Systems with known problems: How bad were they?

[goatdan]

Grabbed the quotes from another thread. Thought I'd move it here so it had some responses

 

The only time I have a problem with a system or company is when they put out an inferior product, e.g. toaster style NES

 

In defense of the poor toaster NES, yes it does have a very well known and common problem, but it's super easy to fix. The only needed tool is a phillips screwdriver.

 

I personally wouldn't put the reason that the toaster style NES is easy to fix as my defensive reason for not thinking the system is bad. I would put the fact that particular problem did not seem to overly affect systems until after the life cycle was over as the reason that I think it is totally excusable. I was in school when the NES was super popular, and I never remember hearing that one had broken and someone got a replacement... until well after the SNES had been out.

 

Systems such as the original Playstations (that required being stood on their side or getting special system fans) and the Thompson Xboxes (which seem to fail altogether too often) are a much bigger problem because they were found by consumers while the system was still in the middle of it's life cycle. What other common problems were / have been found in consoles since their life cycle? I've never really thought about it...

[sku_u]

Try finding an unmodded Colecovision in good shape or an Astrocade. Those were two great systems in their day that had serious system issues. I guess the same can be said of the 5200 joysticks, although you didn't have to go out and buy a whole new system just for the controllers.

[figgler]

 

I personally wouldn't put the reason that the toaster style NES is easy to fix as my defensive reason for not thinking the system is bad.  I would put the fact that particular problem did not seem to overly affect systems until after the life cycle was over as the reason that I think it is totally excusable.  I was in school when the NES was super popular, and I never remember hearing that one had broken and someone got a replacement...  until well after the SNES had been out.

 

That's a great point about the NES. Everyone complains that the toaster model is unreliable, yet many people forget that it's 20 years later. The NES was never really developed to played so damn much and for so long as it was. Also I think Nintendo has more than made up for this with the subsequent systems. Pretty much all of Nintendo's hardware has a great reputation of being durable and usable for years after it should.

 

I think Sony had a hardware quality problem at first with PlayStation 2 as well. My 2 best buds each had to return their PS2's that were purchased on launch day because they stopped reading discs. The replacements have since been more reliable, but still with a semi frequent disc read error for DVDs only.

 

Also, props to the VCS, the classic system about which I hear complaints most infrequently

[ubersaurus]

How about the INTV and it's problems with overheating and burning out? I've never had it happen to me, but I keep it unplugged when I'm not using it.

[Adrian M]

Many may disagree, but I feel that the ultra-expensive NEO GEO AES home console is built rather cheaply.

 

I've owned 3 US systems at some point over the last 5 years 2 of the 3 have had problems

 

1. The earliest US home systems (not sure about the JPN versions) had terrible composite video output. Wavey lines with visible interference. Systems with serial #'s under the 12,000 mark are afflicted with this issue. SNK later addressed this issue with a revised system motherboard. If I were a person back in 1990 who just spent some $600 on a Neo system only to see this awful video output, I'd have thought something was wrong with the system! Also, when Fatal Fury 2 came out in the US back in 1993, there was a crashing bug discovered on some systems which required shipping the system to SNK for an "upgrade"!

 

2. The cart slots are notorious for being overly sensitive, not only to dirt and dust, but to warped boards too. You thought the NES had problems reading carts? The Neo is by far the worst, particulary the more you use it. Why is this? Neo carts themselves use TWO PCB's, which means the Neo system has two slot connectors. The cart PCB's are very thin and prone to warping, which over time, will "loosen" the slots in a Neo system. This leads to problems like the game glitching up, or not working at all. That is why I suggest that people NEVER buy a Neo Geo system from eBay or whatever unless the seller can CONFIRM that the cart slots are in good shape or recently replaced.

 

Thankfully, I finally found a system for myself in the 20,000K serial # range with a quality cart connector slot. It takes time to find.

 

My MVS board (arcade Neo motherboard) is one of those models which has a glitch bug that was discovered on some 2003 Playmore game releases (namely, RAGE OF THE DRAGONS and MATRIMELEE). This particular board cannot run these two games without freezing or resetting.

[Breakpack]

I always had a problem with my Sega CD and Saturn systems 'dying' .(i.e. not starting up/spinning the CDs and/or saying there's no CD in the drive when I dern full well know there was ).Good thing I have 3 Saturns and 2 Sega CDs.....

[Zaxxon]

I always had a problem with my Sega CD and Saturn systems 'dying' .(i.e. not starting up/spinning the CDs and/or saying there's no CD in the drive when I dern full well know there was    ).Good thing I have 3 Saturns and 2 Sega CDs.....

 

I believe there is a big difference in quality between the original JPN made Saturns and the later ones made elsewhere(Tailand, China?).

[lonesome_pa]

Well, I think the ADAM. I really tried hard to like the system. Really hard. But too buggy even when they launched. My mom bought one when they came out. We ended up exchanging it twice because of a LOT of faults. After the second time, she gave up and bought an Apple IIe.

[ApolloBoy]

I always had a problem with my Sega CD and Saturn systems 'dying' .(i.e. not starting up/spinning the CDs and/or saying there's no CD in the drive when I dern full well know there was    ).Good thing I have 3 Saturns and 2 Sega CDs.....

 

Oh yeah, my front-loading Sega CD won't even open the disc tray, and I messed it up further when I took it apart.

[SteveW]

The first Jaguar CD drive I bought was bad, so I sent it back to Atari, and they (eventually) sent me a new one. That experience has always given me a bad opinion of the Jag CD hardware. I don't use it too often now, because i'm afraid of wearing it out. I've heard of other people with dead Jag CDs, so i'm not too optimistic for mine's long term usability.

 

I used to hear a lot about people having problems with their NES. After a while, you couldn't click the cartridge down, so you had to jam a cart slipcover to keep it from popping up. And eventually, it wouldn't work at all. I've had it happen before, so I can't play the NES at all now. And I can't afford $100 for a top loader.

[goatdan]

I've noticed that it seems to me at least that as for CD system consoles, the Saturn and Dreamcast are the most reliable of the bunch while the Sega CD, Playstation and 3DO are the worst. I have had a ton of systems go through my hands with the GOAT Store and I always clean them up and test them.

 

I hate Sega CDs because even after being cleaned and tested, half that I send out are sent back to me. No matter how nicely they are packed, they just can't seem to be transported in any conventional means.

 

Playstations, while we don't even carry, we get in from time to time. Of the 25 or so systems I've got, about ten of them had problems that didn't allow them to function, and five or so of them were not fixable. Oddly enough, I have seen about 15 PSOne's now and I have never had any problems with them.

 

3DO's just seem to go bad -- especially the Goldstar systems.

 

On the flip side, I have had about 75 Saturns go through my hands, and only one was unfixable and that was because I got it missing parts. Beyond that one, I have had ones with problems but have always found easy fixes.

 

Dreamcasts seem to be the same way. I got one with a burnt out controller port, but beyond that one the 75ish of them that we have had or that I personally own have never had any problems that weren't fixable.

 

As for the other consoles, I have had a few of each that I wasn't able to get to work, but nothing that seemed to be an actual problem of the console design itself. A lot of systems needed tweaks, but nothing that stood out. The NES toaster problem is well known and documented, and so is the 5200 joystick one...

 

Very interesting thing to think about. I also tend to find a lot of broken Sega Master System Light Guns and SNES Controllers (specifically, the shoulder buttons.) What else is there that breaks a lot for people or that you constantly find broken?

[SteveW]

I've had both of my Atari light guns go bad.

[Susuwatari]

@goatdan - are you the one who sells several defective core (Lynx 2, Jaguar, etc) on eBay? I've seen that name somewhere and I never realized until now.

 

Another system with design problem is Virtualboy. A great system but even a little drop would cause one or both of the display to display scrambled image or no picture at all. I took one of my VB apart and found the LED module was rather touchy, specifically the area where the ribbon cable connects to the LED board.

 

Intellivision (all models) has problem with controller. The circuit trace oxidates easily and results in poor contact and the traces also breaks rather easily.

 

First generation PSX had problem with heat and the laser often went out of alignment because the plastic rail guide got worn down (later PSX used metal guide)

 

XBox with Thompson drive are POS. The cheap DVD-ROM drive failed rather frequently and there's people trying to get M$ to recall such XBoxes to replace the cheap drive with different drive.

[Stingray]

I'm glad that my little defense of the toaster NES sparked this interesting discussion.

 

Another fairly well known defect would be the little dome switches inside the VCS joysticks. I can remeber a lot of those joysticks breaking on me during the life cycle of the VCS. It's a simple reair these days because of the easy availability of replacement domes, but back in the VCS's heyday all you could do was buy a new joystick.

 

-S

[HawgWyld]

That's easy -- the two systems which have given me the most trouble are the toaster NES and the ColecoVision.

 

Thank God I was able to get a top-loader NES for cheap (and, in great shape). The old days of opening a toaseter NES and cleaning that blasted connector or installing a new one are gone.

 

The ColecoVision I had just slowly developed problems over the years until it died a quite death a few years ago. First, the RF module messed up and would give me a fuzzy screen from time to time. Then the power supply fizzed out and that was the end of the ColecoVision.

 

Of course, the most reliable systems I've had to date have been the Atari 2600 and 7800. My Genesis is a bit flaky, as is the Sega CD, but they both work fine for the most part. The top loader NES is an absolute dream, and my Dreamcast and GameCube haven't given me a minute of trouble. The PS1 is a bit flaky, but it's held up well over the years.

[TheGrandPubaa]

On the flip side, I have had about 75 Saturns go through my hands, and only one was unfixable and that was because I got it missing parts.  Beyond that one, I have had ones with problems but have always found easy fixes.

 

Well, then maybe you could assist me, Dan. My Saturn, used from eBay, worked when I first got it. After some time, it stopped playing games. I can play music flawlessly, but when I try to put a game in, it just play's the game's music. Not once have I been able to get a game to load. It's really irking me, and i'd like to fix it if I can. Any ideas?(btw, i've tried tweaking the pots, but didn't fix the problem, and didn't cause any further damage from what I can tell.)

[JB]

Another system with design problem is Virtualboy.  A great system but even a little drop would cause one or both of the display to display scrambled image or no picture at all.  I took one of my VB apart and found the LED module was rather touchy, specifically the area where the ribbon cable connects to the LED board.

Don't forget that even if it DOESN'T break, it can still be knocked out of alignment.

 

I had to replace mine because someone dropped it on a thick carpet, and it would cost more to get repaired than to buy a new one(at the time, they were all on clearance).

[DeV0]

h this is all too easy. The big 2 shoddy made machines are both sony mass produced, the playstation 1 and ps2. Playstation = melt station, the original model ps2 was a bit dodgy. Well enough for me to have returned a couple. The NES is bad now but my original took about 3 years to start flicking.

[Great Hierophant]

I think that most system reliability issues boil down to three common problems. The first is systems with moving parts. Systems like the NES had a moving tray that made contact with the cartridge slot. CD-based systems will fail because a motor is spinning the disk and the CD mechanism is a delicate part. The second is systems with poorbuild quality. Systems, often the ones with the greatest mass-production, tend to be built cheaply. The NES and Playstation are notorious in this regard. Other systems have plastic issues, like the SNES and the Genesis cheap plastic. The Atari in its heyday were often sold with socketed chips rather than chips directly soldered onto the motherboard (better reliability.) Third is bad design decisions. The controls of the Atari 5200, Intellivision and Colecovision are choice examples, but not the only ones. The Neo Geo cartridge warping issue is another bad design, as is the horizontal loading mechanism of the NES. Its quite easy to fry a Commodore 64 I hear.

[JB]

Are we allowed to cite the ease with which one can blow out a VCS power supply?

[Breakpack]

Are we allowed to cite the ease with which one can blow out a VCS power supply?

 

No!

 

 

just kidding...

...I mean,no!

[adonis_minus_20]

Grabbed the quotes from another thread.  Thought I'd move it here so it had some responses

 

The only time I have a problem with a system or company is when they put out an inferior product, e.g. toaster style NES

 

In defense of the poor toaster NES, yes it does have a very well known and common problem, but it's super easy to fix. The only needed tool is a phillips screwdriver.

 

I personally wouldn't put the reason that the toaster style NES is easy to fix as my defensive reason for not thinking the system is bad. I would put the fact that particular problem did not seem to overly affect systems until after the life cycle was over as the reason that I think it is totally excusable. I was in school when the NES was super popular, and I never remember hearing that one had broken and someone got a replacement... until well after the SNES had been out.

 

I got the impression that the toaster style NES had problems since its release, but did not have one back in the day to see that this was not so. I bought one a bit ago, and it had issues, so I replaced the connector, and it worked great for a while. It developed problems again, although I cleaned my carts before each time playing, and then I just bought a toploader. I thought the toaster model was a POS. I don't have any problems with any other systems I've had, from Pong systems up to Gamecube and PS2.

 

Jim

[Stingray]

I bought a toaster NES new and it never gave me any probems for years. Eventually I got a Super Nintendo when those came out and so into the closet the NES went. It started doing the well known flickering blue screen trick when I got it back out several years later. It always worked perfectly during the time that it was the current system.

 

-S

[Big Player]

I guess I was unlucky then. I had problems with my Toaster NES within the first year I bought it. Damn thing erased my roommates Zelda cart with those power blips (power pulses on and off.) The one thing he told me when he let me borrow the cart, "Don't erase my characters."

 

I haven't bought a new piece of Nintendo hardware since.

[liveinabin]

I've owned pretty much all the major consoles at one point or another and, I have to say, no console has EVER died on me.

The worst I've ever had is that, every few months, I get the horizontal lines on the picture from my Saturn - but then it used to be in a play post in a large store, so it must have been treated like shit.