800XL or 65XE?

[keitaro]

Hi!!

I have an 600XL, and I want to get another atari computer with more RAM. I see the 800xl and 65xe models.

both have 64k. Have the 65Xe any difference with the 800xl? Or the difference is only esthetic?

and... where is the cart port in the 65xe? To the right of the keyboard?

 

And, other question, Is rare big boxes in Atari computers like this?

[tjb]

I have both and personally I like the 800XL better. To me the keyboard has a much better feel and I prefer a top-loading cartridge port. The cartridge port on the 65XE is at the back of the machine. It's less convenient and more importantly, less stable. In my experience moving the machine while a cartridge is plugged in to the back can cause the cartridge to become loose usually frying (temporarily) the cart. Other than that they are pretty much the same. The only other difference I can think of is the built in BASIC. I believe the 65XE has the final revision C whereas the 800XL might have the buggy revision B. I'm sure someone will chime in and verify or correct me on this.

 

That's my 2 cents.

 

-tjb

[Rybags]

There are reasonably simple 64K RAM upgrade projects around for the 600XL.

 

IMO, it is the most practical of the Ataris due to it's small size (although not so great for upgrades).

 

Don't bother with the 65XE - get a 130XE (128K) instead.

[tjb]

If you just want an 64K machine Best Electronics sells the 1064 64K plug-in RAM Module for $24.95. That might be another option.

 

-tjb

[Gunstar]

If the choice is only the 65XE and 800XL, then go with the XL becuase of the good keyboard and the PBI interface on the back that the 65XE lacks (130XE has a compatible port though) and the cartridge port on top is better than the back. But I personally prefer the 1200XL 64k Atari for it's even better keyboard, IMHO, and it's side cartridge port that I like the best too. Though it does lack the PBI interface like the 65XE, it is also the best choice for a computer to upgrade with all it's room inside and even a PBI hack can be done.

 

But if you are upgrading from a mere 16k 600xl, even an 800 would be a drastic improvement and run the vast majority of Atari software with it's 48k memory, and has the best keyboard of all and the best type of enclosed front-top cartridge port(s) and four controller ports that quite a few classic games do make use of, something that is lacking on ALL other Atari 8-bits but maybe the 400?

 

All 48/64/128k Atari's will be a fantastic upgrade to your 600XL and you should just look for the best deal on ANY of them.

[Gunstar]

tjb also has a good idea with just upgrading the 600XL to 64k, as it's also got the same keyboard as the 800XL and cartridge port. But I don't know if you can use the PBI interface still for other things if it's being used by the 64k module. As Rybags said though, there are simple internal 64k ram upgrades available for the 600XL which would leave it's PBI port free for other upgrades like HD, etc.

 

Bottom line, regardless of the Atari you choose or if you upgrade the 600XL, you can't go wrong as an improvement to the 16k 600XL.

Edited October 23, 2006 by Gunstar

[Almost Rice]

tjb also has a good idea with just upgrading the 600XL to 64k, as it's also got the same keyboard as the 800XL and cartridge port. But I don't know if you can use the PBI interface still for other things if it's being used by the 64k module. As Rybags said though, there are simple internal 64k ram upgrades available for the 600XL which would leave it's PBI port free for other upgrades like HD, etc.

 

I have the MicroRam 64K from MPP. Some of them have pass-through for the PBI. I do not recommend external 600xl upgrades though. They make moving the 600xl as a unit a pain in the a$$. Its better just to get an XL/XE with 64K or internal upgrade because of this.

[Almost Rice]

keitero,

 

If you want 64k to play just games and do not plan to use the composite signal, then the 64k internal upgrade is perfect. All you need is 2 x 4464 ram chips and follow these instructions to solder 3 wires.

pics of the mod I did I have changed mine to have a cleaner look, but the original connections work.

 

On the other hand. If you are not handy with the soldering iron, the 800xl is what I recommend because its cheap and abundant. If you prefer the 65xe, just go ahead and upgrade to the 130xe. Some 65xe are missing the ECI ports. That limits expandability. also, the XL line the chips have a high chance of being socketed. You will appreciate it when you want to expand it. The 1200xl is a good choice but the stock OS did have some problems, but I have not used enough to see any problems.

 

The video is another issue. The XL line has the worst video of the 8bits in my experience and you probably have noticed it with your 600xl. They are also missing the chroma signal. The best stock video I have seen is from my 800, but its only 48K. The 130xe has the next best video, but could be improved.

 

Basic Rev C is not needed unless you are planning to code and save using the built in basic. Otherwise for just running programs it should not be an issue.

[zektor800]

Yeah, I didn't realize the 800XL was missing the chroma signal until I tried an s-video adapter and saw nothing but black & white. I initially thought that the cable was bad until I tried it on my good ol' brown 800 tank. Looks fantastic. If only I could get the 800 up to 64k, and Ape Warp installed on that sucker...it would be ultimate. I use my 800XL exclusively now, only because it can run more titles, but I still love the 800 the best.

[Rybags]

I found the XE to have inferior video from RF, although it's composite and A/V are superior by far to it's RF.

 

Adding chroma to the 800XL is rediculously easy - makes you wonder why they left it out, probably saved them a grand total of 25 cents.

[Almost Rice]

Yeah, I didn't realize the 800XL was missing the chroma signal until I tried an s-video adapter and saw nothing but black & white. I initially thought that the cable was bad until I tried it on my good ol' brown 800 tank. Looks fantastic. If only I could get the 800 up to 64k, and Ape Warp installed on that sucker.

 

Yes I saw that too. If you want a 64K 800, you should talk to warerat. He makes the XL/XE rom board replacement that makes the 800 into 800XL/65XE compatible. I use my 800 the most because of it.

 

 

I found the XE to have inferior video from RF, although it's composite and A/V are superior by far to it's RF.

 

Adding chroma to the 800XL is rediculously easy - makes you wonder why they left it out, probably saved them a grand total of 25 cents.

 

I never used the XE RF so I could not comment, but the A/V signals are good enough for me.

 

Yeah, I put chroma on all my 800xl and my PAL 600xl. Its better, but I still see some vertical lines that annoy me.

[Ross PK]

Well, I think the 800XL looks a lot better (I just love the two tone chocolate brown and cream).

 

The XE systems seem to be more cheaply made, especially the keyboards.

 

The cartridge slot on the 65 XE is in an awkward place at the back, on the 800XL it's in the top middle.

 

And the XE has a soft touch keyboard while the 800XL has a hard touch one, so, it depends on what you prefer.

[keitaro]

hi!

I want it only to play games, to use atarimax (my 600xl has nothing to do with this). I like more the 800xl, the keyboard is cool, and is more "early 80´s style". the 65Xe is like the ST line.

Let´s go to get 800xl then

Thanks for the replies!

[JamesD]

I think the top loading cart slot and older keyboard get my vote for cart games. If you go newer get the 130XE.

[Ross PK]

keitaro, have you any idea why the Joust box is way bigger than the Pacman box in your picture?

[Rybags]

Most (all?) of the games early on came with nice big colour manuals (A4 or near to it).

 

Then they became tighter as the years went on, culminating in the pathetic efforts that came with games of the XEGS era.

[ls650]

I owned an 800XL with a 256KB upgrade through four years of university (this was back in the late 80s, which dates me I realize). I used that XL almost every day - playing video games, word processing, visicalc spreadsheets, computing for some of my comp-sci labs or engineering classes.

 

That thing was built like a frakking tank - VERY tough and solid. It had a pretty good keyboard too.

[keitaro]

Ross, is my other question. I never seen before a box like joust. The pacman box have the same size of an atari 2600 box, and both games are reeditions from late eighties (´87 or so). Are rare these big boxes?

[Urchlay]

I owned an 800XL... That thing was built like a frakking tank - VERY tough and solid. It had a pretty good keyboard too.

 

I had a friend who threw his 600XL out of a 2nd story window (he was drunk and it wouldn't load some game or something). It landed on concrete, half the keys flew off the keyboard. He got this "oh god, what have I done?" looks on his face... we gathered up the keys, put them back in the keyboard, fired it up, and it worked fine. The case was scratched, but not cracked.

 

He had the 64K RAM expansion that plugs into the PBI, I don't remember whether it was plugged in at the time (kind of doubt it).

 

Also, I had an 800XL that got karate-kicked (don't ask). It hit a wall and put a dent in the drywall, but again no damage to the machine...

 

Doubt an XE series machine would survive such abuse (not that anyone should ever try it to find out...)

[drac030]

Doubt an XE series machine would survive such abuse (not that anyone should ever try it to find out...)

 

I doubt not. Some guy here managed to drop his XEGS onto concrete from about 2 meters (he left the computer on top of his car, and then started driving). This is not a 2nd floor, but at the other hand the XEGS wasn't a stock machine, it had many extensions like 1 MB SIMM RAM, SDX, AKI, hard drive and others I don't remember, many cables and additional PCBs inside. Nothing was damaged IIRC.

[Ross PK]

Ross, is my other question. I never seen before a box like joust. The pacman box have the same size of an atari 2600 box, and both games are reeditions from late eighties (´87 or so). Are rare these big boxes?

 

Are your boxes sealed? They look like it. Maybe there is something extra in the Joust box like a poster or something.

[MEtalGuy66]

Ross, is my other question. I never seen before a box like joust. The pacman box have the same size of an atari 2600 box, and both games are reeditions from late eighties (´87 or so). Are rare these big boxes?

 

Are your boxes sealed? They look like it. Maybe there is something extra in the Joust box like a poster or something.

 

If there is a poster in there, Scan it and upload it somewhere!

[Brian R.]

This discussion is pretty amusing for me.

 

Back in the 80s - 83, 84? - I went and bought an Atari computer. I wanted an 800XL, but it was like, IIRC, $20 or so more than the 600XL, and I didn't have the extra money, so I settled for the 600.

 

That gave me problems, such as when it came to sharing stuff with friends in school, because my computer didn't have enough memory.

 

I found out about the memory expansion module, but could never find one. I would literally dream about my computer having more memory... that it was bigger like the 800, that the memory was actually there, that I found the expansion unit, etc.

 

And here it is, more than 20 years later, talking about the same things that were on my then 12/13 year old mind!

[keitaro]

ross, the joust box only have the cart and instructions. no poster inside

[Ross PK]

Well that's strange that they made the box bigger than the others. Or maybe it's regular size and the Pacman box is smaller than the others.

 

Anyway, I think if some boxes were bigger than regular size, maybe they done it to make the consumer think he was getting more value for money?