Why is Space Invaders different?

[pocketmego]

I am just wondering if anyone knows or has a guess as to why space Invaders is so different from its arcade source material. Now, I'm not saying its bad thats it's different, I'm not saying it's good that it's different. All I want to know is why it is so?

 

It can't possibly be a graphics issue. The arcade Space Invaders didn't have any better graphics than the VCS was capable of and frankly the VCS could add color. If nothing else the VCS version is actually MORE graphically complex with some of the ships having individual moving parts and that weird looking tank/ship you use in the 2600 version.

 

I know there are not as many ships per line as in the arcade version, but part of that is screen ratio.

 

So what's the deal?

 

Anyone know?

 

Any guesses?

 

-Ray

[+Psionic]

I think for the most part you answered your own question. Because the arcade version itself was very simple, I don't think Atari was that concerned with getting everything ported exactly, they wanted to improve it if possible. I never was crazy about the arcade version anyway. I always liked the VCS version better myself.

[accousticguitar]

I always thought the sound of the arcade version was pretty cool!

[carpecarne]

I think that the VCS and the arcade versions are very alike. Yes, there are some differences in terms of numbers of ships, but IMO, there are too many in the arcade version.

 

VCS SI > arcade SI

[supercat]

It can't possibly be a graphics issue. The arcade Space Invaders didn't have any better graphics than the VCS was capable of and frankly the VCS could add color. If nothing else the VCS version is actually MORE graphically complex with some of the ships having individual moving parts and that weird looking tank/ship you use in the 2600 version.

 

At the time Space Invaders was programmed, nobody knew how to display more than six sprites on a scan line without flicker.

[Lord Helmet]

I'm glad that SI on the VCS turned out the way that it did. It's the best home version of SI, and resposible for my addiction to videogames.

[DEBRO]

Rick Maurer was interviewed on Stella @ 20. I'll try to recall the interview from memory.

 

There he metioned that he started programming SI before anyone wanted it. He liked the game so he just did it on his own. He stopped working on it and started working on Maze Craze because he wasn't pleased with the flicker. He originally called it "Ghost Invaders". When they got the license to do SI he picked it back up. I wonder if his first attempt with the flicker had 11 invaders across.

 

He says he wanted to get the invaders closer to the look in the arcade but he wasn't an artist. He asked the people in the box art department if they would help him but no one did so he did the best he could.

[NE146]

Yeah Space Invaders had so much more depth & strategy that simply did not translate to the 2600. Most people don't really know about them but that's understandable with younger players as they simply have never seen it done before their eyes. As is, the 2600 is a very poor port. I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well

 

But yeah, the standard arcade strategies for most players such as the "Death Row/Wall of death" and the most basic: counting shots techniques just simply weren't in there. And come on.. it's the intrinsic techniques like that which differentiated SI from later more simple "move left/right, shoot invaders avoid shots" games like GALAXIAN. Put it this way, it'd be like porting Street Fighter 2 with no fireballs or special moves. (i.e. something that's there known by the good players, but isn't explicitly shown or obvious upon first playing)

 

..Why something like counting shots for variable point UFO's isnt in there is a mytery to me.. it seems like that would be something easily added in. By the way Nukey did a great hack where he added a lot of the arcade elements (including the Rainbow bonus & variable point UFO's) that were missing from the 2600 version into it.

 

http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=58535

Edited August 16, 2006 by NE146

[godzillajoe]

What the heck is the Death Row/Wall Of Death Strategy and what about counting shots? I was 8 when SI came out so I just tended to move and shoot. And I never liked SI in the arcade because of using buttons to move left and right. That annoyed me for some reason. I always wanted a stick. Same with Asteroids but that's another story.

 

So yeah, please explain these arcade elements that the 2600 is missing if you don't mind.

 

Also, I have heard of the "rainbow" thing but have never seen a pic of it. How exactly do you do it again? Something about shooting the invaders in a column starting at the top and working down?

 

Anyone know if you can do that in MAME?

 

 

Yeah Space Invaders had so much more depth & strategy that simply did not translate to the 2600. Most people don't really know about them but that's understandable with younger players as they simply have never seen it done before their eyes. As is, the 2600 is a very poor port. I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well

 

But yeah, the standard arcade strategies for most players such as the "Death Row/Wall of death" and the most basic: counting shots techniques just simply weren't in there. And come on.. it's the intrinsic techniques like that which differentiated SI from later more simple "move left/right, shoot invaders avoid shots" games like GALAXIAN. Put it this way, it'd be like porting Street Fighter 2 with no fireballs or special moves. (i.e. something that's there known by the good players, but isn't explicitly shown or obvious upon first playing)

 

..Why something like counting shots for variable point UFO's isnt in there is a mytery to me.. it seems like that would be something easily added in. By the way Nukey did a great hack where he added a lot of the arcade elements (including the Rainbow bonus & variable point UFO's) that were missing from the 2600 version into it.

 

http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=58535

[BrianC]

Yeah Space Invaders had so much more depth & strategy that simply did not translate to the 2600. Most people don't really know about them but that's understandable with younger players as they simply have never seen it done before their eyes. As is, the 2600 is a very poor port. I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well

 

I'm aware of the difference in strategy and I still like the 2600 version. It's not accurate to the arcade, but it's a very good game in its own right. I don't understand the point of comments like "I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well". I find them very insulting. The point that the arcade has many strategies that aren't in the 2600 version can be gotten across without them.

 

BTW, I love the arcade version too. The SGB version of it rocks, especially when played in SNES mode on SGB. I find it funny how a clone of SI like Avenger for the C64 is more accurate than most official SI games for classic systems/computers.

[NE146]

And I never liked SI in the arcade because of using buttons to move left and right. That annoyed me for some reason. I always wanted a stick.

 

That my friend is because you were playing the US Midway version. The original Taito upright (which was prevelant most everywhere else in the world) had a stick! It also had arguably superior artwork on it's moon background and bezel, etc than on the U.S. Midway version Notice the trademark big white ball Taito joystick

 

 

So yeah, please explain these arcade elements that the 2600 is missing if you don't mind.

Also, I have heard of the "rainbow" thing but have never seen a pic of it. How exactly do you do it again? Something about shooting the invaders in a column starting at the top and working down?

 

Anyone know if you can do that in MAME?

 

I linked to the strategy right there above. (see quote below) And yes you can do it in mame although the rainbow thing only gives you the display and bonus on SI part 2/Deluxe of course.

Yeah Space Invaders had so much more depth & strategy that simply did not translate to the 2600.

[DEBRO]

..Why something like counting shots for variable point UFO's isnt in there is a mytery to me.. it seems like that would be something easily added in.

Remember the designers had no input or source code from these games. They worked from their perspective or experience of playing the arcade version.

[NE146]

I don't understand the point of comments like "I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well". I find them very insulting. The point that the arcade has many strategies that aren't in the 2600 version can be gotten across without them.

 

No need to get insulted about it.. I'm just saying that for all that 2600 Space Invaders has in common with the arcade game, if Intellivision got the SI license and called Space Armada "Space Invaders" instead.. it'd pretty much be the exact same thing

 

Hey I'm a 70's kid who went out with his mom on a year+ long trek to FIND a home Space Invaders (the first one I got was an electromechanical Attack Invader by Bandai) so when I literally found 2600 Space Invaders at Sears it was like manna from heaven. I know it's a good game IMHO one of the all time 2600 cornerstones and a personal all time favorite.

 

But even then at 10 I knew it was pretty darn generically distant from the real thing

[godzillajoe]

Cool, thanks for the link, I was reading thinking it was just bold text for emphasis.

[pocketmego]

I don't understand the point of comments like "I've always argued that if you think 2600 Space Invaders is good port of the arcade game, then you'd think Intellivision Space Armada was a good port of Space Invaders as well". I find them very insulting. The point that the arcade has many strategies that aren't in the 2600 version can be gotten across without them.

 

No need to get insulted about it.. I'm just saying that for all that 2600 Space Invaders has in common with the arcade game, if Intellivision got the SI license and called Space Armada "Space Invaders" instead.. it'd pretty much be the exact same thing

 

Hey I'm a 70's kid who went out with his mom on a year+ long trek to FIND a home Space Invaders (the first one I got was an electromechanical Attack Invader by Bandai) so when I literally found 2600 Space Invaders at Sears it was like manna from heaven. I know it's a good game IMHO one of the all time 2600 cornerstones and a personal all time favorite.

 

But even then at 10 I knew it was pretty darn generically distant from the real thing

 

Though not my intention for this to become a which is better kind of discussion, i have to go with NE on this one. The original Space invaders is a work of simplistic art.

 

The arcade version captures you ina way that makes even the longest marathon games interesting and continuously different and intense.

 

As I've said before about the 2600 version, for a system famous for having very random and unique gaming experiences even playing the same game again and again, Space Invaders was not so.

 

After the 5th Wave of Invaders on ANY variation of the game, the game play stays EXACTLY the same. if you have any idea of how to play you can play indefinately from that point on.

 

-Ray

[Vic George 2K3]

The 5-point invaders still make me think of this:

[Feralstorm]

..Why something like counting shots for variable point UFO's isnt in there is a mytery to me.. it seems like that would be something easily added in.

Remember the designers had no input or source code from these games. They worked from their perspective or experience of playing the arcade version.

 

That, and licensed home conversions of popular arcade games was still an infant of an idea at the time, so between programmers getting different amounts of info on the source games, and Atari execs saying "that looks done enough - ship it!", there's a lot of room for variation.

[BrianC]

On yeah, for a more accurate SI Experience on the 2600, I recommend trying out INV+. The invaders look like blocks, but the gameplay is much closer to the arcade.

[pocketmego]

On yeah, for a more accurate SI Experience on the 2600, I recommend trying out INV+. The invaders look like blocks, but the gameplay is much closer to the arcade.

 

I've been trying to figure out which is the better version between INV+ or Space Instigaters

 

Instigaters looks a WHOLE lot like the arcade version to me.

 

Any of you all have a preference?

 

-Ray

[NE146]

By the way.. way off topic, but maybe not...

 

Ever see this site? wtf http://www.atarivector.com

[pocketmego]

By the way.. way off topic, but maybe not...

 

Ever see this site? wtf http://www.atarivector.com

 

We should probably address your SCARY Penis obsession one of these days. Hmmm, come to think of it...probably not a good idea.

 

 

-Ray

Edited August 17, 2006 by pocketmego

[NE146]

By the way.. way off topic, but maybe not...

 

Ever see this site? wtf http://www.atarivector.com

 

We should probably address your SCARY Penis obsession one of these days. Hmmm, come to think of it...probably not a good idea.

 

 

-Ray

 

No it aint.. although you got my obsession mixed up with the opposite

 

But, I have nothing to do with that site. It's just funny with the URL and the pic

[BrianC]

On yeah, for a more accurate SI Experience on the 2600, I recommend trying out INV+. The invaders look like blocks, but the gameplay is much closer to the arcade.

 

I've been trying to figure out which is the better version between INV+ or Space Instigaters

 

Instigaters looks a WHOLE lot like the arcade version to me.

 

Instigators looks like more like the arcade, but it plays faster and the UFOs move too fast. I like it, but I prefer both the 2600 SI and INV+. Also, I highly recommend playing the Space Invaders Deluxe hack for the 2600. It's awesome!

Edited August 17, 2006 by BrianC

[Lord Helmet]

Instigators is really fun, but it kicks my ass because its so fast! It is a nice change up from the other SI game though. I recomend it