2 cable or a 8-pin mini din to Euro Scart cable, which you probably have already, but just in case you don't, I recommend the Packapunch cable from Retro Gaming Cables out of the UK (about the only place that has this cable type in stock right now). They ship fast too, believe it or not.. Think I received mine less than 2 weeks after I ordered it, which is pretty good for something international. :)

 

https://www.retrogamingcables.co.uk/8PIN-MINI-DIN-TO-RGB-EUROSCART-TIM-WORTHINGTON-NES-RGB-ATARI-2600-HAS-SUPERGUN-Sega-Game-Gear-Philips-CDi-Colecovision-Intellivision-Panasonic-3DO?search=Nes

Edited by SiLic0ne t0aD
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22 hours ago, YannAros said:

Hi,

 

I’m Yannick.

The new v2.0 boards production is finished and will be shipped to Console5 after final inspection is done.

 

There will be certainly some time needed for them to gather the other parts (cables and connectors) before they will have them available for purchase.

 

Not sure that any cabling or connectors will be included as Console5 primarily exists for the DIY types. I suspect that the boards will only be provided as is with links to instructions and videos etc... on how to install them being provided from there. This way those that are installing them can use whatever connections and cables they might already have on hand or may want to use. I did my installs with 9-pin mini din because that is what I have on hand and also at the time was the only RGB SCART cables I've been using. I've now got an 8-pin RGB SCART cable for testing installs along with 8-pin mini din connectors for installs going forward.

 

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  • 1 month later...
On 11/18/2021 at 10:09 AM, YannAros said:

Yes and I bought two of them. One to replace the v1.2 I had and did the install video on and another to have on hand for anyone that wants one installed. Glad to say that in my initial testing the new v2 boards works exactly the same as the previous so that's good!

 

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On 11/21/2021 at 7:31 PM, Sinjinhawke said:


I ordered one.  Not sure what I will do with it yet.  I guess it does not come with an output connector so I would still need to source that and also decide which machine I would put it in. 

No the kits only come with the wire harnesses. Which, I was kinda surprised by at C5 usually just sells boards only. They don't provide an output connector because there isn't anyway to know what someone might want to use. I mainly use 9-pin mini din in my installs, but I have 8-pin mini din on hand as well in case my clients use that cable type. 

 

I won't likely ever use the wire harnesses because they would likely make he board sit too high for my bottom PCB mount installs I do on the Intelly 2. But the wires are still good and I would just clip the connectors off, strip and solder the wire to the vias directly that way.

 

I also noticed when I was capturing for a stream I did over the weekend, that Yannick's newer board plays better with my capture device vs the previous one. I've always gotten a stable picture with Yannick's v 1.2 board through my OSSC but every time I would try and capture directly from it, the image would have severe flicker in he captures. So even though it was all steady and stable on my actual TV, the odd vsync still from Yannick's boards was causing issues for my capture device. The newer boards still have an occasional blink here or there through the capture but when output in 2x mode it is nearly total stable now through my capture device. So that is a significant improvement on his newer 2.0 boards.

 

BTW I have created some mini din mount PCBs to try and help with Intellivision installs but haven't actually put one to use yet as I've not gotten any recent installation requests. Basically it is a 2.4mm thick PCB specifically designed for mounting a mini din connector upside down to solder it to the mount board. Then you solder up the mount board along the ground traces of the Intellivision where you can find room. There is a castinated via on either side of the mount board to help solder adhere and come up over the thick PCB. I also designed new break out boards for the 8-pin mini din connectors I have on hand to make soldering wires much easier as well.

 

2095937236_din_mount__8pin_brkout.thumb.jpg.c2e01073dbf7934bb1838039573153a8.jpg

 

din_mnt_connector_combo.thumb.jpg.357954e401fb3add9bcf08c227d16285.jpg

 

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On 11/23/2021 at 11:17 AM, -^CrossBow^- said:

No the kits only come with the wire harnesses. Which, I was kinda surprised by at C5 usually just sells boards only. They don't provide an output connector because there isn't anyway to know what someone might want to use. I mainly use 9-pin mini din in my installs, but I have 8-pin mini din on hand as well in case my clients use that cable type. 

Noob question having never done this mod before. (I have opened a few Intellivision's to replace bad RAM and other parts)  If I secure a mini 9 pin din I would then need a Genesis 2 SCART cable that would run to something like the RetroTINK 2X SCART?

 

Are there other options for RGB out with the Yannick v2.0 boards?  My TV has RGB input, is there connector to go direct to the RGB input or I will need something like the RetroTINK in between.

 

You also refer to 8 pin mini din.  What are the advantages to using that over 9 pin?

 

Cheers

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You can use whatever outputs you want for RGB. Most RGB requires at least the R,G,B and Sync signals plug ground of course. The +5 is really only provided for some selector and autoswitchers to detect the signal as being active. Also some of the directly plug in type converters require the +5 to power them internally.

 

The ONLY difference between using an 8pin or 9pin aside from the extra pin on the 9pin is how they are wired up and form factor for the pin layouts on the output side. The 9th pin is common for use with Sega Genesis/MD model 2 and 32x systems because that 9th pin provides a composite output signal on it. So, if you were to wire up a composite upgrade in addition to the RGB, then you just wire the composite output video to the cvid pin on that 9pin output. That would allow for the use of Sega Genesis standard AV or RGB cables in that case and I mainly use the 9pin because a LOT of RGB stuff uses that particular mini din. Most of the PCE/TG-16 AV upgrades for instance will feature it. Naturally when doing the triple bypass RGB upgrade on a model 1 Genesis, most installers will solder in a 9-pin mini din so that Genesis 2 cables are then used.

 

The 8-pin and 9-pin mini din that I have on hand, are both the same size so my little mount PCB I designed can be used with either for my installs.

 

Some kits like Crayon's will actually include an 8-pin panel mount mini din. The different being that a panel mount is designed to attach to the shell directly. In the case of the ones provided in lots of kits, you have to epoxy or hot glue the ports in place. The ones I normally use and provide in my installs are PCB mount mini din designed to be soldered onto the PCB. I solder them upside down using the out metal housing as the support for the entire thing when soldering it onto the ground traces. Those outer metal housings are usually attached to the ground pin on the connector as well so you don't have to run a dedicated ground wire to the connector when the entire thing soldered down to the ground trace of plane anyway. There are a few however where the outer metal housing might not actually be attached to ground and in those instances, you either need to run a dedicated ground wire to the ground pin on the mini din or in the case of my breakout PCBs, I have the large anchors that are attached to the outer metal housing, soldered onto the ground plane that the ground pin is also attached to. Again, I'm doing that to make sure I have a good ground connection to everything.

 

So hopefully that helps answer a bit? Again, the only difference in summary between the two is where the signals are wired to what pins, and the fact that the 9pin has the extra pin for a separate composite video signal to also be ran and used if needed.

 

I have breakout PCBs for both that I use in my installs to help with soldering everything in and looking nice in the process.

 

 

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Yeah, I noticed the breakout PCB's.  They look pretty helpful.  And the little board underneath the din to elevate it so the cable fits easier.  All very professional looking.

 

Thanks for the feedback.  I'll probably try to grab a 9 pin and work from there.  Project for the new year once I'm done attempting to recap a Mac LC475 PSU.  Can't believe the price people ask for replacements.

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2 hours ago, Sinjinhawke said:

Yeah, I noticed the breakout PCB's.  They look pretty helpful.  And the little board underneath the din to elevate it so the cable fits easier.  All very professional looking.

 

Thanks for the feedback.  I'll probably try to grab a 9 pin and work from there.  Project for the new year once I'm done attempting to recap a Mac LC475 PSU.  Can't believe the price people ask for replacements.

You are absolutely correct in regards to the PCB board for mounting the mini din. I've currently been using standard perfboard that I was cutting to about the same size as the mini din, soldering that to the mini din and then soldering the whole thing down. Even with the standard 1.6mm thickness of the perfboard, it still wasn't quite tall enough to clear the RF opening without still having to use my small files to remove about 1mm of plastic towards the upper portion of the case. These PCBs mounts are 2.4mm thick and should allow for proper clearance without having to modify or enlarge the RF opening if you mount them there. In the example I show above of it being place, that would actually require me to drill out a 1/2" opening for the mini din but still would make it easier to drill in that hole and not have to use my files still to remove up by the top of the deck section of the bottom case. Anyway if you are interested, let me know when you are ready to do it and I can send you a break out for either 9 or 8 pin mini din along with the mount board for about $5 + 1st class shipping.  

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17 hours ago, grips03 said:

Installed Yannick 2.0 board.  Works great.  I can confirm it works perfect with OSSC and Sony PVM.  Its nice that it comes with the wires and headers.

Working good in your PVM? I've got a commenter on my YT vid I did installing the older 1.2 board with the new 2.0 that says his upper 1/5 of the screen is all skewed looking. Since my little PVM only does composite and s-video I didn't have a way to confirm that or not so it good that you have it working well on yours. 

 

 

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