Compact Flash Cartridge

[Zerosquare]

Does M$ charge for using their file format?

The only patents they still hold today relate to long filenames support, which is non-essential for the JagCF. Edited September 15, 2006 by Zerosquare

[JagChris]

Does M$ charge for using their file format?

The only patents they still hold today relate to long filenames support, which is non-essential for the JagCF.

 

Well actually I did some reading up on it and M$ did indeed just recently win/acquire the patent to FAT32 which now has everyone worried that ol' Bill will be charging Linux users to use his file format.

 

However, FAT16 looks to be in the clear so far.

[pony]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

[EmOneGarand]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

I think the idea was to release a product for homedev and for future commercial releases. I remember earlier in this board GT Turbo said that the cards would be encrypted to prevent piracy so I think that the intention is to not allow commercial roms to be loaded through the device. So in my opinion I think the answer is no.

[JagChris]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

 

This community is small enough as it is. Why don't you support it by actually paying for the games you play?

[jvas]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

 

This community is small enough as it is. Why don't you support it by actually paying for the games you play?

 

I'm willing to pay for the games, but in may case (I'm from Hungary, Europe) the shipping costs are higher than the games itself. So if there was a web site, where I can download roms for money that would be great! This way I could get titles that are not produced any more or hard to find. I think is doesn't affect the value of the originals. Not to mention that my money would go to someone who is a developer and not to someone who wants to get rid of the garbage from his gardrobe or just a merchant.

[pony]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

 

This community is small enough as it is. Why don't you support it by actually paying for the games you play?

 

I have almost every jag game there is, It would be a plus to be able to load the roms and keep my games in the boxes. This device has no use for me.

[Goochman]

You mentioned the CatNip cable will be required to update the JagCF - any thoughts on just selling both together?

[GT Turbo]

You mentioned the CatNip cable will be required to update the JagCF - any thoughts on just selling both together?

 

Yes, somebody has yet proposed that, yes i think we can do that, but for people who want a CatNip alone, escpially developpers who want to work with a PC (CatNip is a USB device), they can got it alone and before.

 

 

GT

[Michael_]

I'm willing to pay for the games, but in may case (I'm from Hungary, Europe) the shipping costs are higher than the games itself. So if there was a web site, where I can download roms for money that would be great! This way I could get titles that are not produced any more or hard to find. I think is doesn't affect the value of the originals. Not to mention that my money would go to someone who is a developer and not to someone who wants to get rid of the garbage from his gardrobe or just a merchant.

 

That´s not going to happen. How come the shipping costs are so high? I´m based in Europe also and have never encountered prices that come even near the price of the games...

[Zerosquare]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

ROM images will be supported (we were against it at first, but a lot of people have requested this functionality). Note that we do not condone piracy - this is done to allow backing-up several cartridges on a CF, testing non-BJL compatible betas, etc.

 

For new CF-based developments, there is also a distinct, facultative copy-prevention feature. The choice is up to the developer.

Edited September 18, 2006 by Zerosquare

[+remowilliams]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

ROM images will be supported (we were against it at first, but a lot of people have requested this functionality). Note that we do not condone piracy - this is done to allow backing-up several cartridges on a CF, testing non-BJL compatible betas, etc.

 

For new CF-based developments, there is also a distinct, facultative copy-prevention feature. The choice is up to the developer.

Excellent, glad to hear this

 

I have tons of Jag carts and it would be very handy to be able to play them via CF.

 

And yes, I support the 'scene' - hell I even have a copy of Gorf.

[Goochman]

I'm willing to pay for the games, but in may case (I'm from Hungary, Europe) the shipping costs are higher than the games itself. So if there was a web site, where I can download roms for money that would be great! This way I could get titles that are not produced any more or hard to find. I think is doesn't affect the value of the originals. Not to mention that my money would go to someone who is a developer and not to someone who wants to get rid of the garbage from his gardrobe or just a merchant.

 

That´s not going to happen. How come the shipping costs are so high? I´m based in Europe also and have never encountered prices that come even near the price of the games...

 

Well Checkered Flag is worth $7 so that could be 1 example

 

Back to discussion - ROM images will be supported - what about CD images - any possibility so we can utilize all the Jag offerings on 1 cartridge?

[Michael_]

ROM images will be supported (we were against it at first, but a lot of people have requested this functionality).

 

Of course "some people" would like this functionality, but I´m not sure it´s such a good idea to actually go ahead with it.

 

Note that we do not condone piracy

 

That´s good to hear though. But how are you going to ensure it doesn´t happen as a result of listening to those very same people (see above)? The CF cart´s primary function could easily turn out to be something you never intended it to be.

You need to tread carefully here, I believe.

[Zerosquare]

But how are you going to ensure it doesn´t happen as a result of listening to those very same people (see above)?

Basically, we have no way of making sure that you actually own the cartridges from which the images come from. It's a matter of trust ; your point is valid, and that's the reason why the feature wasn't planned at first. But there are also some developers and legitimate owners among the people who requested it, and we feel it'd be a pity to add restrictions because of the wrongdoing of others. Edited September 19, 2006 by Zerosquare

[Goochman]

Honestly - its been almost 10 years since Atari last produced anything Jagwise. We have multicarts/IDE offerings for the Atari 8bit arena which is only 15 years out of production not to mention 2600/7800/etc....

 

Of course some folks will use this in a manner not intended but I doubt it would end all development - esp since the new format will support some copy protection.

 

8bit, 2600 and 7800 titles are still being developed despite having these other mechanisms.

 

I vote for giving me future capabilites in running ROMs for carts that havent been as robust as the 2600 releases. Ive got a few Jag carts that are 'Red Screening' now.

 

For those against - what carts are you afraid of folks running on this? New cart releases are almost impossible with the cost and time to produce (Look at some of Jaysmiths releases - the Fight for Life beta took an enormous amount of time)

 

Anyhow,

I vote for full compatibility.

[Michael_]

Basically, we have no way of making sure that you actually own the cartridges from which the images come from. It's a matter of trust ; your point is valid, and that's the reason why the feature wasn't planned at first. But there are also some developers and legitimate owners among the people who requested it, and we feel it'd be a pity to add restrictions because of the wrongdoing of others.

 

So, if understand this correctly there´s going to be an anti-piracy protection system included that´ll safeguard future releases, but not older games.

 

How does this work and how secure will this in fact be?

[+remowilliams]

But there are also some developers and legitimate owners among the people who requested it, and we feel it'd be a pity to add restrictions because of the wrongdoing of others.

I'm very glad you reconsidered. The ability to run ROM images is a huge benefit and a value add to prospective CFC purchasers.

 

Honestly - its been almost 10 years since Atari last produced anything Jagwise. We have multicarts/IDE offerings for the Atari 8bit arena which is only 15 years out of production not to mention 2600/7800/etc....

 

8bit, 2600 and 7800 titles are still being developed despite having these other mechanisms.

That's a good point. Between the 2600 and 7800 I have probably five different ways to run rom images - but I just recently purchased four homebrews for the systems.

[Michael_]

I'm very glad you reconsidered. The ability to run ROM images is a huge benefit and a value add to prospective CFC purchasers.

 

I´m sure retailers like Songbird are going to be thrilled by this whole thing.

 

"Sorry pal, we know you´ve been an integral part to keeping the community alive, but times are changing. We´ll allow you to sell our CF Cart and future products, but you might want to clear that stock of older Jaguar games real quick".

[Bill Loguidice]

I'm very glad you reconsidered. The ability to run ROM images is a huge benefit and a value add to prospective CFC purchasers.

 

I´m sure retailers like Songbird are going to be thrilled by this whole thing.

 

"Sorry pal, we know you´ve been an integral part to keeping the community alive, but times are changing. We´ll allow you to sell our CF Cart and future products, but you might want to clear that stock of older Jaguar games real quick".

 

 

One device won't suddenly make everyone stop buying original stock. There are collectors who prefer to have original boxed games with instructions. There are people who would never know about or even if they did, buy this compact flash device. New homebrew stuff doesn't need an official ROM release, either. If it does, that would be up to the individual developer who would be aware of the "free" option. Having flash carts/transfer devices hasn't hurt the Atari 2600, Vectrex, ColecoVision, etc., communities one bit, so why it should hurt the Jaguar? There will always be factions who pirate or choose to solely emulate anyway. In essence, what this device does or doesn't do will have little to no effect on stores, resellers and developers, and should in fact help to expand the Jaguar community. I know I want one and have no interest in piracy.

[Michael_]

 

One device won't suddenly make everyone stop buying original stock. There are collectors who prefer to have original boxed games with instructions. There are people who would never know about or even if they did, buy this compact flash device. New homebrew stuff doesn't need an official ROM release, either. If it does, that would be up to the individual developer who would be aware of the "free" option. Having flash carts/transfer devices hasn't hurt the Atari 2600, Vectrex, ColecoVision, etc., communities one bit, so why it should hurt the Jaguar? There will always be factions who pirate or choose to solely emulate anyway. In essence, what this device does or doesn't do will have little to no effect on stores, resellers and developers, and should in fact help to expand the Jaguar community. I know I want one and have no interest in piracy.

 

I don´t think you can compare the Jaguar to the 2600 in this manner. Somebody already stated that the Jaguar community is small enough as it is. I´ll take it a notch further and call it fragile at best.

The size of the Jaguar community and the relatively small amount of games available doesn´t leave a lot of room for "bad times". Theoretically.

 

If you put out a device that´ll enable piracy, piracy will take place. It´s as simple as that.

[Bill Loguidice]

I don´t think you can compare the Jaguar to the 2600 in this manner. Somebody already stated that the Jaguar community is small enough as it is. I´ll take it a notch further and call it fragile at best.

The size of the Jaguar community and the relatively small amount of games available doesn´t leave a lot of room for "bad times". Theoretically.

 

If you put out a device that´ll enable piracy, piracy will take place. It´s as simple as that.

 

 

"Piracy" on the Jaguar is already an option. From modified Jaguars to bypass cartridges, you can already do it on the real thing. There is working emulation with readily available ROMs. Having a compact flash device that supports ROMs is a convenience, that no more enables piracy or hurts the community anymore than any of those other options. There is piracy everywhere on every system and there always will be. You deal with it as best you can, but you don't purposely cripple things to achieve that, particularly in an already niche area.

[Pocket]

I'm very glad you reconsidered. The ability to run ROM images is a huge benefit and a value add to prospective CFC purchasers.

 

I´m sure retailers like Songbird are going to be thrilled by this whole thing.

 

"Sorry pal, we know you´ve been an integral part to keeping the community alive, but times are changing. We´ll allow you to sell our CF Cart and future products, but you might want to clear that stock of older Jaguar games real quick".

 

So collectors will disapear in a second ? Don't worry bout that, they won't, and they are a BIG part of the community

[pony]

Just one question about this device, Will the compact flash cartridge be able to load game roms of already released games? AvP, Tempest 2000, Ect, you get the idea.

ROM images will be supported (we were against it at first, but a lot of people have requested this functionality). Note that we do not condone piracy - this is done to allow backing-up several cartridges on a CF, testing non-BJL compatible betas, etc.

 

For new CF-based developments, there is also a distinct, facultative copy-prevention feature. The choice is up to the developer.

 

So how long before this is released?

[Goochman]

I'm very glad you reconsidered. The ability to run ROM images is a huge benefit and a value add to prospective CFC purchasers.

 

I´m sure retailers like Songbird are going to be thrilled by this whole thing.

 

"Sorry pal, we know you´ve been an integral part to keeping the community alive, but times are changing. We´ll allow you to sell our CF Cart and future products, but you might want to clear that stock of older Jaguar games real quick".

 

Anyone that tries to sell a CF with a copyrighted game on it will be in legal trouble.

 

It would be interesting to know how many units Songibrd sells of games 90 days past initial release. I bet not many.

 

This shouldnt impact any potential new releases IMHO.