Could a new company make it today?

[Atarifever]

Hey, this is just something I've been thinking about. Anyone think that a Nintendo or Sega type company will ever spring up again? By that I mean a company whose primary buisness is games. I mean, the game industry is making more money than ever before, so economics would say this should lead new companies into the market (I think Microsoft can be considered one example of this in video games) that will try to take much of this profit for themselves. However, the videogame industry is also more expensive to be in right now, and it seems that in order to take advantage of the current market one needs to already have amassed quite a fortune. Also, this should mean that other rich companies should also soon try to break in (can anyone say 3DO 360, God I hope not). Anyone think this'll happen, say, generation after next. So I guess that's two questions, but I'm sure they won't both fit in the title, so I guess it stays the way it is. Now, I'm aware this sort of thing has been mentioned in passing in a thousand posts, but hey, its the summer and I'm bored.

[kevin242]

Hey, this is just something I've been thinking about.  Anyone think that a Nintendo or Sega type company will ever spring up again?  By that I mean a company whose primary buisness is games.  I mean, the game industry is making more money than ever before, so economics would say this should lead new companies into the market (I think Microsoft can be considered one example of this in video games) that will try to take much of this profit for themselves.  However, the videogame industry is also more expensive to be in right now, and it seems that in order to take advantage of the current market one needs to already have amassed quite a fortune.  Also, this should mean that other rich companies should also soon try to break in (can anyone say 3DO 360, God I hope not).  Anyone think this'll happen, say, generation after next.  So I guess that's two questions, but I'm sure they won't both fit in the title, so I guess it stays the way it is.  Now, I'm aware this sort of thing has been mentioned in passing in a thousand posts, but hey, its the summer and I'm bored.

866664[/snapback]

 

 

I dont think Nintendo or Sega "just sprang up" Nintendo has been around for a century.

I do think a better example would be Apple or Atari in the 70's, both of which came

out of nowhere... and NO currently I dont see how you could. Even if you came

up with a platform, you would need a lot of money to produce it and get it out at a

competitive price. Also how woould you get developers behind you? I suppose it is

possible, but you would need to have ALOT of money to do it and something that

really trumped the competition. I dont think you could just spring out of nowhere

from a garage like the golden age.

[Ferris]

I'm sure as hell working on it. Have the right people on board too :-)

[Ze_ro]

A number of companies have tried to spring up into the console (Infineon and Indrema come to mind), but they've pretty much all failed, most of them without even releasing anything at all. Companies like Tapwave and whoever makes the Gizmondo are trying to make it in the industry, but I honestly don't think it's possible for a company to come out of nowhere to dominate the industry anymore. There are pretty much only two ways to get into the industry:

1. Have a large war chest of funds (Generally accumulated from success in another industry) so you can afford all the marketing and take the necessary risks to become a big fish. This seems to have worked great for Sony and (to a lesser degree) Microsoft.
   
2. Start off small, as a third party company, work up a base of fans, respect, and franchises, and then take a stab at the console market. The only company I can think of that fits this description is SNK... and things haven't worked out all that well for them. If you expand this to include companies that started off making arcade machines and branched into consoles, then you could include Atari, Nintendo and Sega.
   

The only companies I can see making a big splash in the console buisiness would be huge software giants like EA, Activision or Atari, all of whom would go via the second route. There are plenty of giants in the PC software and consumer electronics industries that could potentially break in as well, but I think that's much less likely.

 

Come to think of it, EA is already the only company that can make NFL games... what if they were also the only company that could sell you a machine to play it...?

 

--Zero

[davepesc]

Come to think of it, EA is already the only company that can make NFL games... what if they were also the only company that could sell you a machine to play it...?

 

--Zero

866730[/snapback]

 

 

They would own the world!

[Atarifever]

Come to think of it, EA is already the only company that can make NFL games... what if they were also the only company that could sell you a machine to play it...?

 

--Zero

866730[/snapback]

 

 

They would own the world!

866775[/snapback]

Then, with those profits, they could buy the exclusive rights to the frag grenade, armour, assult rifles, four piece tiles that fall, hearts as a symol of lives, food as a power-up, and the colour purple. They would truely be unstoppable. God have mercy on us all... but he won't because EA has him signed to a ten year contract which strictly forbids mercy.

[shep]

Come to think of it, EA is already the only company that can make NFL games... what if they were also the only company that could sell you a machine to play it...?

 

--Zero

866730[/snapback]

 

 

They would own the world!

866775[/snapback]

 

 

WILL SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!11!

[Flojomojo]

Agreed they don't just "spring up." Microsoft, for example, lost a lot on the XBOX console but has the resources to stick with it, unlike a small player like NUON or (heheh) Phantom. The market is competitive enough as it is, but I could imagine a big electronics player with enough manufacturing muscle throwing their hat in, as they have in the past. There are also possibilities for cross-licensing and OEM deals. Anything can happen and never say never, because:

 

- Nintendo was a playing card company for the majority of their existence.

- Samsung was a NUON partner.

- Philips had the Odyssey systems.

- Atari was owned by the company now known as AOL Time Warner, Hasbro, and now the "new" Atari, which also makes hardware.

- Mattel, the toy company, made Intellivision.

- Apple had the Pippin and could come back in a big iPod way when the time is right. Even if they don't, they will stay behind the scenes as development partners for game creation and digital media tools.

- Matsushita (Panasonic) made 3DO consoles.

- LG (then Goldstar) made 3DO consoles, too.

- Coleco was the COnneticut LEather COmpany, of all things!

- NEC made the PCEngine/TurboGrafx16 machine.

- JVC has made numerous Sega-compatible machines.

- Majesco has remanufactured Sega machines.

- Telegames has licensed Colecovision, now some other crazy company is on it (www.colecovision.com - very silly)

- Ever hear of Jakks Pacific before those all-in-one sticks? I hadn't, but those toys are huge now!

- Those little keychain tschotkes you get at McDonalds with Activision games on them are making money for someone.

- The Famiclones! Don't forget the Famiclones!

- Nokia is throwing money hand over fist at the N-Gage and Symbian platform, subsidizing neat games like Splinter Cell.

- Tapwave looks like they're going to be OEM only for their excellent Palm devices.

 

And that's just off the top of my head. There are probably dozens of venture capitalists that never got off the ground with their hardware development.

[Clock]

I think Nokia or Sony will own the handheld market as I see the future there being in mobile phone gaming. If Nokia stick it out and make improvements in ergonomic design then they could get a lead on Sony. Of course Sony make phones too so they are the obvious competiter. PSP will no doubt be the big thing for the next 2-3 years, but after that cell phone gaming will rule....mark my words on that. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo joined forces with a cell phone manufacture sometime in the future.

 

As far as full blown consoles go, I think the current 3 will be all we get for a while. Possible future consoles could come from the big game publishing houses such as EA, Midway, Atari and Rockstar, but I doubt it. Another possibilty is someone like Matsushita releasing a console in the far east and once it gains respect they could release it in the west. Seriously though I doubt any of that would happen.

 

I would like to read this post again in 5 years time and see how far/close I am to the mark.

[shep]

Nokia will never own the handheld market.

[Atarifever]

Nokia will never own the handheld market.

869287[/snapback]

Well, after playing Dracula and Frankenstein for the Sega CD people may have said the same thing about Sony and the console market. After the tepid run of the Master System I'm sure no one expected much from the Genesis. Now, I don't hold any illusions that this will happen anytime in the near future, but I think it's high time I pointed out what Nokia has been doing.

1) They have been supporting a system since 2003 that any other company would have dropped already and given up on. How long was the Game.com, 32x or virtual boy supported?

2) They are developing and have developed games that are really very good for handheld and online handheld play. I won't bother to mention them because I've done that enough times.

3) They are turning the NGage into a feature on an entire line of smartphones that can all be had for cheap or free by users anywhere where phones are bought.

4) They have produced and are giving out developer kits to any interested developers that will make sure that game developers can develop games that will work across the Nokia cell phone family.

5) They are making N-Gage games all available online in the same way that itunes works now. That way it doesn't matter how few stores carry the games, as you can dowload all the games you want. They are also planning to continue to make the games available in stores like they are now, so you'll have options.

6) They are going to be releasing an N-Gage 2 for more hardcore gamers (as opposed to the just N-Gage enabled phones).

7) They have already redesigned the N-Gage to meet peoples complaints.

8 ) They are already working on correcting the remaining design flaws so there will be even less complaints about the N-Gage 2.

9) They are constantly working on making the N-Gage arena offer more features, to the point where I don't see any games coming out now without some decent online feature (Catan, Civilzations, and High Sieze are great examples for strategy games, and even racers have four way shadow racing).

 

I don't see how this doesn't point to a company intent on breaking into the market. They are very rich and can continue this sort of effort well through the next generation. They have shown no signs of giving up, only of coming up with better ideas. If they even make the tiniest bit of profit over their next generation, I don't see them going away. Now, I don't think Nintendo is losing that market anytime soon, but give Nokia time before you think they're the panasonic 3d0 of the portable market.

Edited June 6, 2005 by Atarifever

[shep]

Tiger redesigned the Game.com

 

 

Last time I checked, they didn't own the handheld market.

 

 

And news flash: all hardware makers give out development kits for game companies

Edited June 7, 2005 by shep

[MosDN]

The Gamepark GP32 is also a good example.

 

A success without expensive advertisement campaigns.

[Atarifever]

Tiger redesigned the Game.com

 

 

Last time I checked, they didn't own the handheld market.

 

 

And news flash:  all hardware makers give out development kits for game companies

869496[/snapback]

Nintendo redesigned the Gameboy, last time I checked they did. Also, if you read my post, you'll see that I didn't say the redesign would give them the handheld market, or that they would get the handheld market even next generation. I was pointing out that they were making good moves to make them a contender some day in the future. By definition, a contender could someday upset the champ. By that time the champ may be Sony.

 

Besides, Tiger is hardly Nokia. I also doubt they released the Game.com on an entire line of phones, or moved their games online, or put out a Game.com 2.

The developer kits are important because, as I understand it, they are not kits for just N-Gage software, they are kits that will make games work across most of Nokia's phones. Nokia is also working on getting phone vendors to be able to sell these games to people with regular non N-Gage phones. I brought that up to show that they are trying to find even more niches where their name will be associated with games. One of their best games now (snakes) is based on an old phone IP, so continuing to play around in one area, may give them more good IP for the other. Trying to make it easy for phone game deverlopers to have a very large audience and trying to change the way those games are made is a very big step in that market.

Edited June 7, 2005 by Atarifever

[Atarifever]

The Gamepark GP32 is also a good example.

 

A success without expensive advertisement campaigns.

869649[/snapback]

 

I like it when things like that make it. I hope that a company with a product like that really goes mainstream enough to be a full fledged competator. Nothing like having a hugh up-hill struggle to make a company start to innovate.

[the marvellous one]

I really don't think there's room for any more companies like Sega, Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft. Christ- Microsoft lost money on every single Xbox that was sold AND they're going to be losing $75 on every Xbox 360 sold at the RRP of $300- and as that price gets dropped, they're going to lose even more!! I don't think there are many, if any companies that can actually afford those kinds of losses as part of a long term plan....

I'm one of the people who think that there should just be one universal console anyway- it would work out best for everyone!! Gamers wouldn't have to buy three different consoles to play all their favourite games (I've missed out on quite a few PS2 and Gamecube titles that I've been really keen in playing, just because I can't afford three consoles, three sets of memory cards, pads etc...) We wouldn't have all this pointless debate over which is the best console (at the end of the day, everyone has their opinion- but why do we always need to hear everyone's reasons for hating PS2/Xbox/Gamecube, it's normally just because they don't have the console anyway!!! That's what I like here, everyone wants to talk about their passion for gaming, not their hatred of it!) And obviously, there would be no need to mess around porting versions to multiple consoles, which would save the companies making the games a lot of time and money- thus giving them time to make less buggy games and *SHOCK, HORROR* maybe even think about trying something new. Xbox gamers wouldn't miss out on innovations like the EyeToy or Gamcube/GBA connectivity, PS2 and Gamecube owners wouldn't miss out on a quality online service, Xbox and PS2 owners wouldn't miss out on the quite frankly inimitable genius that is Nintendo's first party catalogue (and Resident Evil 4) etc etc etc..... You get the picture!!

[shep]

Nintendo redesigned the Gameboy...

 

 

But not because it was doing poorly like both Tiger and Nokia have done. And don't try to hand me a line where the Ngage is doing fine.

 

Plus what is the purpose of Ngage games being put on other phones other than prooving that there is nothing special about the Ngage hardware, as Ngage emulators for phones have already done.

[Atarifever]

Actually, the original gameboy redesign was an attempt to boost slugging sales. I would never try to "hand you a line" that I have shown no indication of believeing myself.

I find the nothing specal line to be a little confusing though. The GBA is basically an SNES, and I can get an SNES emmulator for my N-Gage. Also, the N-Gage is about the equivalant of a PS1, while the DS is a little better than an N64, so I don't understand what you mean by saying the NGage is nothing special, I think all you're doing is ponting out that phones are getting really good.

Edited June 8, 2005 by Atarifever

[cyberneticimplant]

I don't know if a company would want to take the risk involved in spending millions of dollars in making a new console and competing with the already well established ones.

 

The main audience for games are kids, not 1337 gamers who play Colecovision for 5 hours a day in the year 2005. When you got your first console did you get a popular system or some obscure console nobody ever heard of?

 

Anyways, console wars are a good reason to live.

[intvgene]

I could see Samsung entering the market someday. At least in Korea. There are two reasons why I could see this happening: a) the company is big enough and already in the home consumer market b) the korean market alone might be attractive enough to get them interested.

 

I didn't say it would happen, but there one of the few companies that I could see doing it.