Mr SQL Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 5 hours ago, kid_snz said: Wow it's an amazing show and I really wanna go since I finally became one of those ATARI guys last year. people in this community may know about this expo I just randomly found recently and I might try this one first since I'm currently in the us. Has anyone ever been to this? http://www.retrogamingexpo.com/ Btw thank you so much for sharing the info here You're welcome! PRGE is an awesome show it reminds me of the expos from the 80's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dave C Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 New demo merging elements of other demos - splash screen from KevKelley (except mirrored, need to think about ways around that) - to get around the 6 sprite limit, I had some sprites be "shared". These don't flicker so much as blink on and off. I specifically chose sprites that should be player objectives, like the pretzel and/or delivery addresses. - more gameplay - the pretzel now grants immunity - you can now run out of lives - sounds when you get hit by a taxi - yes it's the Fugue in D Minor that I pulled code from various basic demos and transcribed the notes from Wikipedia pizza-boy-20210124.bin pizza-boy-20210124.bas 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 7 hours ago, Dave C said: New demo merging elements of other demos - splash screen from KevKelley (except mirrored, need to think about ways around that) - to get around the 6 sprite limit, I had some sprites be "shared". These don't flicker so much as blink on and off. I specifically chose sprites that should be player objectives, like the pretzel and/or delivery addresses. - more gameplay - the pretzel now grants immunity - you can now run out of lives - sounds when you get hit by a taxi - yes it's the Fugue in D Minor that I pulled code from various basic demos and transcribed the notes from Wikipedia pizza-boy-20210124.bin 16 kB · 4 downloads pizza-boy-20210124.bas 21.87 kB · 2 downloads I love the look. To rectify the mirrored splash screen, I had played around with using quad sized player sprites side by side to spell out the name and then do a symmetric pattern or drawing. I love how the items flash, the hitting of the car and changing player color. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dave C Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, KevKelley said: To rectify the mirrored splash screen, I had played around with using quad sized player sprites side by side to spell out the name and then do a symmetric pattern or drawing I like your title screen, it took me a minute to realize it was using the sprites. The item flashing was partly a way to get around the 6 sprite limit, it winds up having a 'Game & Watch' feel that seems appropriate. It does make it impossible to do a screenshot tho... and I'm not sure about the "dropoff marker", doesn't seem quite right how it looks / works but I needed some way to show where I was putting the hit box for deliveries. Edited January 24, 2022 by Dave C 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 51 minutes ago, Dave C said: I like your title screen, it took me a minute to realize it was using the sprites. The item flashing was partly a way to get around the 6 sprite limit, it winds up having a 'Game & Watch' feel that seems appropriate. It does make it impossible to do a screenshot tho... and I'm not sure about the "dropoff marker", doesn't seem quite right how it looks / works but I needed some way to show where I was putting the hit box for deliveries. Since the missiles are limited in height I thought of using a wide missile and then have it cycle up for four frames before starting back over... But I was having some issues with my code that I haven't had a chance to sit down and look at. What was stumping me was collision. And when I played around with screen height and pfres it seemed to drop the status bar and playfield down some pixels and have a graphical glitch at the top but with what I was playing around with I thought it looked neat, so now I'm looking at that idea to understand why it did that and what it does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dave C Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 5 hours ago, KevKelley said: And when I played around with screen height and pfres it seemed to drop the status bar and playfield down some pixels and have a graphical glitch at the top Yeah i've noticed that as well, I'm a little confused by what happens when I mess around with different playfield options - I assumed I was mis-counting the number of lines in my playfield data or something but now I'm not sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 25, 2022 Author Share Posted January 25, 2022 15 hours ago, Dave C said: New demo merging elements of other demos - splash screen from KevKelley (except mirrored, need to think about ways around that) - to get around the 6 sprite limit, I had some sprites be "shared". These don't flicker so much as blink on and off. I specifically chose sprites that should be player objectives, like the pretzel and/or delivery addresses. - more gameplay - the pretzel now grants immunity - you can now run out of lives - sounds when you get hit by a taxi - yes it's the Fugue in D Minor that I pulled code from various basic demos and transcribed the notes from Wikipedia pizza-boy-20210124.bin 16 kB · 10 downloads pizza-boy-20210124.bas 21.87 kB · 5 downloads Very impressed to see this new demo that now has all the functions we needed. It's only been 12 days since this thread was started, I was actually expecting more than 6 months to complete the project. I really like the idea of the drop off boxes. Perhaps making it people waiting for pizza would be a richer visual maybe? I'll try some different designs for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 25, 2022 Author Share Posted January 25, 2022 (edited) My friend gave me an idea to use Japanese since I am Japanese. I'm still not sure if that's a good idea or not, but since the name is meant to be a tribute to Paperboy, I think it might be better to keep it in English. FYI, the ピザ next to the building is actual code, the rest is Photoshop! Edited January 25, 2022 by kid_snz 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohl Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 On 1/20/2022 at 2:08 AM, Dave C said: That makes me wonder @kid_snz were you thinking about sounds (should there be sounds)? To add to the city feel, how about a police whistle sound (e.g. that police use when directing traffic) at random times or correlated somehow with the taxicabs? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 31 minutes ago, kid_snz said: My friend gave me an idea to use Japanese since I am Japanese. I'm still not sure if that's a good idea or not, but since the name is meant to be a tribute to Paperboy, I think it might be better to keep it in English. FYI, the ピザ next to the building is actual code, the rest is Photoshop! I like the use of Japanese. I think it adds to the aesthetic. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 25, 2022 Author Share Posted January 25, 2022 39 minutes ago, Sohl said: To add to the city feel, how about a police whistle sound (e.g. that police use when directing traffic) at random times or correlated somehow with the taxicabs? Yes we were thinking of a cab honk, but adding that whistle would make it even better. Btw, is it possible to have a gimmick that makes a sound when a cab approaches to the boy? But I still have a feeling that random sounds would not be a problem. Thank you for your comment anyway, I was playing your game the other day, and I have to say that I really enjoyed it. It's very unique and surprising in design and gameplay. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 29 minutes ago, kid_snz said: Yes we were thinking of a cab honk, but adding that whistle would make it even better. Btw, is it possible to have a gimmick that makes a sound when a cab approaches to the boy? But I still have a feeling that random sounds would not be a problem. Thank you for your comment anyway, I was playing your game the other day, and I have to say that I really enjoyed it. It's very unique and surprising in design and gameplay. My sound work is not the best and this example was a result of limited space, but this was a kind of recreation of my original Bag Boy game idea. The goal was to return the shopping cart while dodging cars (the blocks) which is a kind of similar idea to the pizza delivery. This sounds in this video were to kind of act like honking when a the player runs in front of a car. I suppose they could be made more horn like. I left it as is in this game because the fast movement made for some classic arcade style beep and boops that I like. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohl Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, kid_snz said: Yes we were thinking of a cab honk, but adding that whistle would make it even better. Btw, is it possible to have a gimmick that makes a sound when a cab approaches to the boy? But I still have a feeling that random sounds would not be a problem. Thank you for your comment anyway, I was playing your game the other day, and I have to say that I really enjoyed it. It's very unique and surprising in design and gameplay. This sound wiki has several examples of police/referee whistles. Here's one: https://soundeffects.fandom.com/wiki/Folkways_Records,_Police_Whistle Also has car horn beep/honks: https://soundeffects.fandom.com/wiki/Valentino_Car_Horn_02 ; https://soundeffects.fandom.com/wiki/Hollywoodedge,_Car_Horn_Honk_Close_Mi_CT052301 We could use these examples as reference as we try to make similar sounds with the TIA. I suppose someone could get fancy and download/capture the sound waveform and analyze it to get the frequencies and amount and rate of modulation (e.g. the "pea whistle" used by many police and referees is primarily at 2600 to 2800 Hz according to online info, but changes in volume, and perhaps pitch slightly, as the "pea" inside the whistle rolls around, passing the opening at several Hz). Maybe I can work up a prototype sometime soon, but not tonight! Thanks for the kind words about my unfinished game. Edited January 25, 2022 by Sohl wording Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dave C Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 4 hours ago, kid_snz said: Btw, is it possible to have a gimmick that makes a sound when a cab approaches to the boy? All we really have to know is the y position of the boy (is is near a cab lane) and then the relative x positions/direction of the cab. If we had a motor sound we could make it quieter or louder the closer the boy is to a cab? or just make it honk if it is about to hit the boy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 25, 2022 Author Share Posted January 25, 2022 21 hours ago, KevKelley said: I like the use of Japanese. I think it adds to the aesthetic. Thanks! but since this is my first game, I'll keep this basic and try out different ideas for the ones coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 25, 2022 Author Share Posted January 25, 2022 20 hours ago, KevKelley said: My sound work is not the best and this example was a result of limited space, but this was a kind of recreation of my original Bag Boy game idea. The goal was to return the shopping cart while dodging cars (the blocks) which is a kind of similar idea to the pizza delivery. This sounds in this video were to kind of act like honking when a the player runs in front of a car. I suppose they could be made more horn like. I left it as is in this game because the fast movement made for some classic arcade style beep and boops that I like. Thank you for the sample video! I was more surprised to see your many games. Your version of PizzaBoy is very cool with the title screen and the walking part 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 25, 2022 Share Posted January 25, 2022 5 minutes ago, kid_snz said: Thank you for the sample video! I was more surprised to see your many games. Your version of PizzaBoy is very cool with the title screen and the walking part You can see why I like the Pizza Boy idea. I love games where you grab things and move them around. I used to love playing games like Defender. I have a few ideas I like to bounce around and whenever I have a quiet moment (usually at work) I practice programming. I'm not the best programmer but I try to think outside of the box. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Dave C Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 On 1/24/2022 at 6:47 PM, KevKelley said: The goal was to return the shopping cart while dodging cars (the blocks) which is a kind of similar idea to the pizza delivery. that cart game looks hilarious (in a good way) like the cart has a mind of its own Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 It was part of my early attempts at "AI." I would have the cart chase either the box at top or the top car or alternate so that it has this kind of frantic somewhat predictable/somewhat not movement. Since I was limited on space and this was just me trying to add a little bonus game, I tried to make the honking by sounding off a horn once the cart gets nearby. Ideally I thought it would be cool to have a rumble of the engine get louder and softer as you approach a car and honk if you get in front which reminded me of the Pizza Boy game ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohl Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 Here is a binary of the sound experiments I did for a car horn and a police whistle. The screen will stay black the whole time and there are some +/- 1 screen linecount issues. To hear a sample sound, use the left joystick, and move it: Left to hear a basic car horn Right to hear a lower-pitched car horn Up to hear a (bad) police whistle I'm using both TIA sound voices simultaneously to get the sort-of-clashing dual fundamental frequency audio spectrum of typical modern car horns. I'm doing something similar for the police whistle, but for that I'm keeping one voice pitch constant, while the other is modulated by the countdown variable and table lookups to determine frequency. If these sounds are not playing, the game could play other sounds such as the theme music or other kinds of background noise. SohlSounds.bin 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kid_snz Posted January 27, 2022 Author Share Posted January 27, 2022 15 hours ago, Sohl said: Here is a binary of the sound experiments I did for a car horn and a police whistle. The screen will stay black the whole time and there are some +/- 1 screen linecount issues. To hear a sample sound, use the left joystick, and move it: Left to hear a basic car horn Right to hear a lower-pitched car horn Up to hear a (bad) police whistle I'm using both TIA sound voices simultaneously to get the sort-of-clashing dual fundamental frequency audio spectrum of typical modern car horns. I'm doing something similar for the police whistle, but for that I'm keeping one voice pitch constant, while the other is modulated by the countdown variable and table lookups to determine frequency. If these sounds are not playing, the game could play other sounds such as the theme music or other kinds of background noise. SohlSounds.bin 4 kB · 9 downloads The sounds you've shared are great! I love them. I believe it fits perfectly with the atmosphere of Pizza Boy, if you could give me permission to use it, I'd love to, is that possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohl Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 51 minutes ago, kid_snz said: The sounds you've shared are great! I love them. I believe it fits perfectly with the atmosphere of Pizza Boy, if you could give me permission to use it, I'd love to, is that possible? Thank you!. I 'm glad you like them. I want to make a second try at the police whistle sound... if I come up with something better for it, I will post it soon. Maybe there could be road-construction jack-hammer sounds and car whooshing sounds too! Hmm. Road construction could be a good obstacle in the game. For the programmers, the count-down variables Honk1Cnt and Honk2Cnt get initialized to #32 in the joystick check part of the Overscan processing routine. Then, in the sound-playing code in the VBlank routine, the count-down timers are checked to see if a sound is active, and if so, the count decremented and then used to fetch the proper sound volume setting for the current time-step. The frequency and tone type is fixed (not modulated). I thought about trying a doppler-shift effect, but the Atari TIA chip does not have enough frequency resolution to do the proper slide down in frequency. If both countdown timers are non-zero, Honk1 will be processed first (Honk2 code is skipped when Honk1 is active), and when complete, Honk2 will start immediately. Code excerpts, in assembler (hopefully not hard to do bB if that's being used): He lda Honk1Cnt beq .honk1.done Honk1Snd: dec Honk1Cnt beq .honk1.done ldy Honk1Cnt lda HonkVolEnvlp,y tay ; vol ldx #12 ; freq - about 403 Hz - Note ~ G4 lda #12 ; tone sta WSYNC ; #3 sty AUDV0 stx AUDF0 sta AUDC0 ldx #10 ; freq - about 476 Hz - Note ~ A#4 sty AUDV1 stx AUDF1 sta AUDC1 jmp .sndDone .honk1.done: sta WSYNC ; #3 lda Honk2Cnt beq .honk2.done Honk2Snd: dec Honk2Cnt beq .honk2.done ldy Honk2Cnt lda HonkVolEnvlp,y tay ; vol ldx #15 ; freq - about 328 Hz - Note ~ E4 lda #12 ; tone sta WSYNC ; #3 sty AUDV0 stx AUDF0 sta AUDC0 ldx #13 ; freq - about 374 Hz - Note ~ F#4 sty AUDV1 stx AUDF1 sta AUDC1 jmp .sndDone .honk2.done: sta WSYNC ; #3 Data tables for the sound envelope (volume over time... can make the sound ramp up over time and/or fade more or less over time) ; NOTE: This table will read back-to-front since it is indexed by a count-down variable HonkVolEnvlp: .byte $09, $09, $09, $09 .byte $0B, $0B, $0B, $0B .byte $0E, $0E, $0E, $0E .byte $0F, $0F, $0F, $0F .byte $0F, $0F, $0F, $0F .byte $0F, $0F, $0F, $0F .byte $0E, $0E, $0E, $0E .byte $0D, $0D, $0D, $0C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 27, 2022 Share Posted January 27, 2022 28 minutes ago, Sohl said: Maybe there could be road-construction jack-hammer sounds and car whooshing sounds too! Hmm. Road construction could be a good obstacle in the game. Ooh. I just pictured a little sprite jackhammering in the road. Or at the least a little orange barricade! I had just finished messing around with this idea some more. I couldn't quite figure out what the hell was going on until I realized I had a couple mistypes that when compiled caused some funky interactions. I accidentally typed "0" instead of "o" for a variable check which resulted in things like the missile spawning in seemingly random spots and whatnot. I also overlooked some checks which also resulted in some unintended actions. While my code is nowhere near as neat or efficient as some this is quite fun to play around with. Here is what I was playing around with. I deviate from the source a bit and played around with Dave C's collision detection so it is a little different in some areas. There is no sound because I always wait till the end to do that because I suck at implementing sounds, which is why most of my games have simple beeps and boops. I plan on experimenting with sound soon though... PIZZBOY_2022_01_27.bas PIZZBOY_2022_01_27.bas.bin 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohl Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 Updates and more sound effects: I improved the police whistle sound, but it is still not as good as I hoped. I added a jackhammer sound. I didn't work on it too long, but I think it gets the idea across. I added a "whoosh" sound that might be used for cars going by. I think I fixed the display linecount issues, at least the major ones. I'll post the full .asm source code in case someone wants to "borrow" any/all of these sounds. I need get back to working on my Immunity (game). SohlSounds_Jan28.bin SohlSounds.asm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevKelley Posted January 28, 2022 Share Posted January 28, 2022 4 hours ago, Sohl said: I need get back to working on my Immunity (game). This is me. I know I should be working on other things but all the ideas in this thread are just so interesting. Maybe tomorrow I'll go back to what I should be doing... ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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