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How long to test if Demon Attack is the one that crashes?


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#1 ComputerSpaceFan OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:36 PM

Back in the day I had one of the Demon Attacks that crashed after 84 waves and now I want it back in my collection but it aggravates me that this run of carts is not clearly identifiable compared to the ones that go on forever. So I guess the only way to know if I buy one that will finish is if I sit down and play it to Wave 84. What I am trying to figure out is, how long would that take?
I guess 2 or 3 minutes per wave times 84 waves equals from 168 to 252 minutes? So I'm looking at three to four hours of playing? Does that sound correct?
I just want to know if I can test a cart at the flee market before I buy it. I seriously doubt the seller will let me hog his 2600 for that long.

Has anyone completed Demon attack in a faster time?

#2 Pitfall Harry OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 14, 2010 6:50 PM

Back in the day I had one of the Demon Attacks that crashed after 84 waves and now I want it back in my collection but it aggravates me that this run of carts is not clearly identifiable compared to the ones that go on forever. So I guess the only way to know if I buy one that will finish is if I sit down and play it to Wave 84. What I am trying to figure out is, how long would that take?
I guess 2 or 3 minutes per wave times 84 waves equals from 168 to 252 minutes? So I'm looking at three to four hours of playing? Does that sound correct?
I just want to know if I can test a cart at the flee market before I buy it. I seriously doubt the seller will let me hog his 2600 for that long.

Has anyone completed Demon attack in a faster time?


There's another way to tell. You could invest a little money into a cartridge ROM dump setup, and then compare the dumped code to the code for each of the two versions. Granted, you can't take that sort of thing to a flea market, but it will save you time if you have to test a dozen or so carts before you get the version you want.

Having a ROM dumper is cool for a host of other reasons, too.

#3 shadow460 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:41 PM

Stella can tell which version you have. As was stated, you have to have the cart dumped first. It seems that both versions are easy enough to come by. My suggestion is to have someone with a cart dumper and a stack of duplicates sell you the one you want. My 7800 can dump carts, but not on the spot in a game store. I have two copies of Demon Attack. One is text and one has the picture label. One ends at wave 84 (according to Stella) and the other does not. I don't remember which is which, though. I've got the insert packed in with my picture label cart, but that doesn't mean much in my collection. :ponder:

#4 Ethaniel OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:56 PM

this sounds interesting. so that version was bugged, right?
any shops for that rom dump setup?

#5 shadow460 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:59 PM

Got a 7800?

You might not even need that, though. There are dumps of both versions here on the forums, and they could be run in any of the multicarts (Harmony, Supercharger, etc.)

#6 A.J. Franzman OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:07 AM

I believe Imagic, like Atari, started with text labels then switched to picture labels. So a text label Demon Attack would be more likely to be the version that ends.

#7 ComputerSpaceFan OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:33 PM

I have two copies of Demon Attack. One is text and one has the picture label. One ends at wave 84 (according to Stella) and the other does not.


Heck if you have the one that ends at 84 and are willing to sell it I am definitely interested. Let me know. :)

#8 shadow460 OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:17 PM

I do, and I think it's the text version, but I haven't really considered selling it. Demon Attack comes up in Oklahoma City on a regular basis. I'm not sure when I'll go on the hunt again, but I could keep an eye out for one when I do.

#9 toymailman OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Apr 15, 2010 10:47 PM

I think it can be found on the cart. the later "fixed" version were labeled Rev A, Rev B, and Rev C. If you find one that doesn't have any "Rev" on it then it is probably one that ends after wave 84.

I actually prefer the one that ends as the difficulty stops increasing. Once you get the hang of it you can play it until your thumb is numb. I only wish it would at least post your final score rather than going to a blank black screen.

#10 ComputerSpaceFan OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Apr 16, 2010 6:57 PM

Ah-Ha! Looks like these guys have identified which cartridge is the Level 84 version!
http://www.atariage....ost__p__1258793
I'll start looking for that and keep my fingers crossed.

#11 A.J. Franzman OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 2:05 AM

It looks like it's just an English-only text cart (not the 5-language international version). I didn't notice if there were any follow-up posts to say whether any picture-label carts were found to have the version with the ending, or any English-only text label carts having the endless version.

#12 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 3:04 AM

It looks like it's just an English-only text cart (not the 5-language international version).

Correct A.J.! The theory is that the text labels came before the picture labels. I just dumped all the carts I had at the time, and it seem to back up the theory.


When they actually switched over the rom who knows? I never got anymore dump comparisions after this. The best bet for a bugged cart is a text label IMO though.


Also, looking back I see I was calling Rob "Ron". So my apologies Rob, I can't edit that post!

#13 LS_Dracon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 8:48 AM

I have a demon attack that crash. Picture label.
Not take so long, about half an hour playing.

I only wish it would at least post your final score rather than going to a blank black screen.

Agreed.

#14 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 1:52 PM

I have a demon attack that crash. Picture label.
Not take so long, about half an hour playing.

I only wish it would at least post your final score rather than going to a blank black screen.

Agreed.

Does the picture label have any of the revision numbers on it (a,b,c)? Also, I'm presuming you're using a real Imagic cart and not a pirate!!

#15 LS_Dracon OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 2:33 PM

Original for sure, don't like/buy pirate carts.

It's revision B with a number 720101-1.

I thought this bug was a bit rot.

Attached Thumbnails

  • demonattack.JPG

Edited by LS_Dracon, Sat Apr 17, 2010 2:34 PM.


#16 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 3:55 PM

Good to know. I get my Atari stuff back in a few weeks. I'll take a look at what I have left for Demon Attack, and see what revision numbers I got. Also did you play it through to that level, and discovered the bug, or did you just dump the cart?

#17 Buzbard OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:19 PM

Any idea if the Blue Label Demon Attack is fixed or not?

According to Stella the "Activision" version of Demon Attack (which I assume is the Blue Label version) is not fixed.

#18 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:54 PM

Any idea if the Blue Label Demon Attack is fixed or not?

According to Stella the "Activision" version of Demon Attack (which I assume is the Blue Label version) is not fixed.

We were trying to figure out where these Activision roms came from. I tried either a blue label Moonsweeper or Atlantis IIRC, and it didn't have a Activision logo. I had a Demon Attack blue label, but the box was shrinkwrapped and I didn't want to break the seal. Maybe I'll break it in a few weeks time.

Here are the dates on these Activision-Imagic rom dumps:
Atlantis 2/18/1998
Demon Attack 2/19/1998
Moonsweeper 5/12/2003



So the question is were these done for the blue labels, or were they done for an Activision anthology (i.e. playstation release). Perhaps they were just hacks?


If anyone has these actual blue label carts, I would like to know which logo (Activision or Imagic) is on the screen.


In answer to your Stella question Buzbard, the Activison rom for Demon Attack is fixed. It just doesn't say that on the screen. I guess since there was no "glitched" version of the rom released for the Activision version it was redundant to say it is fixed. The other differences in that rom are the number fonts are different, and of course the Activision logo.

#19 Buzbard OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:30 PM

Any idea if the Blue Label Demon Attack is fixed or not?

According to Stella the "Activision" version of Demon Attack (which I assume is the Blue Label version) is not fixed.

We were trying to figure out where these Activision roms came from. I tried either a blue label Moonsweeper or Atlantis IIRC, and it didn't have a Activision logo. I had a Demon Attack blue label, but the box was shrinkwrapped and I didn't want to break the seal. Maybe I'll break it in a few weeks time.

Here are the dates on these Activision-Imagic rom dumps:
Atlantis 2/18/1998
Demon Attack 2/19/1998
Moonsweeper 5/12/2003



So the question is were these done for the blue labels, or were they done for an Activision anthology (i.e. playstation release). Perhaps they were just hacks?


If anyone has these actual blue label carts, I would like to know which logo (Activision or Imagic) is on the screen.


In answer to your Stella question Buzbard, the Activison rom for Demon Attack is fixed. It just doesn't say that on the screen. I guess since there was no "glitched" version of the rom released for the Activision version it was redundant to say it is fixed. The other differences in that rom are the number fonts are different, and of course the Activision logo.


Well, the Activision rom I have hangs after the 83rd wave, to test it, start it in Stella press F2 to reset the game then press ~ and change the value at address $be to 53 which is 83 decimal then click exit and play the level.

This is the rom I have:Attached File  Copy of Demon Attack (1988) (Activision).bin   4KB   107 downloads

You may be right about it coming from the Playstation collection, I'll have to check that out.
My Blue Moonsweeper also says Imagic insted of Activision.

Edited by Buzbard, Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:33 PM.


#20 Buzbard OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:47 PM

Ok, you were right. I just extracted Demon Attack from the PS2 version of Activision Anthology, and guess what? It's exactly the same as the one I posted above.

So, I imagine that all of the Imagic games that are labeled as Activision by Stella are actually from the Activision Anthology.

That explains a lot!

#21 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 6:57 PM

You are right, it is is the bugged version. I was looking at it in HOM3 and made the mistake because I was using Rom's roms, and the names are so long that they sometimes are hard to read when they get bunched up by HOM3.



The actual bug and bug fix are at $0482 - $0483. In the original game, when the last level is completed it goes into an infinite loop. Rob simply NOP'd out that branch.

#22 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:02 PM

Ok, you were right. I just extracted Demon Attack from the PS2 version of Activision Anthology, and guess what? It's exactly the same as the one I posted above.

So, I imagine that all of the Imagic games that are labeled as Activision by Stella are actually from the Activision Anthology.

That explains a lot!

By extract do you mean you dumped the disc?

#23 Buzbard OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:11 PM

Ok, you were right. I just extracted Demon Attack from the PS2 version of Activision Anthology, and guess what? It's exactly the same as the one I posted above.

So, I imagine that all of the Imagic games that are labeled as Activision by Stella are actually from the Activision Anthology.

That explains a lot!

By extract do you mean you dumped the disc?


Not really, the PS2 version is just a DVD so I looked for the Demon Attack file on the disk.
Found it in a folder named \CLASSICS\RPF1\
The file name is DEMONAT1.RPF, which contains all of the data for Demon Attack, box scans, manual scans, cart scans, rom image, etc.
I just opened that file in a hex editor and looked for the rom image.

#24 Omegamatrix OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:49 PM

It seems very reasonable that they did come from the Anthology then. I would like to look at the roms though for the Imagic games, and compare them with the ones in Roms collection. Would you be able to PM me the files containing Demon Attack, Atlantis, and Moonsweeper? I'll split apart the files and see what I can see. I'd really like to put the issue of where these roms came from to rest.

#25 Buzbard OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 17, 2010 8:37 PM

PM sent




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