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That's what happens when fools start talking about copyrights.  :roll:

1012914[/snapback]

:sad:

glad i got my copy

thanks for all the time and energy 3d stooges!

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How do you know that they stopped selling it due to copywrite infringement?

 

I know that in another thread they had talked about having "bugs" in the game that they had to work out and they were going to stop selling them until they fixed the bugs.

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"That's what happens when fools start talking about copyrights."

 

They say they secured permission from the copyright holder, so it's not some company like Midway or Namco.

 

Sounds like they're just waiting to fix that bug.

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Oh no, it has nothing to do with bugs. Permission was secured from Jamie Fenton, the author of arcade Gorf, but there is a concern that the rights may actually be held by another party/company. So, production is suspended while these details are being worked through.

 

Hopefully this story has a happy ending - I was really looking forward to Gorf plus & Gorf 3D

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That's what happens when fools start talking about copyrights.  :roll:

1012914[/snapback]

 

Let's keep this civilized please. I don't want to lock/delete this thread.

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"Oh no, it has nothing to do with bugs. Permission was secured from Jamie Fenton, the author of arcade Gorf, but there is a concern that the rights may actually be held by another party/company."

 

I doubt it was his to give then (I didn't realize he was the programmer, the other thead made it sound like he owned all rights to it officially) based off a few law courses I've taken in college. Most likely his employer (Midway?) owns all rights to his work during the course of his/her (Jamie could mean either I suppose) employment, unless for some reason game programming is a special circumstance.

 

Probably a good idea to be checking. Maybe even if Midway still retains any rights to it, they could arrange something. We saw a licensed Total Carnage after all...

Edited by Atariboy

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Gorf told me he doesn't want anything Gorf related posted here ever again, so maybe I should lock and delete this. What do you in the Jaguar community think?

 

Please remove ANY references to Gorf from AA completely.

 

He also told me that real men do not debate man to man via PM. They apparently only do so publicly with an audience on a site hostile to the person who Gorf invented a conflict with in his mind that is unviewable to me unless I sign up, get my account validated then post at least ten times because I guess not having the freedom to view a forum as a guest is only a problem when the forum is blocked on Atariage. :ponder:

 

And do me a favor, PM's

are as weak as you can get. As far as replying to this? I really could

care less what you have to offer at this point. You are clearly one sided.

Not to mention your high and mighty, better than everyone attitude is

unwelcome. Come over to JSII and learn how freedom really works.

Debate me there in public where I wont be banned or my posts defending myself wont be deleted.....if you have the stomach.

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Ironically the whole pissing war started when I politely asked him not to pour fuel on the fire by flaming Nebraska or people who ask legit questions, and I sent it to him in a PM. I got back an angry "Are you some kind of moderator here? Are you going to delete my posts and ban me if I don't do what you want?"

 

This guy is the textbook definition of overreaction.

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Hi!

 

Freedom? I wouldn't call that freedom.

You can't read JS2 when you are not a member. If you are a member you have to post enough to stay a member, even if you have nothing to say. You are basically forced to post. At least some people (including me) don't care enough about the forum to do that, so they can't read any posts. It has been that way for months or years.

Now that Atariage decided to make the jag forum invisible to those who are not signed up (which is nothing that I support, but I can understand it, as a lot of people seem to read it just to be able to badmouth it on JS2), you claim that Atariage was the bad forum where you had no freedom? It’s just another way of self defense.

 

But I can understand why Gorf feels the way he does about JS2.

Just the word freedom he used is misplaced in this case, at least in my vocabulary.

On Atariage, I can post what I want, whenever I want, and I don't need to do anything to earn the right to read or post.

Lately you need to sign up to do that, but beyond that you don't have to do anything.

He probably prefers JS2, because his pals are over there and because people praise his work, instead of criticising it. That's just the normal thing to do I guess.

You always go where you feel more welcome. Supportive words always make you feel more welcome.

I can understand that very well. It's the same reason I don't visit JS2. I don't like my work to be badmouthed, flamed for no reason, but the fun of it and I don't like it when people spread lies about me. And I'm tired of reading junk like that or protecting myself and correcting lies. I don’t want to fight all day. I got tired of that years ago. And here on Atariage I don't have to fight.

On the net, freedom is just as good as the moderators that protect it. Abusing this freedom by flaming others or spreading lies about them, is something they have to prevent, otherwise freedom turns into a monarchy, where only the king is free.

 

Personally I don't have the time or interest to post or even read JS2, there is so much junk that is said over there, it would just get me down. All this is just a hobby and in the end, it's not important at all. I have plenty things I can do with my time and all are better than wasting them with message on a webforum that just try to make me angry.

I just develop Jaguar games for fun and when the fun ends the development ends.

So I guess I do everyone a favor, who is still looking forward to one of my projects, when I ignore some of the fools on the net, who have a blast at lying and badmouthing the efforts of others. That way they can't get me demotivated, which means higher chances for me to continue my project work as well.

I know others who care more about what is said, are often down and frustrated and I at least try to get motivated again, to keep some of the most promising Jaguar projects alive.

 

Of course I know this message will be stolen from here and reposted on JS2 anyway, so they can again have a blast at dissecting my words and rearranging them in random order, kind of like those funny anagram generators. (Ever tried those? really funny)

But I don't care about that. I can't prevent it and I don't have to read the results anyway.

To me Atariage is THE Atari forum out there. More than that. Atariage has become the home of the Atari scene for many years now. Keep up the good work and don't let anybody badmouth that effort.

 

Regards, Lars.

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I totally agree with Lars and have spoken to Albert about whats been going on many times recently. Over on JS2, for those that don't know, they started an entire thread about me just because I have stood up to people who flame and expressed opinions they don't like. They made personal attacks on me and the British in general before moving on to other duel forum members who told them it was pathetic. I tried to defend myself several times only to be mis-quoted (like Lars says they move words around) and accused of being a "shit and run" who posts and leaves. I have stayed signed on for whole evenings only to find as soon a I log off another 20 posts appeared, how can I defend that? The moderators they do have don't even do their job, in fact they joined in - how professional is that? How someone can run a forum like that is beyond me, Jay accused AA of being a dictatorship, well there is only one dictator and you look at him every morning in the mirror. A person who controls the flow of information, allows personnal and down right abusive attacks on anyone who disagrees and is holding the only copies of several un-released Jag games for his own gain. Pot, Kettle?

 

Keep up the good work Albert and all the Mods at AA, this is an excellent site and I speak for myself and many of the british Jag community when I say you have our continued support.

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Gorf told me he doesn't want anything Gorf related posted here ever again, so maybe I should lock and delete this. What do you in the Jaguar community think?

 

People post at their own peril. Seems to me he wants the Gorf stuff deleted out of spite to AA, or he thinks some of the information posted could harm any copyright battle he has to deal with in which that wouldn't matter as everything posted on the internet is cached and deleting something doesn't actually get rid of it, so that would be pointless. Besides, under what authority does he have to dictate what is and isn't posted on AA? Screw him, thats what I think.

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@Lars

I agree with your statement completely. i wish that there could somehow someday be a united front between ALL jag users. jsII AND aa

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I totally agree with Lars and have spoken to Albert about whats been going on many times recently. Over on JS2, for those that don't know, they started an entire thread about me just because I have stood up to people who flame and expressed opinions they don't like. They made personal attacks on me and the British in general before moving on to other duel forum members who told them it was pathetic. I tried to defend myself several times only to be mis-quoted (like Lars says they move words around) and accused of being a "shit and run" who posts and leaves. I have stayed signed on for whole evenings only to find as soon a I log off another 20 posts appeared, how can I defend that? The moderators they do have don't even do their job, in fact they joined in - how professional is that? How someone can run a forum like that is beyond me, Jay accused AA of being a dictatorship, well there is only one dictator and you look at him every morning in the mirror. A person who controls the flow of information, allows personnal and down right abusive attacks on anyone who disagrees and is holding the only copies of several un-released Jag games for his own gain. Pot, Kettle?

 

Keep up the good work Albert and all the Mods at AA, this is an excellent site and I speak for myself and many of the british Jag community when I say you have our continued support.

1013126[/snapback]

 

@Kizza, I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words into my mouth. I have NEVER stated Al is a "Dictator" on my site. You can check, you have full access there and logon regularly. In addition I don't control the flow of anything, I'm not sure what you are referring to? Could you be more specific? I'd love to know what copies of unreleased games I'm holding for my own GAIN? What gain?

 

@Lars, actually only the 10 post rule is enforced at JSII. Once you hit the 10 posts at JSII there is no requirement to continue to post on a regular basis. That was just a discussion that was had, but never implemented. I just wanted to clear that up.

Edited by jaysmith2000

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Wow - what a mess. I guess this is why 99.9% of my Atari time is spent on my little 8-bit machines.

 

Stephen Anderson

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Hello,

 

If you're going to reply to this thread in way negative to 3DStooges I'd

be grateful if you didn't bother. Keep your opinions to yourself for once,

the team could do with a pat on a back and a beer, not a slap in the face.

Lots of people may be upset and say bad things in haste. Give it time...

 

The questions raised here about rights were also raised on JS-II, but it

is a pity to see non-regulars marching into a forum and upsetting others

with a "holier than though" attitude. AtariAge should be Atari-4-All-Ages,

and some new fans brought up with emulators seem to think that just

because they can download a ROM image, it's legal, that's the MP3 age.

I personally think the law should be enforced. I BUY my software/music.

 

Steve is doing that which he thinks is right. I hope Midway will be helpful

and see that there is an opportunity for them in this release in bringing

the name Gorf into circulation again. The publicity from allowing a small

homebrew developer to create a great arcade perfect implementation of

their game on a dead platform will undoubtedly get into the press, even

if it's the Jaguar, and it would read well to hear a Gorf 360 is on the way.

 

I much admire his decision, it's best to be pragmatic do this now than get

into a shooting match with Midway later. I hope that in due course he gets

good news from them, and/or from Jamie about Ms.Gorf perhaps for Jag.

 

I'm so glad at least that all those years after he released an early Gorf

type game as a Jaguar demo, to encourage the homebrew scene, it finally

hit the Jaguar scene as a full-blown product even if it was only a brief time.

Graphics Man and JagMod know already I think, that I'll order their works!

 

The 3DStooges team's place in history is affirmed in any case. :)

 

I look forward to all their other games the guys are working on, and as

they've always known, if I can ever help somehow, they need only ask.

Home-brew developers in recent times have had a hard time of it in the

Jaguar scene, it seems that there is always somebody who wants to put

somebody else down for whatever they do. We need no more of that...

 

My Jaguar collection is a life-long keeper, and homebrews are pride of

place because I know they're created by passion, and not at all for $'s.

 

Regards,

JustClaws.

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I totally agree with Lars and have spoken to Albert about whats been going on many times recently. Over on JS2, for those that don't know, they started an entire thread about me just because I have stood up to people who flame and expressed opinions they don't like. They made personal attacks on me and the British in general before moving on to other duel forum members who told them it was pathetic. I tried to defend myself several times only to be mis-quoted (like Lars says they move words around) and accused of being a "shit and run" who posts and leaves. I have stayed signed on for whole evenings only to find as soon a I log off another 20 posts appeared, how can I defend that? The moderators they do have don't even do their job, in fact they joined in - how professional is that? How someone can run a forum like that is beyond me, Jay accused AA of being a dictatorship, well there is only one dictator and you look at him every morning in the mirror. A person who controls the flow of information, allows personnal and down right abusive attacks on anyone who disagrees and is holding the only copies of several un-released Jag games for his own gain. Pot, Kettle?

 

Keep up the good work Albert and all the Mods at AA, this is an excellent site and I speak for myself and many of the british Jag community when I say you have our continued support.

1013126[/snapback]

 

@Kizza, I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words into my mouth. I have NEVER stated Al is a "Dictator" on my site. You can check, you have full access there and logon regularly. In addition I don't control the flow of anything, I'm not sure what you are referring to? Could you be more specific? I'd love to know what copies of unreleased games I'm holding for my own GAIN? What gain?

 

@Lars, actually only the 10 post rule is enforced at JSII. Once you hit the 10 posts at JSII there is no requirement to continue to post on a regular basis. That was just a discussion that was had, but never implemented. I just wanted to clear that up.

1013168[/snapback]

 

I havn't put words into anyone's mouth as if the very fact YOU allowed a thread insulting a member of your forum to go ahead isn't bad enough you encouraged, supported and agreed with the personnal and downright disgusting comments made by the the likes of T-Bird and others. You have stated several times that you have Arena Football, Tiny Toons and Robinson's Requiem (probaly others too) so where are they? Are you going to release them to the community? And don't quote "copyright" as a reason it didn't stop you releasing Fight For Life Beta.

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Regarding Gorf no longer being for sale.... it's very disheartening that production must be suspended but I guess everyone can agree it's for the best. I wish the 3DStooges well with any future developments they may try to tackle.... Rest assured 'loyal' Jaguar fans will truly appreciate your continued support, thank you.... 3DStooges.

 

 

Wow - what a mess.  I guess this is why 99.9% of my Atari time is spent on my little 8-bit machines.

 

Stephen Anderson

1013185[/snapback]

 

"The only way to win is not to play..."

 

Sadly this is the reason some closer freinds of mine that enjoy the Jaguar, just as much as everyone else does, seem to have faded behind the lines and back away from the Jaguar scene as a whole. People just don't want to get involved and to deal with it, so they just leave... never to come back.

 

It's pretty shitty to know that Jaguar development, including the community as a whole, is slowly deteriorated by such ruckus. The people in the community is what makes this whole "Atari" thing so much fun. Meeting, talking, the woulda/coulda/shouldas and concerncs. Admittingly, there will be hiccups here and there, there always is.... but everyone is blowing it out of proportion.

 

The Jaguar has a passionate following. The people who 'love' will get back up off the ground and rejoice after the dust has settled... while everyone else will move on because it didn't really matter to them to begin with. 1993 was a remarkeable year for Atari and the Jaguar.... we should really focus on preserving the good(s) no matter what planet we may reside on ( Cybermorph :) ) while we continue to support game development and enjoy what the Jaguar has to offer. Moving forward in a positive fashion is really the best anyone can do right now.

 

Here's a piece of bread, my friend.... it's got the Jaguar logo burned into it.... but that's what makes it so special. :)

Edited by Clint Thompson
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I havn't put words into anyone's mouth as if the very fact YOU allowed a thread insulting a member of your forum to go ahead isn't bad enough you encouraged, supported and agreed with the personnal and downright disgusting comments made by the the likes of T-Bird and others. You have stated several times that you have Arena Football, Tiny Toons and Robinson's Requiem (probaly others too) so where are they? Are you going to release them to the community? And don't quote "copyright" as a reason it didn't stop you releasing Fight For Life Beta.

1013193[/snapback]

 

 

Excuse me but who are you to ask where the games are? As far as I can tell it is up to him if he wants to share what he acuired over the years or not. While I would want to have those games myself as a Jaguar collector I can't understand how you think that Jay owns you something. From my point of view it is to admire that he released some of the Betas at all!!!!!

Next time you say that he has to pass the VR Helmets around so everyone can have a go at it.......

Peter

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Now that Atariage decided to make the jag forum invisible to those who are not signed up (which is nothing that I support, but I can understand it, as a lot of people seem to read it just to be able to badmouth it on JS2), you claim that Atariage was the bad forum where you had no freedom? It’s just another way of self defense.

The forums were invisible to guests for a few days and this restriction has been lifted. Guests can now read the forums, just cannot post (which is true of all the forums here on AtariAge).

 

..Al

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I totally agree with Lars and have spoken to Albert about whats been going on many times recently. Over on JS2, for those that don't know, they started an entire thread about me just because I have stood up to people who flame and expressed opinions they don't like. They made personal attacks on me and the British in general before moving on to other duel forum members who told them it was pathetic. I tried to defend myself several times only to be mis-quoted (like Lars says they move words around) and accused of being a "shit and run" who posts and leaves. I have stayed signed on for whole evenings only to find as soon a I log off another 20 posts appeared, how can I defend that? The moderators they do have don't even do their job, in fact they joined in - how professional is that? How someone can run a forum like that is beyond me, Jay accused AA of being a dictatorship, well there is only one dictator and you look at him every morning in the mirror. A person who controls the flow of information, allows personnal and down right abusive attacks on anyone who disagrees and is holding the only copies of several un-released Jag games for his own gain. Pot, Kettle?

 

Keep up the good work Albert and all the Mods at AA, this is an excellent site and I speak for myself and many of the british Jag community when I say you have our continued support.

1013126[/snapback]

 

@Kizza, I would appreciate it if you wouldn't put words into my mouth. I have NEVER stated Al is a "Dictator" on my site. You can check, you have full access there and logon regularly. In addition I don't control the flow of anything, I'm not sure what you are referring to? Could you be more specific? I'd love to know what copies of unreleased games I'm holding for my own GAIN? What gain?

 

@Lars, actually only the 10 post rule is enforced at JSII. Once you hit the 10 posts at JSII there is no requirement to continue to post on a regular basis. That was just a discussion that was had, but never implemented. I just wanted to clear that up.

1013168[/snapback]

 

You and the others from JS2 keep talking about freedom. Freedom isn't allowing certain members to attack others at will, especially when a lot of the attacks are against people who aren't even members there and cannot view it. Just for the record, I DID see that stupid thread over there about me. First of all, the guy claiming he was blocked from this site LIED. He was never blocked. I explained to him why his thread was locked and why this forum was made invisible via PM and also let him know that he didn't have anything to worry about here and is always welcome. That's not called a threat. Second it makes a lot more sense to have moderators who help keep the peace instead of being appointed based on post count. The fact that you allow the bad mouthing to go on unchecked and blocked from view is not called freedom. It's called being a bunch of spineless crybabies. Third, Gorf inventing a conflict with me via PM then saying he'd only debate with me in public on his turf is a sign of insecurity to me. Real men do not need an audience egging them on. This isn't a schoolyard fight. Finally, there is no JS2 vs. Atariage. It's all invented by Thinderbird who you not only do not hold in check, but actually egg on and I understand is a moderator over there? If that's how you want to run your site, go for it. I doubt you'll ever have a large community as long as you allow crap like that to go on unchecked. Have you ever PMmed Albert to find out why Thunderbird was banned from this site? Ever stopped to wonder why so many other Jaguar communities washed their hands of him? It seems like you only like to hear one side of the story before making your mind up.

 

Here, Gorf. Since you don't like PMs and like everyone to know everything, here's my response to you which you claim you ignored:

 

First of all, stop trying to create conflict where there isn't any.  Second, take a breather, come back in a day or two and read what I actually said.  I paid you several compliments on your game, which is something you conveniently ingored.  The only reason your thread was cleaned up was because you complained that a bunchof people were asking the same stupid question over and over again.  Which is it?  Have a bunch of morons ask the same stupid question over and over again, or discuss something relevant: how the game actually plays?  I don't agree with what Nova said, nor do I care, but it is not my place to censor someone's opinions just because I don't agree with them.  If you made a homebrew and say you got permission, that's good enough for me.  If not, sell it under the radar.  That's irrelevant and nothing to be worried about over a small production run homebrew.  If you want to create conflict where there isn't any, that's you're deal.  I'm not going to go over to your message board, get an account validated, post ten times, then have to endure stupid digs from people who have nothing to do with you or me so they can get their boners going so I can try and debate against someone who has no interest in debating.  If you really wanted to debate with me, you'd do it on your own.  Man to man.  Not man to man with an audience egging you on.  You're mind is already made up about me.  You don't even know me, but you seem to think I have something against you.  Not true.  Have a nice life.  Try not to let things like this get to you.  Inventing issues where there aren't any will likely land you in an early grave my friend.  Best of luck to you on your programming.

 

:roll:

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Excuse me but who are you to ask where the games are? As far as I can tell it is up to him if he wants to share what he acuired over the years or not. While I would want to have those games myself as a Jaguar collector I can't understand how you think that Jay owns you something. From my point of view it is to admire that he released some of the Betas at all!!!!!

Next time you say that he has to pass the VR Helmets around so everyone can have a go at it.......

Peter

 

I don't think he owes me anything and havn't said he does so climb down of your high horse. All I was stating is that these games should at least be released so others can sample them, like Carl at Songbird has done. I would have no problem if he asked money for them but just think its very selfish to say "LOOK AT WHAT I'VE GOT AND YOU HAVN'T". And he released 1 beta of game that already exists and isn't hardly different to the existing version. If I had some of this stuff I would make it available to all.

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I am so tempted to sell my Jaguar collection to spare me of the disappointment I feel right now. I was so happy to hear Gorf released, and so so... ANGRY.. that it is not there. I just got paid and was ready to buy one.

 

Past experience has taught me when I am angry to give things time. So I will give at least a day to post anything else about this. Angry posts... give a day, then respond.

 

And major actions, like the liquidation of a collection and a hobby, I give a month or two. There are many games on the Jag I would miss, but I would be saddened to look at the "what if" caused, not by Atari, but by "fans".

 

Yep, this is my very nice message compared to how I am feel about all this. Very disappointed and extremely angry over here.

 

But stopping here and giving time to pass before I post more.

 

(I guess I could keep a Jag around for Bubsy... unless I can emulate it. I think Bubsy, due mainly to fond memories with friends, would be all that I would REALLY miss if I sold my Jag today.)

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All this fighting sucks. It's a big reason to why i'm slowly starting to loose my passion for the Jaguar. It's still a great machine and i love the games. But to keep up with all the new releases also means i have to watch the forums and all the badmouthing going on. I try to stay out of the arguments(except for a couple of times in off-topic threads) but i still can't help but to be affected by all this negativity.

Edited by Deranged_desperado

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