Bumzyman Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 (edited) I'm in for a couple, err, make that 5!!! Steve, Any plans to ever make a little plastic case for them? Will there be a new release of APE & Prosystem to go along with the new adapters? Edited April 8, 2007 by Bumzyman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 I'll try to answer the questions above in one post. That was freakin' fast. what X factor was that at? since it was above x3? Thats divisor 0x00 (NTSC 127840 bps), so maybe 6x? Of course with baud rates over 3x you get diminishing increases in throughput since the bit rate increases, but SIO transaction overhead stays the same. Still, fun to see working. Will it work on the old USB or is it USB 2.0? I ask because I'm using a POS win98 SP1 machine that has issues with certain USB devices. Its a USB 1.1 full speed peripheral, so it will work with older USB controllers. Both USB 1.1 and USB 2.0 chip sets seem to achieve about the same speed, though USB 2.0 with a USB 2.0 hub attached is just slightly faster. If you can implement Motor control is it possible to also have a program that would read from the cassete to make CAS files directly from tape? Might be possible with the hardware available, but I have not tried it yet. Oh and can I return the brand new SIO2PC I just purchased from you on ebay for a credit toward this Just kidding... But speaking of, do you have a price range in mind yet? It will be more than the rs232 adapter, but I'm not sure on the price yet, I still have to get a couple more quotes for the assembly. In any case the rs232 version will stay available at the same price. Wow - that is insanely fast. I didn't know the machine vould transfer data at that rate - is it always reliable at that speed? The hardware has no problem with the rate shown, but the speed you get using the Atari depends entirely on the SIO routines being used. SpartaDOS 3.2g tops out at 0x08, Hias's SIO code/patches go to 0x04 or 0x03 and are probably totally optimal without turning off some or all of the screen, above that only a few programs like COPY2000 with their own specialized SIO routines can keep up. But since the hardware is available now to do those speeds we might see more programs written to take advantage of it. A more practical advantage of the extended baud rate support in the interface is that if you are accessing a drive directly with ProSystem, it can engage the speeder functions to read and write at higher baud rates. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted April 8, 2007 Share Posted April 8, 2007 Any plans to ever make a little plastic case for them? Oops, I forgot to look on page 2. I looked for awhile for an existing case that would be small but not require extensive modification and never really found anything. A new injection mold to make a nice case is pretty much out of the question due to the cost. Will there be a new release of APE & Prosystem to go along with the new adapters? Yes, both APE and ProSystem have been re-written. Registered users can get an update now to 2.4.2 which is what the beta testers are using. I'll also post a new trial edition when the adapter ships. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+remowilliams Posted April 9, 2007 Author Share Posted April 9, 2007 That is interesting! I had not heard about "Parallels." Does the tester get good performance out of the USB adapter with this setup? So far, everything has worked just fine under Parallels. Performance and features have worked just the same under testing as my other OS'es/machines. The machine I'm using for testing under Parallels is a MBP17 2.16Duo. Testing has gone great so far, and using USB is just sooooo handy. You guys are gonna love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kr0tki Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Steve, can you explain how the data is transferred between SIO and PC? Will it be possible to send and receive from SIO an arbitrary selected signal, not just data organised in blocks? Some Atari tapes contain non-standard signals as means of copy-protection, and direct reading/writing an SIO signal would be needed to make SIO2PC usable with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Right now its implemented like standard SIO2PC, as packets of bytes sent at low speed. The hardware is designed to allow the bus to be driven directly without a UART, so I will later implement a second mode that allows FSK or WAV data to be streamed to the device for more accurate cassette playback. If you have a raw WAV file of such a protected cassette please feel free to send it to me. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 Hi Steve, This is different from what we've been talking about. It is not about playing tapes that have audio, or recording tapes that need the interface to generate the FSK tones. It is about reading tapes recorded with a non-standard signal. I don't know the details (Kr0tki sure knows about them). But I understand they don't have a standard async serial framing. So what is needed is that the interface would capture the serial input signal directly (not in UART mode). Then the interface would need to somehow communicate the captured data to the PC application. I guess the solution would involve sending packets that recorded the time between transitions. I'm not sure how much precision is required, but the tape is a very slow device, so this shouldn't present a problem. This, obviously, would work when the interface is in Prosystem/1050-2-PC mode. Not in SIO2PC mode. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted April 20, 2007 Share Posted April 20, 2007 (edited) It is about reading tapes recorded with a non-standard signal. I don't know the details (Kr0tki sure knows about them). But I understand they don't have a standard async serial framing. Regarding playing, I do mean playback without a UART, that is data would be played back as state samples, not byte data generated by WAV2CAS. The resulting output would be like the WAV audio was passed through a FSK->TTL circuit inside an Atari cassette recorder. But for dumping of tapes as you mention, it should be possible by the same process in reverse. Even analog sampling of the data and audio streams is possible, if required. But then again I know nothing of the protection used to prevent these tapes from being copied by tape-to-tape copy. Steve Edited April 20, 2007 by classics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ijor Posted April 21, 2007 Share Posted April 21, 2007 But for dumping of tapes as you mention, it should be possible by the same process in reverse. Even analog sampling of the data and audio streams is possible, if required. That's great! But then again I know nothing of the protection used to prevent these tapes from being copied by tape-to-tape copy. Right, however they still do exist. Note that, conceivable, this doesn't have to be for copy protection reasons. In theory a turbo software system might use non-standard framing just for speed purposes. Remember the thread we talked about using MFM or even RLL encoding? I wish I had the time for testing that, it was a great idea (if it indeed works). Unfortunately a few decades too late Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted April 23, 2007 Share Posted April 23, 2007 Over the weekend I took the Juggle's House WAV posted in another thread and converted it to FSK samples. I was able to play back the data using only the FSK samples, so playback does work. The RLE encoded FSK states for the tape turned out to be about 105k, vs 9.3MB for the original WAV recording. Zipped the FSK file is only 39k. It seems like this should be a reasonable way to store cassette data without having to use huge WAV files or fully decoded CAS images. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 (edited) I added a couple more videos. The first one is of the same performance test with the release firmware, its a little faster. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=15...83125&hl=en The second one is using ProSystem to dump a floppy with the USB interface and a Happy 1050 drive. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...34616&hl=en Steve Edited May 18, 2007 by classics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pengwin Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Steve, Just out of curiosity, has anyone tried this with Sio2OSX yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Steve, Just out of curiosity, has anyone tried this with Sio2OSX yet? Its a native USB device, not a usb->virtual serial port device, so SIO2OSX wouldn't recognize it. After the initial release there will be some developer documentation so it can be supported by other SIO2PC programs. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+bf2k+ Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 I added a couple more videos. The first one is of the same performance test with the release firmware, its a little faster. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=15...83125&hl=en The second one is using ProSystem to dump a floppy with the USB interface and a Happy 1050 drive. http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4...34616&hl=en Steve Man that is fast compared to my PROSYS cable. I dump to a Happy 1050 all the time and NEVER see that kind of performance. Is the new device that much faster than your cables? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted May 18, 2007 Share Posted May 18, 2007 Is the new device that much faster than your cables? The USB adapter supports the high speed mode of the Happy, US Doubler, Speedy 1050, etc, so it is a great improvement in that way. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpicyChronos Posted May 19, 2007 Share Posted May 19, 2007 Drool....... I need to save up some pennies so I can get one. -Spicy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndusGT Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 So when will we be able to order? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
classics Posted May 20, 2007 Share Posted May 20, 2007 So when will we be able to order? I'm working on the installation documents now, shouldn't be too long. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kr0tki Posted May 25, 2007 Share Posted May 25, 2007 Right now its implemented like standard SIO2PC, as packets of bytes sent at low speed. The hardware is designed to allow the bus to be driven directly without a UART, so I will later implement a second mode that allows FSK or WAV data to be streamed to the device for more accurate cassette playback. If you have a raw WAV file of such a protected cassette please feel free to send it to me. Steve Here's one. This cassette contains two kinds of protection which were common in Poland: blocks of several minutes in length, and non-standard signals between blocks. The file is 32MB, please download it if you wish. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urchlay Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 Will it work on Apple computers? Yes, it is a normal full speed USB peripheral, but there is no software on OSX to operate it at this point. After the initial release I will publish some libusb code that will allow people to write software for other platforms or integrate the adapter into existing sio2pc programs like AtariSIO without having to write kernel drivers. Any news on the libusb driver? The post I'm replying to is over two years old... any chance you've got some sample code or just docs you could release, even if it's incomplete? I'm sure I'm not the only Linux/OSX/BSD/etc user who's been holding back on getting one of these due to lack of software support or even docs to use for writing our own software. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaxon Posted April 14, 2009 Share Posted April 14, 2009 (edited) http://www.fotosik.pl/showFullSize.php?id=502ef7b4c66b8f39 My sio2usb in SIO plug. Still under construction and testing but working. What is better, usb socket in plug or cable? Edited April 14, 2009 by zaxon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Stephen Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 http://www.fotosik.pl/showFullSize.php?id=502ef7b4c66b8f39 My sio2usb in SIO plug. Still under construction and testing but working. What is better, usb socket in plug or cable? Man - how did you get it so small? I would vote for socket as opposed to cable. Stephen Anderson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zaxon Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 http://www.fotosik.pl/showFullSize.php?id=502ef7b4c66b8f39 My sio2usb in SIO plug. Still under construction and testing but working. What is better, usb socket in plug or cable? Man - how did you get it so small? I would vote for socket as opposed to cable. Stephen Anderson ft232 and few smd components for prototype, glue gun , few hour work, and long time for test with Ape ,atari 810 and other software . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roydea6 Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 http://www.fotosik.pl/showFullSize.php?id=502ef7b4c66b8f39 My sio2usb in SIO plug. Still under construction and testing but working. What is better, usb socket in plug or cable? I would vote for the cable since the SIO plug holds the interface. Nice picture Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiassofT Posted April 15, 2009 Share Posted April 15, 2009 and long time for test with Ape ,atari 810 and other software . How's the performance and reliability, especially when using higher SIO speeds and when other programs are running (in the background) on the PC? Another thing to check: does it work stable with other active USB devices on the same bus (keyboard, mouse, harddrive etc.)? I haven't run tests with the ft232 chips myself, only a quick test with a prolific cable some time ago (which - as we all know - is crap and doesn't work reliable). so long, Hias Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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