Jump to content
IGNORED

Atari Fossil requests advice on clearing out the attic


Recommended Posts

4 hours ago, Chris Crawford said:

I just came down from the attic, covered in dust and sneezing. I found all sorts of strange and ancient stuff, including a bunch of Macs from over the years. In Atari stuff, I found lots of stuff: four 800s, some of which are labeled "broken". 810s. 850s. One acoustic coupler. Enough cables of various kinds to stretch from here to Portland. Lots of printouts of source code. Half a dozen 8K RAM modules -- whoop de doo! All with silver, not gold contacts. Joysticks galore, many of them the snazzy third-party joysticks. 

 

And not ONE NTSC television or monitor. Not one. It looks like I'm up the creek without a monitor. I used to have a really good Sony Trinitron TV that I used on my Atari 800, but now it is gone. The prices for these things on eBay are all above $100! 

 

I am determined to get rid of all this stuff, but just now I'm not sure how to proceed.

I would say the source code is the most important of the items to preserve.

  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, DrVenkman said:

And as an aside, I want @Chris Crawford to know: the very first games I bought from the store for my new Atari 400 in the fall of 1982 were EASTERN FRONT 1941 and SCRAM,

 

 

You know, in a speech at one of the early CGDCs, the speaker warned us that we write in sand, because the computers for which we write are always going obsolete. It's good to know that he wasn't quite right. 

  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, guys, I have bad news and I have good news. The bad news first: I now have proof that I have gone senile. The good news: all those Atari files are comfortably ensconced on my current Macintosh, buried in a folder inside a folder inside a folder, etc. I attach the Zipped collection. 

 

Please don't laugh too hard; my Mac contains over 2 million files, most of which I have no idea of. 

 

I still have no way to read any of those files; they're all in ATR format. I'll peruse this forum, as I'm sure that somewhere in here is a procedure for translating them into ASCII. All I have to do is find it hidden inside a folder inside a folder inside a folder...

Atari Stuff.zip

  • Like 10
  • Thanks 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Chris,

 

Good to know the disks have already been preserved. I am pretty sure I helped you with some of that years and years ago, around the time of our interview for the Antic podcast. I'm happy to help with anything you need — document scanning (I've scanned hundreds of thousands of pages), more disks, whatever.

 

For museums, I recommend:

The Strong Museum of Play in NY is amassing a quality collection of Atari-related things. They're my go-to.

 

Other good choices are:

National Videogame Museum in Texas

The American Computer Museum
The Rhode Island Computer Museum
 

-Kay Savetz

  • Like 11
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/24/2022 at 8:12 AM, Chris Crawford said:

One more thing: I discovered that somebody already uploaded the entire Eastern Front Source Code package. It's the scans of the document, but it's entirely readable:

 

https://seriouscomputerist.atariverse.com/media/pdf/source/Eastern Front 1941 - Source.pdf

 

Thanks Chris for all the countless delightful hours I spent with Eastern Front, SCRAM, BoP and De Re Atari.

My Father was inspired to buy me my first computer - a 400 - when he saw a SCRAM demo in a Sydney department store.

That event led directly to a lifelong love of programming and technology.

I am eternally grateful.

 

Edited by rossum
typo
  • Like 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/20/2022 at 4:03 PM, Chris Crawford said:

And not ONE NTSC television or monitor. Not one. It looks like I'm up the creek without a monitor. I used to have a really good Sony Trinitron TV that I used on my Atari 800, but now it is gone. The prices for these things on eBay are all above $100!

If you have any modern TVs with composite input (yellow RCA), you can use that with a monitor cable from the 800.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

48 minutes ago, Chris Crawford said:

Wow! That's so nice to see! I've saved that comment in my folder of comments that I save for re-reading when I am tired of beating my head against the latest design brick wall. Thanks!

What do you do these days to stay busy?  Do you still do any coding (for any platform)?  Nice to see you here, your games were amazing - I got my 1st Atari in 1982 and knew of Eastern Front.  Bit too complicated for 7 year old me, but I re-discovered it later thanks to BBSing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/19/2022 at 9:00 PM, Chris Crawford said:

Because this stuff was so new, there wasn't a single person at Atari who had any experience in what we were doing, so we were all just making it up as we went.

This is what made the early consoles from 1977-1984 so unique and special and desirable. Every one was different and tried something new that hadn't been done before. Once Nintendo set a pace, a certain cadence, creativity became second fiddle to corporate profits. And today it's all but shot. Having played stuff from all the eras I'd much rather skip today's crap and just enjoy the wild and explorative times of yore.

On 6/19/2022 at 5:38 PM, Allan said:

If you have software, documents and memorabilia, it would be great to turn that into digital form. Having stuff in museums is great but also having it accessible to everyone on the Net is just as important.

I would argue that having the material online and available for personal download would be the best choice. For one, I am not going to go driving around town, crossing several state lines, making a road trip out of it, just to see some documents. But I will be happy to set up a fold on ma' HDD and download it and pour over it on a stormy evening. Then discuss it in a message forum such as this.

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Stephen said:

What do you do these days to stay busy?  Do you still do any coding (for any platform)?  Nice to see you here, your games were amazing - I got my 1st Atari in 1982 and knew of Eastern Front.  Bit too complicated for 7 year old me, but I re-discovered it later thanks to BBSing.

I almost spat out my tea reading this, because I am overwhelmed with more tasks than I can handle; it's so bad that I've had to sacrifice projects. My highest priority right now is Le Morte D'Arthur, a strange and difficult-to-describe piece of software. It looks like a text adventure game at first, but it's nowhere near that. Here's a description: http://www.erasmatazz.com/library/design-diaries/le-morte-darthur-fourth-try/may-15th-2022.html.

 

There's also a tremendous amount of work required every year to prepare for wildfire season. I have 40 acres of forest land in southern Oregon and it is imperative that I remove floor fuel from the land around the house. We've had extensive rains all through spring, so this year's crop of grasses is bigger than anything I've ever seen -- hence much work. I must also patrol about ten acres that were infested 30 years ago by a previous owner with sulfur cinquefoil, an invasive weed that will completely take over any land if given the opportunity. I've been fighting it for twenty years, but the seeds can lay dormant for decades, then germinate, so they just keep popping up every year. 

 

I have a bunch of trees in pots that must be cared for; many need repotting and I'll try planting some if I get time. This is all part of my efforts to reforest the land after a previous owner logged part of it. I have to repair damage to the duck pen wrought by a huge snowstorm last December. There are also half a dozen trees that were felled by the snowstorm that must be cut up and turned into firewood. The ground squirrel population has exploded, and they're doing a lot of damage, so I have to do something about that.

 

There's my teaching work on interactive storytelling, and my scheme to put together a research group -- that's on hold just now. And someday, someday, I really have to finish the model tank I started building ten years ago to patrol the area around the house at night and scare away wild animals, because the dogs just aren't up to the task in cold weather. It's four feet long, and the tread system has never been able to handle broken branches. 

  • Like 3
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, Keatah said:

Every one was different and tried something new that hadn't been done before.

Ironically, I just stumbled across a video on YouTube describing games on the Atari 8-bit machines, and they were all basically the same. Somebody once said that Vivaldi didn't write 465 concerti, he wrote one concerto 465 times. Well, these were all the same game written different ways. The fellow managed to ignore dozens of great games that didn't fit into his narrow perception of games.

 

16 hours ago, Keatah said:

having the material online and available for personal download would be the best choice.

Yes, I'm convinced that's the best way. Most of my stuff is already up online at various locations. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, MrFish said:

Absurd!

 

Not at all. At some level of abstraction, all concerti are the same: they all fit a standard definition. Every object to which we apply the word "tank" is similar to every other such object, and so we can treat them as "the same" at that level of abstraction. That's the basis for the saw "If you've seen one (insert object), you've seen 'em all." The professor's comment was based on the fact that, even as concerti go, Vivaldi's concerti hewed closely to a particularly narrow definition. And in fact, the games on that video to which I referred were all depressingly alike. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Chris Crawford said:

Not at all. At some level of abstraction, all concerti are the same: they all fit a standard definition. Every object to which we apply the word "tank" is similar to every other such object, and so we can treat them as "the same" at that level of abstraction. That's the basis for the saw "If you've seen one (insert object), you've seen 'em all." The professor's comment was based on the fact that, even as concerti go, Vivaldi's concerti hewed closely to a particularly narrow definition. And in fact, the games on that video to which I referred were all depressingly alike. 

I'm not taking issue with concerti being a form or framework; it's obviously so; but the statement I quoted makes it sound as if so little was different about each one composed by Vivaldi as to warrant labeling them as "one concerto" reproduced, which is far from the truth.

 

Also, maybe a better analogy would "gun", and from there we have rifles, pistols, etc.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, MrFish said:

but the statement I quoted makes it sound as if so little was different about each one composed by Vivaldi as to warrant labeling them as "one concerto" reproduced, which is far from the truth.

I suggest that you read this piece that explains the meaning of the statement. It is something of a joke.
https://notanothermusichistorycliche.blogspot.com/2018/10/did-stravinsky-say-vivaldi-wrote-same.html

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/24/2022 at 11:12 AM, Chris Crawford said:

One more thing: I discovered that somebody already uploaded the entire Eastern Front Source Code package. It's the scans of the document, but it's entirely readable:

 

https://seriouscomputerist.atariverse.com/media/pdf/source/Eastern Front 1941 - Source.pdf

 

Although technically that is the APX release. The Atari main-line version was more advanced.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Chris Crawford said:

I suggest that you read this piece that explains the meaning of the statement. It is something of a joke.
https://notanothermusichistorycliche.blogspot.com/2018/10/did-stravinsky-say-vivaldi-wrote-same.html

Interesting read. Obviously a joke, as it's poking fun at him; and debunked by the author -- even though there is a kernel of truth in that his body of work was highly comprised of the form. I'm quite familiar with his concerti and appreciate their memorable themes and simplicity. Oddly, I don't like his most famous (the Four Seasons), except for a few movements within.

 

Bach was highly influenced by him (and I venture Mozart was too), and pushed the form in his great compositions.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

@Chris Crawford, while I sadly missed your performance in full-body chip clothing bitd, I managed to get a copy of De Re Atari across the pond and read it to bits. It sometimes irks me that  some of the ideas you presented on user interface are still violated 40 years later. Thanks for all your contributions to the Atari universe and good luck for your reforesting project which will give us all a little more air to breathe.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi Chris, another "thanks for all the fish!" post. Apart from the obvious big guns such as EF or BoP, I also really appreciate the far-out brilliance of the Legacy Of Siboot. It was innovative titles like these that made me obsessed with the "computer games" style.

 

It's funny to see your post here, seeing as I was recently reading your "The future of wargaming" article in the 1st issue of CGW, written no less than 41 years ago. Time flies, eh :) And quite prescient stuff too, seeing as most of these things came true (RTS genre, online gaming, next gen machine replacing both Apple/Atari - though who would've thunk back then it'd be a PC?)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 weeks later...
On 6/20/2022 at 9:50 AM, Crazy Climber said:

I'm of no help but just want to express my support for you @Chris Crawford 

 

I think it is really cool you are taking the time to do this. Not only does this stuff hold historical significance but it is of great overall interest to many of us Atari fans!

 

Thank you, good luck and best wishes!

I agree!  @Chris Crawford - hardly a fossil, more like a legend!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...