Shiro Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 (edited) Impressiv, very impressiv. A new Game for the old C64 and i never saw those grafics before... The C64 is still burning... Please download trailer: http://www.protovision-online.de/md...ailer_small.mpg Soundtrack preview: http://www.protovision-online.de/md..._metal_dust.mp3 Edited August 3, 2005 by Shiro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexKIDD Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 The screenshots looks cool but I couldn't get the links to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiro Posted August 3, 2005 Author Share Posted August 3, 2005 (edited) The screenshots looks cool but I couldn't get the links to work. 903879[/snapback] Please try: http://www.protovision-online.de (it was just the background grafic ) Edited August 3, 2005 by Shiro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moycon Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 Oh wow! You're not kidding, Those graphics are AWESOME!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 It takes a bit of extra grunt though to make the game what it is: SuperCPU, extra RAM and faster loading source (either 1581 or FD2000 drive). Having said that, those items just give the C64 quicker processing speed, more memory and faster loading times. What you see is still the C64 doing its thing with what it was given in 1982... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uosipa llamxew Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 Holy smokes! That trailer sold me! I've wanted a C-64 for years - I'm still looking. This may make me get my butt in gear and finally eBay one up! Was that a second player or some "option" power-up? I hope it's a second player! Gosh, it was like a messed-up, high speed, psychedelic version of Axelay or something! I want... I want! /me runs to take a downer pill... that was too much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jess Ragan Posted August 3, 2005 Share Posted August 3, 2005 Zoinks, Scoob. That's pretty impressive... it's like an Amiga-quality game on a Commodore 64! Too bad you've got to 32X your computer with an upgrade module before it'll run... JR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 Looks pretty cool. Quote from http://www.protovision-online.de/md/info.htm - ...Because of the lack of development tools - there was only the (a bit unstable and buggy) "Flash8 AssBlaster" - and due to some hardware problems, development went very slowly... Hmm... AssBlaster. No wonder the dev had problems Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 Wow, this game looks amazing! But requiring a SuperCPU, 4MB RAM, and a 3.5" drive pretty much ensures that only the hardcore will be able to play it --Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 The memory is standard PC sim tech, and a 3.5" drive isn't that hard to find on eBay (though a bit pricy, and you can search for the CMD alternatives). The only real sticking point is the SuperCPU, they are not easy to find spare and get made fairly slowly unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cybergoth Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 Hi there! Uihjah... The music was composed by Welle:Erdball? One of my favourite bands! Excellent Live show as well, I've seen them a dozen times during the last decade. (Once again playing in my hometown in two months: http://www.musikkantine.de/programm/konzert.html (See? Only two days later I'll also see The Mission! *bounce* ) So will the music appear on CD soon? Greetings, Manuel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
video game addict Posted August 4, 2005 Share Posted August 4, 2005 Hi there! Uihjah... The music was composed by Welle:Erdball? One of my favourite bands! Excellent Live show as well, I've seen them a dozen times during the last decade. (Once again playing in my hometown in two months: http://www.musikkantine.de/programm/konzert.html (See? Only two days later I'll also see The Mission! *bounce* ) So will the music appear on CD soon? Greetings, Manuel 904328[/snapback] http://www.protovision-online.de/md/music.htm From the Welle:Erdball website it does appear to be listed. Contains bonus C64 materials as well. Looks like they use the C64s alot in their music! But what's with that Nyntändo-Schock from back in '93? hehe guess it took them awhile to get back to their roots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 The memory is standard PC sim tech, and a 3.5" drive isn't that hard to find on eBay (though a bit pricy, and you can search for the CMD alternatives). The only real sticking point is the SuperCPU, they are not easy to find spare and get made fairly slowly unfortunately. Alright, so lets see here... I looked on eBay and couldn't find any SuperCPU or SuperRAM's around, nor have any ended recently, so I guess we'll have to go by CMD's prices here and say that the combination will cost $259. RAM is easily available, so lets just say I can get the actual RAM chips for free. Then we come to the disk drive... we have two options here I guess... a 1581 is the low-end solution, an FD-2000 is high-end (I suppose a hard drive is also an option, although the prices of CMD's hard drives are better left unmentioned, and you're still stuck with how to get the files off the disks and onto the drive). CMD's FD-2000 sells for $180 (Again, couldn't find any on eBay), and I see that a 1581 sold recently for $42.50 on eBay (which is cheaper than I usually see them go for). If you know of cheaper places to find any of this stuff, I'd gladly consider them. So basically, if I decided I had to play this game, I'd have to buy $300 worth of (obsolete) hardware, which doesn't even include the computer itself which I already have (Plus the game itself costs something too, although I haven't seen a price yet). Are there many of you people out there THIS devoted to your C64 that you have all this already? I consider myself a C64 fan... I still have a C-128 hooked up in the basement, I have a 1571 with a parallel port hacked into it, I've set up a host computer to serve files to a C64 through an X1541 cable, and I even have a Retro Replay... but sheesh, this is almost as bad as the Amiga scene. --Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 So basically, if I decided I had to play this game, I'd have to buy $300 worth of (obsolete) hardware, which doesn't even include the computer itself which I already have (Plus the game itself costs something too, although I haven't seen a price yet). Are there many of you people out there THIS devoted to your C64 that you have all this already? I consider myself a C64 fan... I still have a C-128 hooked up in the basement, I have a 1571 with a parallel port hacked into it, I've set up a host computer to serve files to a C64 through an X1541 cable, and I even have a Retro Replay... but sheesh, this is almost as bad as the Amiga scene.--Zero 904842[/snapback] I've got a few C64s, a C128 and SX64. I've got a PC slaved with 1541emu, an RR, MMC64 and even a C-One. And I'm still never going to play this game because of the requirements - so I would imagine the target audience is *very* *very* small as well But it's still a cool effort Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacbthPSW Posted August 5, 2005 Share Posted August 5, 2005 So basically, if I decided I had to play this game, I'd have to buy $300 worth of (obsolete) hardware I don't know if the SuperCPU and FD-2000 can be called obsolete hardware - mine were both bought back in '96, but they continue to be cutting edge C64 hardware. It's not like they've been replaced by superior C64 hardware. If you're comparing them to modern PC or gaming hardware, yeah, obviously they're "obsolete" but in that sense, they were obsolete even when they were being designed, and the first one was manufactured. which doesn't even include the computer itself which I already have (Plus the game itself costs something too, although I haven't seen a price yet). Are there many of you people out there THIS devoted to your C64 that you have all this already? I consider myself a C64 fan... I still have a C-128 hooked up in the basement, I have a 1571 with a parallel port hacked into it, I've set up a host computer to serve files to a C64 through an X1541 cable, and I even have a Retro Replay... but sheesh, this is almost as bad as the Amiga scene. Yeah, buying this hardware just to play Metal Dust is pretty crazy - but those of us that have bought the hardware already over the past 9 years for their other benefits (if you prefer to work with real C64 hardware for programming or productivity, they're invaluable devices) finally have a game that makes good use of the hardware. Though being priced in Euros makes the game itself more expensive than I care to pay for at this time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 I don't know if the SuperCPU and FD-2000 can be called obsolete hardware - mine were both bought back in '96, but they continue to be cutting edge C64 hardware. Perhaps, but the fact is you're basically paying $300 for a 65816 chip, a 3.5" floppy drive, and some custom chips to make them play nice with the C64. This is not state of the art technology here. Even though it's a niche market, I find it impossible to justify such a purchase. those of us that have bought the hardware already over the past 9 years for their other benefits (if you prefer to work with real C64 hardware for programming or productivity, they're invaluable devices) So you're actually still using a C64 for "real" work? I never understood the appeal of spending so much just to use an old system to perform tasks that it's still not well-suited for. The Amiga scene is just as bad... they're nice computers and all, but I don't know how you people can justify spending more to make them "less obsolete" than you would spend on a regular Windows, Mac, or Linux based machine with 50 times as much power. --Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moycon Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 This is not state of the art technology here. Even though it's a niche market, I find it impossible to justify such a purchase. Just out of curiosity what's the most you have spent on an Atari 2600 game? Don't get me wrong, I agree with you, but lets face it, some hard core gamers drop wads on obsolete products that make even $300 look piddley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laner Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 I wonder if it would be possible to play it with one of the C64 emulators... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacbthPSW Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Perhaps, but the fact is you're basically paying $300 for a 65816 chip, a 3.5" floppy drive, and some custom chips to make them play nice with the C64. This is not state of the art technology here. Even though it's a niche market, I find it impossible to justify such a purchase. Yup, spending that just to play a game would be crazy. But surely you can understand that there are some people that crazy around here But compare the actual r&d and manufacture of the SuperCPU to something like the Cuttle Cart 2 that I and a bunch of others paid $200 for (and hardly ever use, personally). I have enough of an understanding of what goes into products like this to appreciate that the SuperCPU is entirely worth $200 or $300 if the Cuttle Cart 2 is worth $200. So you're actually still using a C64 for "real" work? Strangely, I've actually entirely paid off my loan for my truck this year and last with C64 (and related) work, but that's not what you're really asking I have done some word processing and stuff like that on the C64, but no, I usually use one of my Windows machines for that nowadays. I do however still program on the real thing sometimes, though just in the last year I've started using cross-assemblers and emulators for the majority of development, mostly due to the ease of working on projects this way with a number of people in a team, with the internet being our main form of communication. The FD-2000 has been really useful when coding on the real thing, since it's a fair bit faster than a 1541, and especially because it gives oodles of space per disk. The SuperCPU has been a lot of fun to experiment with as well, since it allows you to make more use of the VIC and SID than you ever could at 1 Mhz. It's fun and familiar to a C64 programmer, but opens up new possibilities that appeal to some of us. I never understood the appeal of spending so much just to use an old system to perform tasks that it's still not well-suited for. The Amiga scene is just as bad... they're nice computers and all, but I don't know how you people can justify spending more to make them "less obsolete" than you would spend on a regular Windows, Mac, or Linux based machine with 50 times as much power. Remember that most SuperCPUs were sold in '96-'97 or so, when the relative advantage of the speed increase was a lot greater. It was extremely cool to go buy a 16MB stick for my SCPU at a mainstream store. Obviously people have all sorts of reasons for upgrading like this, though there are less "good reasons" now than there were 9 years ago when it was introduced. Common reasons included: People were comfortable with their apps (especially the GEOS suite) and $200 sped it up a whole lot without needing to learn anything new, people just like to tinker around, people were expecting a whole flood of new software to take advantage of the extra speed and RAM (which didn't happen), a 20 times speed increase was a great deal for $200. Since you're dwelling on the financial side of it, what other piece of computer hardware could you buy in 1996 and sell for nearly the same price 9 years later? I can't think of any. Anyway, if I decided to drop out of C64 land altogether, I could get a very large percentage of my money back on my SuperCPU and FD-2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacbthPSW Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 I wonder if it would be possible to play it with one of the C64 emulators... Not currently, as none of the C64 emulators handle SuperCPU emulation. There's a lot more to it than "just make it go faster". Though I bet the release of Metal Dust will have more people wanting SCPU emulation, and if one of those happens to be an emulator developer... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 Already asked about SuperCPU support in CCS and Vice about 2 years ago at the time the Metal Dust project started to get known Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted August 6, 2005 Share Posted August 6, 2005 This is not state of the art technology here. Even though it's a niche market, I find it impossible to justify such a purchase. Just out of curiosity what's the most you have spent on an Atari 2600 game? Well, I don't remember all of my purchases off-hand, but the most expensive was probably either Spacemaster X-7 or Atari Video Cube... $30 at most I think. However, I did spend about $250 on my Phantom-1 converter for the NeoGeo, so I suppose at least some amount of "touche" is in order. I'd love to have a SuperCPU and an FD-2000 personally, but the price just doesn't make it worthwhile to me. GEOS is nice and all, but I'm hard-pressed to find something in GEOS that I can't already do far better with my current computer, so aside from Metal Dust and some bragging rights, there really isn't all that much reason to get one. Same goes for a lot of the Amiga stuff I'm looking for. I want to get an accelerator for my Amiga 1200, but basically all I'll do with it is run WHDLoad games off the hard drive, rather than doing actual "work" with the machine. --Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emkay Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 It takes a bit of extra grunt though to make the game what it is: SuperCPU, extra RAM and faster loading source (either 1581 or FD2000 drive). Having said that, those items just give the C64 quicker processing speed, more memory and faster loading times. What you see is still the C64 doing its thing with what it was given in 1982... 904025[/snapback] Sorry for beeing blunt, but the graphics even looking like from 1982 (for a C64 at least).... 16 colours over the screen. Have you taken a look at Turrican 3? It looks (and seems to play) very similar to this 20MHz version. The most cpu time seems to be used for mixing the digi-tracks together. Heck.... with 20MHz the 800/Xl/XE could display 128 colours onscreen for games, POKEY still has 4 PCM-voices wich would made AMIGA Mods playable only by feeding the PCM Data to every channel without mixing. Even multiple multiplexed PMg would be possible. You would have Games like Wolf 3D on this machine with 128 colours & 4 channel digi-music, which would even look better than many actual AMIGA games. To say it in other words: A C64 with a 20MHz CPU is no longer a C64...as a A8 isn't an A8 with such CPU. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayhem Posted August 8, 2005 Share Posted August 8, 2005 (edited) You have to remember that Metal Dust is based on the Katakis/Denaris/Enforcer school of shooters which was written by Manfred Trenz. Whom was also responsible for the Turrican games. So I'm not surprised they rather look similar What I meant by the "using what it had given" is that say unlike the NES for example which had extra chips often on the cart boards, everything in Metal Dust could be done by a bare bones C64. Just a lot slower that's all It's not really any different to the chipped SNES games... extra processing power cos the CPU of it was so slow to begin with. You could do a cut down version of Metal Dust for non SuperCPU machines, but it wouldn't be as good of course. So by the virtue, any NES and SNES game with a supplementary chip on it, you would say the machine was no longer an NES or SNES then You can get easily more than 16 colours on C64 at the same time... has been done since the late 80s... Edited August 8, 2005 by MayhemUK Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ze_ro Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 It's not really any different to the chipped SNES games... extra processing power cos the CPU of it was so slow to begin with. You could do a cut down version of Metal Dust for non SuperCPU machines, but it wouldn't be as good of course. So by the virtue, any NES and SNES game with a supplementary chip on it, you would say the machine was no longer an NES or SNES then I'd love to see someone make a Metal Dust cartridge that had a built-in SuperCPU and RAM, that would be hilarious. --Zero Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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