Empire Strikes Back...Innovative?

[pocketmego]

I was playing a round of Empire Strikes Back and something occurred to me.

 

Empire is a pretty innovative and original game design. Yes, its a side scroller, and yes you attack multiple waves of the same enmeies.

 

However, what makes it interesting to me is that it is the only game that I can think of in the entire VCS libraray that used that particular play style and come to think of it I can only think of one later game that ever copied its game play style, that would be Jeff Minters Attack of the Mutant Camels which could almost be called a CLONE.

 

But to be able to attack a big enemy multiple times while taking mulitple hits is the equivalent of a complete boss battle in later games. Empire is the first game I can think of that used the idea of one mini-boss battle after another to gain ground and rack up points. It seemed to do well, I wonder why this particular type of game play never caught on?

 

In any event, it sure is a fun game to play.

 

-Ray

[BigFairy321]

hmm.. i always thought it was incomplete, as if the programmer forgot to add in flying attacking enemy..

[+else]

There is an interview in an old video game magazine that I have with the head of Parker Bros games division. In it he says that the "game was shipped incomplete, but there is a large group of people out there who will buy anything".

 

With an attitude like that, it's no wonder why the crash happened......

[Tempest]

I always thought it was pretty boring. I 'd usually shoot a few AT-AT's then go on and play something else. There just wasn't enough gameplay to keep me coming back for more.

 

Tempest

[JacobZu7zu7]

I always thought it was pretty boring. I 'd usually shoot a few AT-AT's then go on and play something else. There just wasn't enough gameplay to keep me coming back for more.

 

Tempest

 

 

I agree that it is pretty Innovative.

But I thought, when I first played it, is there other stages???

Why wern't other enemies happening in this game.

Then I read the AA manual. Soooo, THATS IT?

Hmmm,

But aside from the only one scene.

It is a respectable game.

[JacobZu7zu7]

There is an interview in an old video game magazine that I have with the head of Parker Bros games division. In it he says that the "game was shipped incomplete, but there is a large group of people out there who will buy anything".

 

With an attitude like that, it's no wonder why the crash happened......

 

Gee, that attitude is downright careless.

Parker Bros. made such good games too ,

I can't think of a bad one.

 

Yes, I like Reactor/Tutankam s/p

[ZylonBane]

hmm.. i always thought it was incomplete, as if the programmer forgot to add in flying attacking enemy..

Sounds like someone only played it on the easy difficulty setting.

[Gregory DG]

Sounds like someone only played it on the easy difficulty setting.

Phbbt... Who uses the landing pad anyway? I didn't even know it existed until a few months ago.

[Dirt Gherkin]

It's funny. Back in the day, this was one of the most played 2600 games in my house for the entire run of the 2600. It was a family favorite just for marathon games to see how long we could last. I never really thought about the other side of the argument until reading this thread. I still think it's a great game, but I could see where it could be argued the game was a little one-dimensional.

[shadow460]

Down right fun? Yes.

Innovative? Who cares, when it's down right fun?

 

Actually, the fun in this game is more from suspense. And ZylonBane has a good point. The hard setting makes is much more interesting.

[ATARIPITBULL]

I always thought it was pretty boring. I 'd usually shoot a few AT-AT's then go on and play something else. There just wasn't enough gameplay to keep me coming back for more.

 

Tempest

 

I did the same thing, infact I can remember the first time I played this game back in Detroit, when one of my neighborhood friends got the first copy and after about 10 minuets of play, I thought it was kind of boring because the waves never stop and you don't seem to be going to any other place to fight the empire.

 

Edited August 21, 2006 by ATARIPITBULL

[Godzilla]

man i still 2600 empire, and yea, i think it was damn innovative for its time and it does have lots of great game options to keep the game playable once you get good. Watch out for the flying smart bombs!

[ZylonBane]

I thought it was kind of boring because the waves never stop and you don't seem to be going to any other place to fight

You just described 90% of 80's arcade shoot 'em ups.

 

"I thought Space Invaders was boring because the waves never stop and you don't go to any other places to fight."

 

[carpecarne]

I think it's a fun game to play if you want a few minutes of distraction.

 

When I was first getting back into atari a couple years ago (I was about 3-4 when we got the NES so the atari went bye bye), I was surprised by how FAST the ship moved. Like many a naive gamer, I thought the 2600 would be slow and dull, but once I popped that game through an emulator (and after a few frustrating minutes of trying to figure out how to even start the game...damn Game Reset button!) I was very surprised.

 

So I hold the game in high regards for showing me the solid 60 htz frame rate that the atari can sustain.

 

Objectively, I do wish the waves would happen in terms of levels a la Space Invaders. Or at least have the option.

[Vic George 2K3]

Interesting use of the Defender play mechanic. But a little too much of the lather-rinse-repeat gameplay.

[+else]

For those who want to read the full inteview with Parker Bros VP of Consumer Electronics, see the magazine "Video Games" from October 83, page 22. I'll quote the relevant parts:

The orignal design of the game had about 50 percoent more features in it. We had envisioned this wild thing with cave entrances. You could flly underground, pick up weapons and come back. And, of course, in the last ten days we had to take all of those plans out and streamline the game, which was agony. It was like cutting off your child's legs.

 

Later when talking about how it takes 46 shots to take out a walker:

Well, it (the game) was almost too relentless. In fact, it was a horizontal Space Invaders to some extent.

 

Finally, he says:

At the time we just couldn't get it (a second screen) in and we didn't know about 8K then. We knew that at the time there was a market that would buy almost anything.

 

So it sounds like they just shoved it out the door at the end. Thankfully, it still is a pretty good game compared to a lot of the other shovelware from that time period.....

 

Maybe someone should take up the task of completing it like it was supposed to be :)

Edited August 22, 2006 by else

[pocketmego]

I think it's a fun game to play if you want a few minutes of distraction.

 

When I was first getting back into atari a couple years ago (I was about 3-4 when we got the NES so the atari went bye bye), I was surprised by how FAST the ship moved. Like many a naive gamer, I thought the 2600 would be slow and dull, but once I popped that game through an emulator (and after a few frustrating minutes of trying to figure out how to even start the game...damn Game Reset button!) I was very surprised.

 

So I hold the game in high regards for showing me the solid 60 htz frame rate that the atari can sustain.

 

Objectively, I do wish the waves would happen in terms of levels a la Space Invaders. Or at least have the option.

 

There are many games on the Atari that are rocket fast even compared to some of todays games. Spider Fighter immediately comes to mind. That game is one that starts fast and only gets faster.

 

-Ray

[carpecarne]

It would be nice to find a prototype or maybe a typed manuscript or diskette of the assembly of this apparent version.

[pocketmego]

For those who want to read the full inteview with Parker Bros VP of Consumer Electronics, see the magazine "Video Games" from October 83, page 22. I'll quote the relevant parts:

The orignal design of the game had about 50 percoent more features in it. We had envisioned this wild thing with cave entrances. You could flly underground, pick up weapons and come back. And, of course, in the last ten days we had to take all of those plans out and streamline the game, which was agony. It was like cutting off your child's legs.

 

Later when talking about how it takes 46 shots to take out a walker:

Well, it (the game) was almost too relentless. In fact, it was a horizontal Space Invaders to some extent.

 

Finally, he says:

At the time we just couldn't get it (a second screen) in and we didn't know about 8K then. We knew that at the time there was a market that would buy almost anything.

 

So it sounds like they just shoved it out the door at the end. Thankfully, it still is a pretty good game compared to a lot of the other shovelware from that time period.....

 

Maybe someone should take up the task of completing it like it was supposed to be :)

 

I think his statement is being a bit misunderstood. He is not saying we put out a 50% complete game because at the time people would buy anything (Atari or Star wars I assume he meant).

 

No, I think he bemoans not having the game they wanted, but knew the game would sell anyway and went ahead with it like it was.

 

I dn't think he is using the same arrogance and malice that later quotes of the Crash years would be associated with.

 

It's the first Star Wars video game and I think they managed a pretty good one for the first. It was no SW arcade game, but we never knew better at the time.

 

-Ray

[+else]

He is not saying we put out a 50% complete game because at the time people would buy anything (Atari or Star wars I assume he meant).

 

He is saying that they put out a 66.67% complete game as it was originally envisioned. If you call the current game X, then (X + .5X) = 100%. Solve for X.

Edited August 22, 2006 by else

[kirin jensen]

I thought it was a piece of crap then, I still do today.

 

 

If you hadn't been suckered into buying and playing this 'back in the day' because it was Star Wars-related, you'd recognize it as a truly bad game.

 

 

 

We're talking Mythicon bad.

[pocketmego]

I thought it was a piece of crap then, I still do today.

 

 

If you hadn't been suckered into buying and playing this 'back in the day' because it was Star Wars-related, you'd recognize it as a truly bad game.

 

 

 

We're talking Mythicon bad.

 

I played it just last night. I kind of liked it, still.

 

-Ray

[supercat]

We're talking Mythicon bad.

 

Which of Mythicon's games do you think is better? While I'll admit I'd put Starfox in the "almost playable" category, Empire seems like a much more substantial game.

[Lord Thag]

Criticising the game as repetative seems strange, given that the ENTIRE GENRE (shooters) is exactly the same in that respect. Most people I know who don't like it play it on the easy setting. Crank it up to hard, and it is a very intense white-knuckle experience.

Edited August 22, 2006 by Lord Thag

[ZylonBane]

It was at least innovative enough for Yak to rip it off. Twice!