+DarkLord Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 10 hours ago, Lostdragon said: Developers didn't make use of ANY STE features to any real extend, sure you might get better scrolling, better colour gradients, improved sound, all of these if really lucky, but titles were few and far between, as the hardware was released far too late in the day, the STFM had the far wider user base and devs were fully committed to the Amiga, PC and Console markets, the ST as a games machine, was dying a very rapid death. Just to put perspective on that: Games using STE enhancements : Abrevs. : ADMA - audio DMA EPAL - extended palette (4096 col.) HWS - hardware scrolling BLIT - blitter (not strictly STE feature) AJ - analogue joysticks **************** Alien Busters IV - ADMA Alien Thing - ADMA, EPAL Alien Thing - Expert Edition - ADMA, EPAL Alien Thing - The Directors Cut (Demo) - ADMA, EPAL Ancient Art of War in the Skies, The - EPAL Another World - ADMA Asteroidia - Should use blitter but I don't see it, and scrolling is pathetic. Astro Panic 94 - ADMA, BLIT, EPAL B Squad (Demo) - EPAL, BLIT Battletris - ADMA Battletris+ - ADMA Beastlord - EPAL Cannon Fodder II (preview) - EPAL-only title pic. Pih. Captive - EPAL Carlos - ADMA Chambers of Shaolin - ADMA Chaos Engine - HWS Chronicles of Omega, The - HWS, ADMA Chu Chu Rocket - ADMA, BLIT, AJ CoCoCoPo -ADMA Creatures - ADMA Destruction Imminent - ADMA, BLIT, EPAL Diamond Ice - ADMA, EPAL Dragon's Lair - EPAL Dragon's Lair II - EPAL Dragon's Lair III - EPAL Dragon's Lair Escape from the Singe's Castle - EPAL Elvira the Arcade Game - BLIT Esprit - ADMA (Strange that later games - Oxyd, are not STE enhanced) Final Fight - EPAL Fire and Ice - EPAL First Samurai - EPAL, intro only Frantick - EPAL - only title Ghost Battle - BLIT GodPey - BLIT Heartland - ADMA, EPAL International Rugby Challenge - EPAL James Pond - EPAL James Pond II (Robocod) - EPAL (1c only) Leavin' Teramis - EPAL, intro only Lethal Xcess - ADMA, BLIT Magic Boy - ADMA Magic Fly - EPAL - only title pic. Nicky Boom - ADMA Nicky 2 - ADMA No Limit 2 - ADMA, EPAL Oh No! Not More Radioactive Mineshafts - BLIT, EPAL Operation Garfield - EPAL, ADMA, BLIT Pooz - ADMA Pouif Ouf - ADMA, BLIT Power Up plus - ADMA, BLIT - despite it, scrolling is awful Robocop 3 - ADMA, EPAL Rock 'n' Roll Clams - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Sheer Agony - EPAL Space Ace - EPAL Space Ace II - EPAL Starball - ADMA Superfly - ADMA Ultimate Arena, The - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Vaxine - ADMA, EPAL Winglord - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Wings of Death - ADMA, BLIT Wrath of the Demon - EPAL Zool - HWS, BLIT **************** STE only : Alien Blast Dynabusters+ - I guess that + means for STE H Mec H Mec 2 Manga Puzzle Obsession Pacman OE - OE= On STE Revenge of Mutant Camels STE v. - surprise ! Roger - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Sleepwalker Square Off (1995) + TT, Falcon Stardust + Falcon Street Fighter II (Monochrome, Demo) Stone Age + Falcon Substation Team Tomtar Utopos Whitewater Madness Zero 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 In an on-going effort to help the original poster, here is a list of games exclusive to the Atari ST (hope this helps): Game list released exclusively for Atari ST by Anemos A.L.C.O.N. - Imagine Crystal Castles - Atari Corporation GATO - Spectrum Holobyte ST Karate - Paradox Star Raiders - Atari Corporation Strike! - Mastertronic Super Stuntman - Codemasters Joust - Atari Corporation Millipede - Atari Corporation Where Time Stood Still Trail Blazer Sapiens Phantis I,Ball Arctic Moves Mata Hari - Loriciel - <add-list> Magnetik Tank - Loriciel Annihilator - Budgie UK Phantom Zone - Budgie UK Teach-Yourself Series - Budgie UK Recoil - Ocean Shackled - US Gold Alcantor Asgard pop! by bullys1 -Rock 'n Roll Clams (like MugUK mentioned) -Substation -Missile Command -Oids by nativ Team Football, Ultimate Arena? ST Protector Obession Slap Fight Super STario by Marcer black sect Rocketball st space pilot st ST Lingo ST Pool ST Soccer ST Wars Strange War Super stario land super stario xmas turbo st by jeweleric Colonial Conquest Super Sprint Gauntlet Battlezone Sundog The Frozen Legacy Midi Maze Skulldiggery (not sure about this) Enduro Racer F15 Strike Eagle President Elect Knightmare (the version of the TV programme) Star Trek Rebel Universe Road Runner Asteroids Deluxe Food Fight Moonbase Robotron 2084 Super Breakout Tempest Metro-Cross Xevious Lords of Conquest 10th Frame Crack'ed Hades Nebula Moon Patrol Prohibition Rana Rama Macadam Bumper Pirates of the Barbary Coast Psion Chess Solomons Key Spitfire 40 221b Baker Street Championship Wrestling <add-list> Trailblazer Tau Ceti Lands of Havoc Altair Turbo GT I Ball Captain America Doom Tube International Karate Super Cycle Eden Blues Get Dexter Rings of Ziflin Superbike Challenge Wizards Crown Top Gun Was Zero 5 >? by partykiller Nine princes in Amber Amazon Fahrenheit 451 Perry Mason: The Case of the Mandarin Murder Ultima II Breakers Das Reich - New Soft Warship President Elect: 1988 Edition Phantasie II Lee Enfield in "An Amazon Adventure" Not a penny more, not a penny less, Adventure, Domark Orbiter Puzzles Shuffleboard Essex - Synapse Software <add-list> Fantastic Four Sorcerer Of Claymorgue Castle 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lostdragon Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 11 minutes ago, DarkLord said: Just to put perspective on that: Games using STE enhancements : Abrevs. : ADMA - audio DMA EPAL - extended palette (4096 col.) HWS - hardware scrolling BLIT - blitter (not strictly STE feature) AJ - analogue joysticks **************** Alien Busters IV - ADMA Alien Thing - ADMA, EPAL Alien Thing - Expert Edition - ADMA, EPAL Alien Thing - The Directors Cut (Demo) - ADMA, EPAL Ancient Art of War in the Skies, The - EPAL Another World - ADMA Asteroidia - Should use blitter but I don't see it, and scrolling is pathetic. Astro Panic 94 - ADMA, BLIT, EPAL B Squad (Demo) - EPAL, BLIT Battletris - ADMA Battletris+ - ADMA Beastlord - EPAL Cannon Fodder II (preview) - EPAL-only title pic. Pih. Captive - EPAL Carlos - ADMA Chambers of Shaolin - ADMA Chaos Engine - HWS Chronicles of Omega, The - HWS, ADMA Chu Chu Rocket - ADMA, BLIT, AJ CoCoCoPo -ADMA Creatures - ADMA Destruction Imminent - ADMA, BLIT, EPAL Diamond Ice - ADMA, EPAL Dragon's Lair - EPAL Dragon's Lair II - EPAL Dragon's Lair III - EPAL Dragon's Lair Escape from the Singe's Castle - EPAL Elvira the Arcade Game - BLIT Esprit - ADMA (Strange that later games - Oxyd, are not STE enhanced) Final Fight - EPAL Fire and Ice - EPAL First Samurai - EPAL, intro only Frantick - EPAL - only title Ghost Battle - BLIT GodPey - BLIT Heartland - ADMA, EPAL International Rugby Challenge - EPAL James Pond - EPAL James Pond II (Robocod) - EPAL (1c only) Leavin' Teramis - EPAL, intro only Lethal Xcess - ADMA, BLIT Magic Boy - ADMA Magic Fly - EPAL - only title pic. Nicky Boom - ADMA Nicky 2 - ADMA No Limit 2 - ADMA, EPAL Oh No! Not More Radioactive Mineshafts - BLIT, EPAL Operation Garfield - EPAL, ADMA, BLIT Pooz - ADMA Pouif Ouf - ADMA, BLIT Power Up plus - ADMA, BLIT - despite it, scrolling is awful Robocop 3 - ADMA, EPAL Rock 'n' Roll Clams - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Sheer Agony - EPAL Space Ace - EPAL Space Ace II - EPAL Starball - ADMA Superfly - ADMA Ultimate Arena, The - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Vaxine - ADMA, EPAL Winglord - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Wings of Death - ADMA, BLIT Wrath of the Demon - EPAL Zool - HWS, BLIT **************** STE only : Alien Blast Dynabusters+ - I guess that + means for STE H Mec H Mec 2 Manga Puzzle Obsession Pacman OE - OE= On STE Revenge of Mutant Camels STE v. - surprise ! Roger - ADMA, EPAL, BLIT Sleepwalker Square Off (1995) + TT, Falcon Stardust + Falcon Street Fighter II (Monochrome, Demo) Stone Age + Falcon Substation Team Tomtar Utopos Whitewater Madness Zero 5 Appreciate the full list, it kinda does highlight the point I was making. Big titles like Chaos Engine, only used hardware scrolling or in cases like Another World, enhanced audio, or Fire And Ice the extended palatte and the Blitter as you say, wasn't exclusive to the STE to start with. The number of titles that really used all the extra STE features were thin on the ground, even Atari themselves moved what was announced as an STE flagship title to the Falcon (Steel Talons). The hardware simply arrived far too late in the St's commercial life cycle to be fully embraced by a development community which had firmly moved onto other platforms. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youxia Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 31 minutes ago, DarkLord said: In an on-going effort to help the original poster, here is a list of games exclusive to the Atari ST (hope this helps) Sorry, but this list is useless. Many (if not most) these games were released on other platforms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atariforce Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 15 minutes ago, youxia said: Sorry, but this list is useless. Many (if not most) these games were released on other platforms. Those are ST games that weren't released on the Amiga. But yes, most were released on other platforms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted March 20, 2022 Share Posted March 20, 2022 2 hours ago, Atariforce said: Those are ST games that weren't released on the Amiga. But yes, most were released on other platforms. Thank you. Apologies for not clarifying that the list was leaning towards an Amiga comparison. It just seemed that the message thread was going that way... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megalomaniac Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 Realistically, it's very rare to compare the Amiga and ST versions of a game and find that the ST version was better. The faster processor helped with pure 3D games - Stunt Car Racer is the obvious one, maybe things like Frontier and Cybercon 3. Blood Money, Captain Blood, maybe Starglider II - and even many of those had better sound on the Amiga. A few of the ST-but-not-Amiga games listed are very good and had their best or only versions for the ST - Oids is the obvious one. Beyond that, I'd say the Amiga was the better games system in almost every way. ST Sensible Soccer is limited to a small window compared to the fulll screen scroll on other systems, ST Cannon Fodder is excruciating to play, and even something as simple and 8-bit as CJ's Elephant Antics suffers on the ST from flick scrolling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Megalomaniac Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 Realistically, it's very rare to compare the Amiga and ST versions of a game and find that the ST version was better. The faster processor helped with pure 3D games - Stunt Car Racer is the obvious one, maybe things like Frontier and Cybercon 3. Blood Money, Captain Blood, maybe Starglider II - and even many of those had better sound on the Amiga. A few of the ST-but-not-Amiga games listed are very good and had their best or only versions for the ST - Oids is the obvious one. Beyond that, I'd say the Amiga was the better games system in almost every way - the ST competed for a while because it was cheaper and launched earlier. Once you get into the real classic 4th generation games, the ST version is usually the worst - to the examples already given I'd add that Sensible Soccer has fullscreen gameplay on everything else (even the Master System). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 (edited) On 3/19/2022 at 5:37 PM, Justin Payne said: Oh, one thing I forgot to mention. The ST line has midi and some games (not a lot of them) incorporated midi sound in them which sounds awesome. I wish midi playback wasn't so expensive back then or, I think, this could be a gamechanger for the ST line. Heck, I would hope anyone writing a game for the ST today should expect to add midi sound in. For example... Thanks for the 'blast from the past'......😆 I reaaallly miss my ST. Edited September 15, 2022 by MarkC 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted September 15, 2022 Share Posted September 15, 2022 Since you mentioned MIDI... Here's a (probably incomplete) list of ST games that support MIDI: Pirates Leisure Suit Larry 3 Kings quest 4 Ultima III Ultima IV Ultima V (not sure about this one) Albedo Bomb Jack Lost Dutchman Mine Sapiens Karate Kid part 2 Space Quest 1 Space Quest 2 Space Quest 3 I don't have every game on this list, but I do have a lot of them and I can say absolutely the sound difference is stunning with my Roland MT32. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Payne Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 On 9/15/2022 at 9:49 AM, MarkC said: Thanks for the 'blast from the past'......😆 I reaaallly miss my ST. Well, the good news is you have emulators and a lot of the games appears on similar systems so you have opportunities to relive some of it if you choose not to pick one up now. I mentioned the midi on Space Quest III but I only played that on the PC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Payne Posted September 22, 2022 Share Posted September 22, 2022 On 9/15/2022 at 11:17 AM, DarkLord said: Since you mentioned MIDI... Here's a (probably incomplete) list of ST games that support MIDI: Pirates Leisure Suit Larry 3 Kings quest 4 Ultima III Ultima IV Ultima V (not sure about this one) Albedo Bomb Jack Lost Dutchman Mine Sapiens Karate Kid part 2 Space Quest 1 Space Quest 2 Space Quest 3 I don't have every game on this list, but I do have a lot of them and I can say absolutely the sound difference is stunning with my Roland MT32. I just found this but I haven't confirmed it's correct or not.http://www.atarimania.com/list_games_atari-st-midi_midi_1_S_G.html and this...https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_MT-32-compatible_computer_games I also found you pointing to this in another thread...so I see you also have some interest in this already. 😊https://www.atari-forum.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=21473 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 As to that first list...hmm. I've never ever seen anything anywhere that says there were 174 Atari ST games that supported MIDI. Is that really correct? I added the titles from the 2nd list so the updated list reads: Pirates Leisure Suit Larry 3 Ultima III Ultima Iv Ultima V Albedo Bomb Jack Lost Dutchman Mine Sapiens Karate Kid part 2 Space Quest 1 Space Quest 2 Space Quest 3 The Adventures of Maddog Williams in the Dungeons of Uridian Codename: ICEMAN The Colonel's Bequest Conquests of Camelot Cruise for a Corpse Hero's Quest (aka Quest for Glory) Hoyle's Official Book of Games: Volume 1 King's Quest IV Leisure Suit Larry III Operation Stealth (aka James Bond 007:The Stealth Affair) Police Quest II Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted September 23, 2022 Share Posted September 23, 2022 (edited) On 9/22/2022 at 5:34 AM, Justin Payne said: Well, the good news is you have emulators and a lot of the games appears on similar systems so you have opportunities to relive some of it if you choose not to pick one up now. That is the current route I have taken......😁 As I own SQ1 etc, I didn't feel guilty downloading it from Atarimania (those guys have done a fantastic job resurrecting old systems). Runs great on my 2003 G4 PowerBook. Edited September 23, 2022 by MarkC 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DarkLord Posted September 28, 2022 Share Posted September 28, 2022 Just out of curiosity, does the emulation support the MIDI option from the Sierra games? They sound fantastic on my Roland MT32... Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 28, 2022 Share Posted September 28, 2022 9 hours ago, DarkLord said: Just out of curiosity, does the emulation support the MIDI option from the Sierra games? They sound fantastic on my Roland MT32... Thanks. Yes, Hatari supports MIDI, and I think Steem does as well. With Hatari, I am able to route the MIDI signals either to an external midi synth or a software synth running on the computer itself. So you could still use the MT32 or play with Soundfonts to see what configuration sounds best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oky2000 Posted September 28, 2022 Share Posted September 28, 2022 I remember I always wanted a Macintosh as soon as Ian Holme started advertising them on UK TV. "Test drive a Mac today". At that sort of time I wanted to go beyond typing in stuff to make a computer work and anything with a GUI fascinated me, it was time to get a grown ups computer, I had access to Atari 800 and Amstrad CPC games and I owned a VCS and C64 and Colecovision myself but I wanted to explore other things. In 1986 I remember a Commodore disk drive, a 1351 Commodore mouse and GEOS for my C64 would cost a fair whack, the Amiga 1000 wasn't out at all in PAL and all I wanted to do was explore GUI machines and do pixel art. So I got a 520STM + SF354 bundle for less than £450, less than it would have cost to get a Commodore 128 and 1571 disk drive. Was I happy with it for games? Depends what sort of games really, I'd rather play Backlash than Encounter, and Gauntlet 1 and The Pawn on an ST than the same games on any other 8bit. Some early games also did sampled sound for effects too. I loved the GEM desktop, and Neochrome was a great package, I preferred it for doing my sprites even when I had Dpaint. Besides I still had a C64 anyway, I bought Bubble Bobble for my C64 and saved the extra money, it's not like you need the ST version (nothing wrong with it, the original arcade game doesn't need the ST hardware to be enjoyed that's all). I put the money towards games only the ST could do justice like Virus by Firebird (awesome game) and also as I didn't have a disk drive for any other system I could still enjoy games like Defender of the Crown. I also really like the styling of the original ST and STM models, smaller than some 8bit computers too actually. Great blueish grey too. If you never had one back then I don't know, nostalgia is a big part of any retro computer/console for me. It's not a games computer at all, probably would have been a good idea for Jack to put the ST under another brand name like Nissan and Toyota etc did with their BMW/Mercedes rival offerings to help the sales. If you just wanted to play games really the only option before the Megadrive was the NEC PC Engine on import. As a home computer and an alternative to the three times more expensive Amiga 1000 it was a nice machine I think. I enjoyed it, even tried things like samplers too on the ST for the first time. I wish I had been able to write my own GEM based programs but STOS didn't allow that and Fast BASIC only supported some aspects of GEM GUI so I never bought that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 15 hours ago, oky2000 said: If you never had one back then I don't know, nostalgia is a big part of any retro computer/console for me. It's not a games computer at all, probably would have been a good idea for Jack to put the ST under another brand name like Nissan and Toyota etc did with their BMW/Mercedes rival offerings to help the sales. I think it was fine for games. You have to remember what its competition was when released... PC CGA/EGA, Mac, Apple IIgs, C64, Amiga, etc. Out of all those, only Amiga was better for games. ST has quite a large games library to choose from. I know it gets crap for its action games-- there was no hardware assist before the blitter models. But same was true for PC (at the time) IIgs, etc.. The ST years was a time when a bunch of new game genres were flourishing on the computer end--- RPGs "Dungeon Master" made a huge splash on ST, as well as simulation games like Sim City & Civilization. So I always had plenty of games to play that keep me occupied. It is true that the Tramiels tried to give the ST/TT line more of a business focus, and the Atari name hurt that.. But they admitted that they bought Atari for the name, so it wouldn't make sense to change that. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 19 hours ago, oky2000 said: If you never had one back then I don't know, nostalgia is a big part of any retro computer/console for me. It's not a games computer at all All I did with my STFM was play games.....😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted September 29, 2022 Share Posted September 29, 2022 On 9/28/2022 at 5:17 AM, DarkLord said: Just out of curiosity, does the emulation support the MIDI option from the Sierra games? I will have to give it a go......😛 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkC Posted September 30, 2022 Share Posted September 30, 2022 On 9/28/2022 at 3:11 PM, zzip said: Yes, Hatari supports MIDI, and I think Steem does as well. With Hatari, I am able to route the MIDI signals either to an external midi synth or a software synth running on the computer itself. So you could still use the MT32 or play with Soundfonts to see what configuration sounds best. Any advice on setting a software synth for MIDI....? Do you need a third party app for this. A bit out of my knowledge zone.....🤪 In the device settings, there is a midi in/out file listed, but these don't exist on my system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 30, 2022 Share Posted September 30, 2022 10 minutes ago, MarkC said: Any advice on setting a software synth for MIDI....? Do you need a third party app for this. A bit out of my knowledge zone.....🤪 In the device settings, there is a midi in/out file listed, but these don't exist on my system. I followed the documentation here https://hatari.tuxfamily.org/doc/manual.html#MIDI_support If you're asking about device files because you're on linux, hatari still depends on the old midi drivers (wish they'd update this), but basically you can emulate the old driver behavior by running this: sudo modprobe snd-virmidi That should create the files https://hatari.tuxfamily.org/doc/midi-linux.txt Then you will need a softsynth. I use either Timidity and Fluidsynth, I haven't decided which works better 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atari8guy Posted September 30, 2022 Share Posted September 30, 2022 And if you have a real ST and don't want to pay the going rate for an MT32 (they are pricey)...you can emulate on an Raspberry Pi - you still need a MIDI to USB cable though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oky2000 Posted October 1, 2022 Share Posted October 1, 2022 On 9/30/2022 at 6:39 PM, Atari8guy said: And if you have a real ST and don't want to pay the going rate for an MT32 (they are pricey)...you can emulate on an Raspberry Pi - you still need a MIDI to USB cable though. Wow that's interesting, I need to look into that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oky2000 Posted October 2, 2022 Share Posted October 2, 2022 On 9/29/2022 at 3:06 PM, zzip said: I think it was fine for games. You have to remember what its competition was when released... PC CGA/EGA, Mac, Apple IIgs, C64, Amiga, etc. Out of all those, only Amiga was better for games. ST has quite a large games library to choose from. I know it gets crap for its action games-- there was no hardware assist before the blitter models. But same was true for PC (at the time) IIgs, etc.. The ST years was a time when a bunch of new game genres were flourishing on the computer end--- RPGs "Dungeon Master" made a huge splash on ST, as well as simulation games like Sim City & Civilization. So I always had plenty of games to play that keep me occupied. It is true that the Tramiels tried to give the ST/TT line more of a business focus, and the Atari name hurt that.. But they admitted that they bought Atari for the name, so it wouldn't make sense to change that. When the C64 was programmed properly, silky smooth 16 colour (chunky) scrolling arcade games with awesome soundtracks it was tough to beat beyond the screenshot wars, it was tough for everyone to beat for certain types of games, even those lame compiled C Amiga games with crap FM based synthpop instrument samples in soundtracks (sampled at 6khz etc) for people who were familiar with actual arcade games of the mid 80s. I wouldn't pick an NES over an ST though ($40 8bit Famicon based tech gaming), or the PC EGA beeper-tastic option the Americans went with. Wouldn't pick a Mac over it and the Amiga in 1986 only had 1 good game (Marble Madness) and even in 1987 there were only a couple of games I liked on it. For people coming from an MSX, Sinclair, Amstrad or Acorn home computer it was indeed a no-brainer to upgrade to one, it was an improvement in every possible way. The stigma of the YM chip coupled with the lack of smooth scrolling was a problem for the ST in the UK I remember, certainly it held back sales of the machine in the UK where the C64 was a being pushed quite hard in 1986. Today it doesn't really matter as you have the luxury of seeing all the ST games you want on Youtube in action before deciding whether to get into it now but back then it wasn't clear. It's similar for people coming from the Atari 800XL etc I suppose too. It was an issue at the time, the word boundary screen location register and YM chip were a bit of a handicap and in hindsight Atari should have known that. Like I said I was happy with my ST but I wouldn't have sold my C64 after getting one to only play ST games, I like all sorts of games and some will always be better on the ST and some better on the C64, and regardless of specs there were some talented musicians doing great stuff on the SID since 1983. YMMV I think Tramiel was convinced to get Atari due to some of the most favourable terms ever laid out for a sale of a company that large and he hoped to get his revenge on Irving Gould. It was a means to an end, if Commodore had not secured the Amiga or Dave Needle hadn't deliberately sabotaged the Amiga Chipset prototype designs he was legally obliged to send Atari his plan may well have worked too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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