Source Code

[doctorclu]

Ok, I wanted to know if the source code for Bubsy exists... thinking maybe Bubsy 1 & 2 could be made as well...

 

.... but here is a more general question along with that... what source code exists out there? (I know IS2, Fight for Life, Doom, ect...)

 

Thanks!

[Alex Czarnowski]

Add to this list Painter, Atari files that comes with dev manual, game film engine, cd and boot rom sources and I think slam racers. I also believe there are some more sources available - just can't remember them right now.

Cheers,

[justclaws]

Hello,

 

.... but here is a more general question along with that... what source code exists out there?  (I know IS2, Fight for Life, Doom, ect...)

The source code to IS2 is out there? Really? Where?

 

I know of Doom, that's out there on the Jag-Dev-Doom egroup. The

source code is also available for the NUON port, and the PC version.

Curt also had Club Drive source code. Jay & Thunderbird another set.

B&C published a CD with the Fight For Life source code, all complete.

Am I right thinking Hoverstrike source code is also floating around??

I'm not sure, but don't the JS2K Extremist packs have source code?

For sure there is lots of useful source on Glenn's AtariHQ CD by B&C.

Megadata has sources and graphics I think for Thea Realm Fighters.

Sinigord released source code for his Painter product, and also code

for the MOD file player. He also distributed Slam Racer code once.

 

As Alex said, it seems various Atari code has surfaced. Sources for

Atari boot ROM, CD-ROM BIOS, various Atari tools. Also of course

the Atari workshop examples which were designed for developers.

Larger demos like a 3D demo, and examples for surround sound.

 

Considerable Underground developer source code is available, from

the original BJL samples, JagTris, MOD and sounds player, 3D code.

Sources for various small games and demos, from Matthias Domin

and other people. Various deliberate small tutorials and small tools.

Source for larger projects like Duranik's Native, and Sinister stuff.

StarCat's JDC development libraries, full source code for all things.

Also (formerly Nanomonic) libraries for sound, CD audio, graphics.

 

I'm sure there is more, but for now that's all I can think of sorry.

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

[Starcat]

Hi !

 

Ok, I wanted to know if the source code for Bubsy exists... thinking maybe Bubsy 1 & 2 could be made as well...

 

.... but here is a more general question along with that... what source code exists out there?  (I know IS2, Fight for Life, Doom, ect...)

 

    Thanks!

 

I guess you are talking about the Atari HQ 1 CD made by B&C.. Sadly most of the things that were claimed to be source codes are just early binarys or tiny early code fragments.

So AvP, IS2, Blue Lightning, Highlander, Battlemorph and some more that were claimed to be on this disc are not usable source codes, but mainly early binarys or code fragments that can't be compiled because files are missing.

The only source code that seems to be pretty complete of these is Hover Strike. Didn't compile it myself though, so I can't tell if something is missing or not. It just "looks" quite complete.

 

However making a jump and run game isn't all that complicated. Games like jump and runs, 2D shooters and similar games are technically not as complicated (unless you really want to push the limits of the system), but these games require immense work of design and graphics.

I think making an "official" bubsy sequel would be impossible due to licensing. All you could do is probably make a similar jump and run game and create similar graphics. So a fan made bubsy that doesn't use any material of the originals could probably be made.

 

However one thing that is often forgotten, is that even the games that do exist as source are still under copyright. So the those source codes may not be used. With the exception of those games that the developers actually game to the scene as "presents" for learning purpose of developers. Like it happened with the doom code I think. (Although the wad files are still copyrighted.) And of course some source codes by homebrew authors like Duranik (Native) or Sinister Dev (Painter) who were so great to release their work to the scene to allow others to learn from their work as well.

 

Regards, Lars.

[Alex Czarnowski]

I forgot about JEP #3 from Jay! You can find there VARUNAS FORCES LEVEL EDITOR and VARUNAS FORCES SPRITE ENGINE...

Cheers,

[justclaws]

Hello,

 

I forgot about JEP #3 from Jay! You can find there VARUNAS FORCES LEVEL EDITOR and VARUNAS FORCES SPRITE ENGINE...

a) Are these for the Jaguar or PC?

b) These are only for JEP#3 owners aren't they? I don't have it.

c) Is this source available anywhere for non JEP#3 owners?

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

[justclaws]

Hello,

 

So AvP, IS2, Blue Lightning, Highlander, Battlemorph and some more that were claimed to be on this disc are not usable source codes, but mainly early binarys or code fragments that can't be compiled because files are missing.

I remember that there were various very educational source files

on the CD, but to be honest I'd overlooked IS2 source completely.

That really is a fantastic CD, Glenn did an amazing job for everyone.

 

 

The only source code that seems to be pretty complete of these is Hover Strike. Didn't compile it myself though, so I can't tell if something is missing or not. It just "looks" quite complete.

Indeed, and I suppose I should revisit that if I ever have time.

 

However making a jump and run game isn't all that complicated. Games like jump and runs, 2D shooters and similar games are technically not as complicated (unless you really want to push the limits of the system), but these games require immense work of design and graphics.

This is a fact that many people overlook for homebrew games.

An author may be able to write a game, but working alone with

no graphics contributor or sound contributor is a nightmare. Any

polygon game is easier, as it's all algorithmic, few bitmaps req'd.

I've asked for graphics myself in the past. I've never had offers

which have materialised into fact when I gave my requirements.

 

However one thing that is often forgotten, is that even the games that do exist as source are still under copyright. So the those source codes may not be used. With the exception of those games that the developers actually game to the scene as "presents" for learning purpose of developers.

Yes, absolutely right. Point well made. Just because the source

for a game is made available, or is found, and made available (and

in the case of Atari code listed above it was found, never licensed,)

there is always going to be a problem using it to make another game.

 

Like it happened with the doom code I think. (Although the wad files are still copyrighted.)

Carl Forhan (Songbird) had to negotiate with ID in order to get

the source code for Doom released, yes. Although the PC Doom was

released as source, (although the WAD file cannot be used in any new

game, something new must be created from scratch), and once again

the resource issue comes up. Even if somebody fixed the issue with

creating the Jag Doom format WAD files, (and it would be easier to

get the Jag Doom to read PC format ones using the NUON code I

guess than to create a converter), what is the incentive. There is

still no suitable "from scratch, no ID content" WAD file available...

The terms from ID say we can use and alter the code, providing it

is not used for commercial product, but no ID WAD data is allowed.

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

[jaysmith2000]

Hello,

 

I forgot about JEP #3 from Jay! You can find there VARUNAS FORCES LEVEL EDITOR and VARUNAS FORCES SPRITE ENGINE...

a) Are these for the Jaguar or PC?

b) These are only for JEP#3 owners aren't they? I don't have it.

c) Is this source available anywhere for non JEP#3 owners?

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

 

a) The engines run on a PC. They allow you to devlop levels, insert enemies/characters and compile to a demo. It's a bit buggy, but the later version I sent out recently seems to work well.

b) Correct, only JEP#3 owners have this (at least that I'm aware of)

c) Not that I'm aware of.

[Alex Czarnowski]

Hello,

a) Are these for the Jaguar or PC?

b) These are only for JEP#3 owners aren't they? I don't have it.

c) Is this source available anywhere for non JEP#3 owners?

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

 

I was about to answer all of those question but Jay did it already and as he is the author of JEP series I guess there is nothing I could add to his explanation. The only thing that comes to my mind is that we should talk Jay into making more JEP releases. All packs are really great!

 

As a side note I believe right now we have a very strange problem because there are relatively huge amount of source code available both in C and assembly and it takes time to get through all of it. If we would have just Atari samples than probably some people would concentrate more on writing own code instead on analyzing those files.

Cheers,

[jaysmith2000]

Hello,

a) Are these for the Jaguar or PC?

b) These are only for JEP#3 owners aren't they? I don't have it.

c) Is this source available anywhere for non JEP#3 owners?

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

 

I was about to answer all of those question but Jay did it already and as he is the author of JEP series I guess there is nothing I could add to his explanation. The only thing that comes to my mind is that we should talk Jay into making more JEP releases. All packs are really great!

 

As a side note I believe right now we have a very strange problem because there are relatively huge amount of source code available both in C and assembly and it takes time to get through all of it. If we would have just Atari samples than probably some people would concentrate more on writing own code instead on analyzing those files.

Cheers,

 

Thanks Alex. There's plenty more source code out there, but no point in releasing it until someone does something with all the goodies that are already out there. Another JEP pack someday might happen though...

 

I've noticed an increased interest in the JEP packs lately. Too bad they're out of production. An auction on ebay just ended for pack #1 and it went for more than double what I originally sold these for.

 

Jason

[justclaws]

Hello,

 

I was about to answer all of those question but Jay did it already and as he is the author of JEP series I guess there is nothing I could add to his explanation. The only thing that comes to my mind is that we should talk Jay into making more JEP releases. All packs are really great!

I would be interested in an AtariHQ type "source only" pack maybe.

I am personally not interested in anything for the PC except dev tools.

 

As a side note I believe right now we have a very strange problem because there are relatively huge amount of source code available both in C and assembly and it takes time to get through all of it. If we would have just Atari samples than probably some people would concentrate more on writing own code instead on analyzing those files.

That is indeed ironic. However, for me, lots of time recently has

been spent testing code for (thinking) 1... 2... 3... 4... maybe 5...

other developers, providing feedback and occasionally debugging

information. That's really nice. However, it's also a factor in *my*

own code being disastrously behind schedule. A cool problem eh?

 

I really think these other people have more interesting projects

than me anyway, and I learn from these things anyway, and the

loyal Jaguar fans wanting more games will care more for some

finished games than some more stupid code from me anyway.

 

I hope to get my name on at least one of these projects! It was

omitted as an oversight from Protector SE & Ocean Depths CD

so far; maybe I must release something to get my name on it!

Cheers,

Richard / JustClaws.

[Stone]

I've noticed an increased interest in the JEP packs lately.  Too bad they're out of production.  An auction on ebay just ended for pack #1 and it went for more than double what I originally sold these for.

Oooh, excellent...I've a spare pack #1 if anyone's interested - no reasonable offer refused

 

Stone

[Starcat]

Hi Richard !

 

Hello,

 

I was about to answer all of those question but Jay did it already and as he is the author of JEP series I guess there is nothing I could add to his explanation. The only thing that comes to my mind is that we should talk Jay into making more JEP releases. All packs are really great!

I would be interested in an AtariHQ type "source only" pack maybe.

I am personally not interested in anything for the PC except dev tools.

 

As a side note I believe right now we have a very strange problem because there are relatively huge amount of source code available both in C and assembly and it takes time to get through all of it. If we would have just Atari samples than probably some people would concentrate more on writing own code instead on analyzing those files.

That is indeed ironic. However, for me, lots of time recently has

been spent testing code for (thinking) 1... 2... 3... 4... maybe 5...

other developers, providing feedback and occasionally debugging

information. That's really nice. However, it's also a factor in *my*

own code being disastrously behind schedule. A cool problem eh?

 

I really think these other people have more interesting projects

than me anyway, and I learn from these things anyway, and the

loyal Jaguar fans wanting more games will care more for some

finished games than some more stupid code from me anyway.

 

I hope to get my name on at least one of these projects! It was

omitted as an oversight from Protector SE & Ocean Depths CD

so far; maybe I must release something to get my name on it!

Cheers,

Richard / JustClaws.

 

Don't worry, in the next Starcat Dev release, you will be mentioned

And I hope this time people will not just buy it because it is there, but because they like what they buy

 

Regards, Lars.

[vanadium]

I've noticed an increased interest in the JEP packs lately.  Too bad they're out of production.  An auction on ebay just ended for pack #1 and it went for more than double what I originally sold these for.  

 

Jason

 

...an investment, indeed!

[justclaws]

Hello,

 

Ok, I wanted to know if the source code for Bubsy exists... thinking maybe Bubsy 1 & 2 could be made as well...

 

.... but here is a more general question along with that... what source code exists out there?  (I know IS2, Fight for Life, Doom, ect...)

Did anybody ever come back to you with graphics or source for this?

I'm still chasing Club Drive source, that will be interesting in the end,

but as has been said, current sources have not been much utilised.

However, people have to have interest in what is released to use it.

 

I'm particurly interested in any original graphics for any games, too.

 

Cheers,

JustClaws.

[Symmetry of TNG]

Hi!

 

Just my personal thoughts about ...people "holding back" src due to the fact that current src has not been "used" (incase someone would do that).

 

I think that is wrong policy... 1st of all for a src to be usefull for a different game (ie not just a recompile) it Must be written by a good coder!.. 2nd of all Well documented! Or it is pritty useless...

Currently the released src to the jag comunity hasnt been that.... "usefull" i would say.. take for example FFL ...it is totally useless for anyone whanting to do 3D gfx... if you deside to spend 2years getting into the src then your better of writing your own 3d engine anyhow...

 

The Doom src is... well.. more interesting I would say since it is made in (mostly) C.. and hence is a "good" example of how to code (sloppy code) in C.

 

But!.. most usefull (atleast to me) is the hints & tipps left by coders, discovering bugs, arguing strategies on how to tackle problems... examples of good commented code is Ataris 3Dlibs, Highlander and AvP..

 

But my point beeing.. just because noone used these codes for any new game doenst mean that NOT releasing (for example) Battlemorph code, IS, CD, whatever... would be a good idea... (hmmm was that correctly logically? ...meaning: releasing All code is a Good idea! ..since there might be pieces of code, ideas, in it that would help someone outthere...

 

F.ex. FFL src didnt help me at all, and never will, since it is bad written (unreadable), neither will Doom since it is horrible written... and on top of that in slow C! .... But Battlemorph code, IS, C-Drive might reveal something useful.. Personally I would especially whant to look at BM code... to see how they made the most impressive 3D game out there.. working together with CD...

 

So.. my pleadge to anyone "Holding back" on something that could be released is: Please Dont! =)

 

/Sym