INCOGNITO ATARI 800 FJC FIRMWARE cannot access CF card

[fasteddy]

I have purchased and installed the Incognito Atari 800 with FJC Firmware but am having issues. I cannot access the CF card. In the main side loader menu -device I get SIDE: no media OK and an ERROR 139! This appears on the bottom of the screen where it normally says select device. If I hit return or press the joystick button ERROR 139! reappears. I have included a picture of the side loader screen. I have tried numerous CF cards including SANDISK ultra II 4GB, Transend CF300 4gb and a no name 32gb. I also purchased a 128mb CF to try but that also failed. I also tried one CF card that I later discovered was faulty because I could not access it on other devices as well and with that card I got only a blank screen, as with the others I got the menu but with errors. I have tried reformatting the cards to fat32 and fat16 with no luck. Everything else seems to be working except that I cannot access the CF card. I have been able to load programs from cartridges or from devices connected to the SIO port. I have also booted into SpartaDOS and it seems that the CF card is not available their either. All the settings seem to be fine and in fact I got an email in response to my inquiry from vintagecomputercenter.com where I purchased the Incognito with pictures of the proper configuration. My configuration was close to theirs, but I changed it to be exact, and still no luck. Does anyone have any ideas to what the reason I cannot access the CF card could be? Are there any installation errors etc. that could lead to not being able to access the CF card? Any help would be appreciated.

[Beeblebrox]

@fasteddy  have you partitioned the cf card using fdisk? 

[fasteddy]

2 hours ago, Beeblebrox said:

@fasteddy  have you partitioned the cf card using fdisk? 

I cannot use fdisk because the CF card is not recognized.

[Mazzspeed]

2 hours ago, fasteddy said:

I cannot use fdisk because the CF card is not recognized.

the fdisk application is part of SDX and is therefore on the CAR: (cartridge) device.

[fasteddy]

2 hours ago, Mazzspeed said:

the fdisk application is part of SDX and is therefore on the CAR: (cartridge) device.

Yes I am aware of that. I can access fdisk, but the CF card is not recognized. The only message I get in fdisk if I try using it is "No APT devices found". As stated even though I have a CF card installed under Side Loader's device menu it states "no media" and again I have tried a number of CF cards. Also if I am correct, I don't necessarily have to use fdisk to use the CF card if all I want to do is put Atari disk images and executables on the Fat32 partition and access them that way I should be able to do that? In my case I cannot because Incognito is not seeing the media.

 

[Beeblebrox]

@fasteddy  As Mazzspeed mentioned you can just type Fdisk at the SpartaDosX prompt...

 

and 

 

.... here ya go: https://atari8.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/APT-Software-Manual-8th-Edition.pdf

 

To quote from top of page 3 of FJC's (Flashjazzcat's) manual:

 

"FDISK: Initialisation and Disk Partitioning

Before using a disk, it must first be initialised. I assume you already have the host adapter attached to the Atari, and whichever BIOS or driver installed and working. Power on the machine and boot whichever version of DOS you prefer to use (SpartaDOS X is not a requirement, although its use is optimal). If you are using a disk of Compact Flash card without any APT partitioning information on it, the driver may report “No partitions”, or simply respond “Device does not respond” when attempts are made to access drives other than D1:. This is normal, since we have not yet partitioned the disk."

 

also watch:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgqXwCEjXew

 

Basically withn the Incognito you can't essentially just format the Compact flash (CF) card on your PC, put games , etc on the card, then put it into the Incognito board and access them straight away.

 

First you need to prepare the card and create the partitions using Fdisk on the 800, where you can create an Atari Partition that is accessable in both the Sideloader and SpartaDosX, and the FAT32 partition which is accessable in the SIDE loader only AFAIK. After doing so, you can use SpartaDosX 's format function to format the Atari partition only. Then you take the CF out of the Incognito board once more, pop it back in the PC, and format the FAT32 partition on your PC that you created on the 800 via Fdisk. 

 

It's only then you can load the latter FAT32 partition with games, etc on the PC. Then when you pop it back in the Incognito, you'll see both partitions are accessable in the Side loader.

 

Once done you can save files directly to the Atari partition in the SpartaDosX environment, which includes copying files from other SIO devices (SIO2PC via RespeQt on your PC, SDrive Max, other SIO2PC devices, 1050 drives, etc etc).

 

Take note in the video and manual (page 8 I think), that the FAT32 partition cannot be higher than 31.9995MB otherwise it won't be recognised. So if you had, for example a 64GB CF, you would make sure the FAT32 partition wasn't higher than 31.9995MB when you create it in Fdisk.

 

The video is vey helpful, although bare in mind it was recorded in 2013 and the Fdisk version looks very slightly different. I still used both of these resources to guide me to partition and format my owm 2GB CF.

 

One thing - on my Windows laptop when I first plugged in the CF after initially creating the partitions, because of the way it was shown, I repeatedly mistook the APT (Atari) partition I'd created for the FAT32 one and kept formatting it, wiping it out. Then I wondered why it kept disappearing and I had create it all over again. After the 3rd attempt the penny dropped. So make sure when you first do it you are formatting the intended Fat32 partition on your PC.

 

Good luck.

Edited December 11, 2021 by Beeblebrox

[flashjazzcat]

There are absolutely no pre-requisites for the CF card to be recognized by the loader. Even it it was incorrectly formatted (with exFAT, for example, instead of the required FAT16/32), it would show up in the device menu. If it doesn't, you either have a hardware fault, or you somehow managed to select a bunch of CF cards which are incompatible with Incognito.

 

If you get 'No media' in the loader, it's pointless attempting to troubleshoot software any further.

 

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by flashjazzcat

[Beeblebrox]

3 hours ago, flashjazzcat said:

There are absolutely no pre-requisites for the CF card to be recognized by the loader. Even it it was incorrectly formatted (with exFAT, for example, instead of the required FAT16/32), it would show up in the device menu. If it doesn't, you either have a hardware fault, or you somehow managed to select a bunch of CF cards which are incompatible with Incognito.

 

If you get 'No media' in the loader, it's pointless attempting to troubleshoot software any further.

 

 

Ah thanks for clarifying.  

 

@fasteddy I wonder then, aside the CF cards themselves being faulty, whether the Incognito's CF socket has a connection issue, (bad contacts)?

Edited December 11, 2021 by Beeblebrox

[fasteddy]

3 hours ago, flashjazzcat said:

There are absolutely no pre-requisites for the CF card to be recognized by the loader. Even it it was incorrectly formatted (with exFAT, for example, instead of the required FAT16/32), it would show up in the device menu. If it doesn't, you either have a hardware fault, or you somehow managed to select a bunch of CF cards which are incompatible with Incognito.

 

If you get 'No media' in the loader, it's pointless attempting to troubleshoot software any further.

 

 

Thank you for your reply. Although it is possible that it is a CF card compatibility issue, I have tried various CF cards with the same results, so I am leaning toward it being a hardware fault. Could there be any mistake in my installation that could lead to not being able to access the CF card? I Gerry rigged the 6 pin harness below the 3 pin disk swap harness using individual wires as my kit did not come with the required harness. Could any wiring issue here or elsewhere lead to not being able to access the CF card? As stated everything else seems to be working except CF card access. I do have a new old stock Atari 800 motherboard that I was given. Another thing I was thinking of doing is to replace my exiting motherboard with this one, purchase a new power supply and CPU card, replacing the old ones and see what happens.

Edited December 11, 2021 by fasteddy

[fasteddy]

4 minutes ago, Beeblebrox said:

Ah thanks for clarifying.  

 

@fasteddy I wonder then, aside the CF cards themselves being faulty, whether the Incognito's CF socket has a connection issue, (bad contacts)?

Yes, the Incognito and the CF socket may be another issue. This may be a difficult problem to solve.

[Beeblebrox]

@fasteddy

 

I'll leave others to chime in re your MB. The 6 x signal wires on the P5 connector, if wired incorrectly I am pretty sure would result in you not being able to boot the machine up at all, or at least get as far as you can.  My gut tells me that the Incognito card's CF socket might have an issue.  

 

Yes the Incognito kit doesn't come with the 3 x pin P6 connector/cabling for the ATR swap button. Did you do the power light emitter mod for the ATR swap button incidentally, or have you created a separate ATR swap button elsewhere?

 

Also could you post some pics of the incognito, in particular the P5 and P6 connectors and if possible the MB with all the wiring. It all helps.

 

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by Beeblebrox

[+videofx]

I installed an incognito. Let me install a CF card and see what happens.

[fasteddy]

1 hour ago, Beeblebrox said:

@fasteddy

 

I'll leave others to chime in re your MB. The 6 x signal wires on the P5 connector, if wired incorrectly I am pretty sure would result in you not being able to boot the machine up at all, or at least get as far as you can.  My gut tells me that the Incognito card's CF socket might have an issue.  

 

Yes the Incognito kit doesn't come with the 3 x pin P6 connector/cabling for the ATR swap button. Did you do the power light emitter mod for the ATR swap button incidentally, or have you created a separate ATR swap button elsewhere?

 

Also could you post some pics of the incognito, in particular the P5 and P6 connectors and if possible the MB with all the wiring. It all helps.

 

 

I did a separate ATR swap button mounted near the power switch. I will try and post some more pictures at some point, but it may be awhile before I have a chance to do so.

[Beeblebrox]

1 minute ago, fasteddy said:

I did a separate ATR swap button mounted near the power switch. I will try and post some more pictures at some point, but it may be awhile before I have a chance to do so.

@fasteddy No worries.  Also which guide/instructions did you follow for the install just out of interest?

 

 

[fasteddy]

18 minutes ago, Beeblebrox said:

@fasteddy No worries.  Also which guide/instructions did you follow for the install just out of interest?

 

 

Mostly the ones provided by flashjazzcat. Other instructions were looked at as well, my CPU card was different then the ones in most of the videos, but there were instructions on the forums.

[Beeblebrox]

@fasteddy  Great, yes I was gonna say FJC's excellent vids are the ones I followed for both my two Incognito installs, and in fact the basis of my own detailed Step by step Incognito installation tutorial guide (created earlier this week funnily enough).

 

Yes when I did my first Incognito install I recall coming across the fact someone else on the forum had discovered that they had a variation of the CPU card/expansion board, (ANTIC, GTIA and 6502 in different positions). I can't recall where the post is but you'd still be connecting to pins 9 and 15 of Antic for the P5 connector pins 1 (Halt) and 6 (Rdy) I'd imagine.

 

So presumably you did the circuit mod for the ATR swap button as in FJC's video, where instead of the microswitch, you just wired in the external momentary SPST switch?

 

Did you purchase the Incognito with FJC's firmware preinstalled or did you flash FJC's firmware from the original Candle firmware?  If the latter - did you flash the full 512k incog.bios? Or did you flash the 3 x component bios files? Wonder if you has flash the firmware yourself whether it is worth reflashing it again?

 

One other thing - was the 800 running without any issues prior to undertaking the Incognito install?

 

 

Edited December 11, 2021 by Beeblebrox

[+videofx]

I followed @flashjazzcat install and my side seems to be working. I have a Kingston 4GB CF.

 

Maybe a problem with your incognito card and or CF socket.. 

 

Get a flashlight and look in the socket and see if there are any bent and or broken pins.

[Beeblebrox]

@videofx  Yup, worth ruling out a simple bad socket or just a faulty Incognito board. Luckily CF cards can only slide into the socket one way. (Unless, heh heh, somehow the card got crammed in back to front?! (Extremely unlikely of course)

[fasteddy]

21 hours ago, Beeblebrox said:

@fasteddy  Great, yes I was gonna say FJC's excellent vids are the ones I followed for both my two Incognito installs, and in fact the basis of my own detailed Step by step Incognito installation tutorial guide (created earlier this week funnily enough).

 

Yes when I did my first Incognito install I recall coming across the fact someone else on the forum had discovered that they had a variation of the CPU card/expansion board, (ANTIC, GTIA and 6502 in different positions). I can't recall where the post is but you'd still be connecting to pins 9 and 15 of Antic for the P5 connector pins 1 (Halt) and 6 (Rdy) I'd imagine.

 

So presumably you did the circuit mod for the ATR swap button as in FJC's video, where instead of the microswitch, you just wired in the external momentary SPST switch?

 

Did you purchase the Incognito with FJC's firmware preinstalled or did you flash FJC's firmware from the original Candle firmware?  If the latter - did you flash the full 512k incog.bios? Or did you flash the 3 x component bios files? Wonder if you has flash the firmware yourself whether it is worth reflashing it again?

 

One other thing - was the 800 running without any issues prior to undertaking the Incognito install?

 

 

I purchased the Incognito with FJC's firmware preinstalled. Even though I have not used this 800 that much it seemed to be running fine prior to installing the Incognito and still seems to be running OK other than not being able to access the CF card.

[fasteddy]

20 hours ago, videofx said:

I followed @flashjazzcat install and my side seems to be working. I have a Kingston 4GB CF.

 

Maybe a problem with your incognito card and or CF socket.. 

 

Get a flashlight and look in the socket and see if there are any bent and or broken pins.

I checked the pins in the Incognito CF socket with a flashlight and everything looked good.

[+videofx]

Then I would see if anyone near you has a board you can try to see if its the board

[Beeblebrox]

@fasteddy It would rather appear that given you have had no luck with multiple CF cards, and the seller who provided that card had pre-flashed that the board with FJC's firmware, that a logical assumption would be the board might have a particular issue with the socket or a component or connection to it on the PCB perhaps. Given it powers up and is working ok in all other respects, I guess you can assume your wiring, etc is ok.

 

Are you able to send the board back for a replacement?

 

One other thing - do the CF cards slide into the slot easily, with no resistance, front of CF card facing to the back of the 800 when in situ? You feel them engage once they hit the bottom of the socket to lock with the pins. I am just eliminating the possibility that they aren't going in slightly at angles because of a damaged socket somewhere down the line, or that they aren't stoping short of making full contact?

[fasteddy]

On 12/12/2021 at 3:30 PM, Beeblebrox said:

@fasteddy It would rather appear that given you have had no luck with multiple CF cards, and the seller who provided that card had pre-flashed that the board with FJC's firmware, that a logical assumption would be the board might have a particular issue with the socket or a component or connection to it on the PCB perhaps. Given it powers up and is working ok in all other respects, I guess you can assume your wiring, etc is ok.

 

Are you able to send the board back for a replacement?

 

One other thing - do the CF cards slide into the slot easily, with no resistance, front of CF card facing to the back of the 800 when in situ? You feel them engage once they hit the bottom of the socket to lock with the pins. I am just eliminating the possibility that they aren't going in slightly at angles because of a damaged socket somewhere down the line, or that they aren't stoping short of making full contact?

 

The CF cards were inserted properly and fully. There was no visible damage to the socket that I could see and I did examine it carefully. The Seller did suggest that I could send the Incognito back so he could check it on his system. I think that will be my next step.

[_The Doctor__]

what did your install look like, maybe it's good to double check that.

[candle]

please check U3 (on the bottom side of the board) for missaligment & short circuits on its pins