Scope for Falcon diagnostics, can anyone recommend one?

[Chandler]

Can anyone recommend a scope for fault finding a dead Falcon? ultimately one of these small LCD types would be good as found on ebay

 

Any help appreciated thanks 

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Scope is useful for repairs, but not sure that it is best for computers. Maybe some logic analyzer, or as some are called logic probe. They are multichannel - like 8-16 digital inputs, so can see more signals and their mutual timings, for instance. And it cost less in most cases.

[TGB1718]

11 hours ago, Chandler said:

ultimately one of these small LCD types would be good as found on ebay

They are only really ok for low frequencies in spite of what they quote, I bought one a few years ago

and found it's only good from low freq. to about 200KHz, after that they seem to be rather unstable and inaccurate.

 

I ended up buying a USB PicoScope for about £100, use it with a laptop and it's quite portable.

Use it all the time on Raspberry Pi, Arduino, etc. and my Atari 8 Bits and ST's

[Chandler]

Thanks for your replies

 

Ultimately i just want the scope for Atari ST / Falcon repairs

 

Checking clock signals to and from chips and Halt lines as per the Atari service manuals

 

Would this Pico scope be ok for this?

[TGB1718]

I bought a Picoscope 2204, dual channel 10MHz bandwidth, comes with 2 probes.

Also has a function generator for sine/square/triangle etc. waveforms up to 100KHz.

Like most things, the more you pay, the more you get

 

 

https://www.picotech.com/oscilloscope/2000/picoscope-2000-manuals

[bfollowell]

I purchased a Hantek DSO5102P last fall:

 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071P97RLC/

 

If I'd had the money at the time, I probably would've bought a comparable Rigol or Siglent model, which are actually about the same price now, but weren't a year ago. Still, I have been really pleased with my scope. As @ParanoidLittleMan mentioned, I don't use a scope as much as a simple digital multimeter or logic probe, but it definitely comes in handy for troubleshooting at times.

 

Edited December 14, 2021 by bfollowell

[Chandler]

Can a logic probe be used for checking CPU clocks and Halt lines?

 

I'm ultimately new to this so want something simple to understand and use

[TGB1718]

A logic probe will tell you if a node is  high/low or pulsing, you don't get to know the frequency though, just that it's switching,

some can be set to trigger on an event so if a node changes state it will capture that and store it until you reset it.

 

Logic probes are quite simple to use, scopes not so simple

 

[bfollowell]

2 hours ago, TGB1718 said:

A logic probe will tell you if a node is  high/low or pulsing, you don't get to know the frequency though, just that it's switching,

some can be set to trigger on an event so if a node changes state it will capture that and store it until you reset it.

 

Logic probes are quite simple to use, scopes not so simple

 

 

Definitely true, even for those of us that have experience with scopes, though it was thirty years in the past.

 

Logic probes are very easy to use, cheap, and quite useful, but there's only so much you can do with them. They're an extremely basic diagnostic tool. Very valuable in their own right, but very limiting in what you can do. If you're want to check clocks and frequencies, etc., there really is no cheap substitute for an oscilloscope.

 

[ijor]

1 hour ago, bfollowell said:

Logic probes are very easy to use, cheap, and quite useful, but there's only so much you can do with them. They're an extremely basic diagnostic tool. Very valuable in their own right, but very limiting in what you can do. If you're want to check clocks and frequencies, etc., there really is no cheap substitute for an oscilloscope.

 

A simple logic probe is indeed a very basic tool. But a logic analyzer can certainly check clocks and frequencies, you don't necessarily need a scope for this. A scope is better than a LA when you need to measure or test the analog properties of a signal, such as rise time, noise, overshooting, ground bounce, etc.

 

If all you want to see is if the clock is ticking or if the HALT signal was asserted, then a logic analyzer might be a better option.

[bfollowell]

19 minutes ago, ijor said:

 

A simple logic probe is indeed a very basic tool. But a logic analyzer can certainly check clocks and frequencies, you don't necessarily need a scope for this. A scope is better than a LA when you need to measure or test the analog properties of a signal, such as rise time, noise, overshooting, ground bounce, etc.

 

If all you want to see is if the clock is ticking or if the HALT signal was asserted, then a logic analyzer might be a better option.

 

True, true. I have a DMM, logic probe, and a scope, but I do not have an LA.

 

[+poobah]

I have a Rigol 1054Z that I really like for most go to things, along with an old HP 54645D MSO.