33 replies to this topic

[wood_jl]

Thanks for clicking!  By the time this machine came out, Atari magazines were gone where I was, so the machine was never explained/reviewed.  I mean  a "real" review so a 520/1040ST user would know where to pick up.  That's sad - I know these aren't popular, but they're kind of cool.  Never saw one 'till today.

(1) What's the default (turn it on) speed?  How come I don't see a 8/16Mhz switch, software pop-down or otherwise?  Can I put in an old game (assuming it's compatible/hacked for STe) and it will IMMEDIATELY run 2x speed?  How do I change it, or determine what speed it's in?

(2) Someone technical, please dumb down and simplify - for the layman like me - HOW DOES THE STe ACHIEVE 16MHZ?  I mean, reading the reviews for 16Mhz accelerators for the original ST, they make it seem like 9% gain (or something) and the thing is trying to "steal" access to RAM a little bit more than usual, but most of the 16Mhz is wasted on wait states - or something that you technical-types would know about. I thought the CPU and Shifter were timeslicing for RAM, so how can you change one?  Is the Mega STe as slow as those fractional-incremental increasing enhancements?

Edited by wood_jl, Thu Apr 28, 2011 9:55 PM.

[atarian1]

1. You need to have XControl (i.e. the new modular Control Panel that came out from Atari around 1991) loaded with the System CPX installed. There you can switch between 8 and 16 MHz and cache on/off. If you want to boot in 16 MHz, make sure you save the setting in XControl.

2. I don't know the tech terms either but this is what I understand: The Mega/STE, ICD AdSpeed and Turbo 16 all uses a 16K cache to store the most used data bits in its memory so that it can recall these bits faster than going to the system RAM.    That sounds weird. Hopefully someone else who knows better can explain...   The accelerators with the cache do improve the system speed by an average of 30%. The 9% gain is from accelerators which do not have a cache.

[DarkLord]

All I can say is, use an ST accelerated to 16mhz or greater, then go back to 8mhz
and you'll be moaning and groaning at the difference...

Especially for non-games software/productivity stuff.

[poobah]

Most of the MegaSTe is the same ol' 8 Mhz STe.
Memory, video, bus all that, still runs at 8 MHz.

What is added is a CPU that can run at 8 or 16 MHz, and 16K of cache in between the CPU and the rest of the system.

If the data/instructions that the CPU needs are in the cache, the CPU can run full tilt. If the required data is NOT in the cache, the CPU has to wait on the 8 MHz bus for the fetch.

The nice thing is that for an ST era machine, 16K is a lot of memory, and the cache makes a BIG difference.
I *loved* my MegsSTe back in the day, there's still a few of them lurking about here now  

Using the CPX, you can choose 8 or 16 MHz CPU speed, and enable or disable the cache.

[Pilsner73]

I had an ADspeed 16 mhz upgrade and it was a nice performance boost.  Yes the bus was still 8mhz but the cache and extra speed of the processor usually did enough to be noticeable.  

Atari should have had the Atari Mega and STe series with this built in.  The Mega more for business and the STe to one up the Amiga 500.

The Mega STe of course did bring both the STe added features with the 8/16mhz upgrade but I feel strongly that it was a few years too late.  The Mega STe was a great computer just should of been released earlier for a lower price point.

Edited by Pilsner73, Fri Apr 29, 2011 6:20 PM.

[Official Ninja]

atarian1, on Thu Apr 28, 2011 10:39 PM, said:

1. You need to have XControl (i.e. the new modular Control Panel that came out from Atari around 1991) loaded with the System CPX installed. There you can switch between 8 and 16 MHz and cache on/off. If you want to boot in 16 MHz, make sure you save the setting in XControl.

Bumping and old thread with a question.

I just purchased my Mega STE (from Best) and I asked about this Xcontrol to switch 16 to 8 Mhz. Brad wasn't sure and didn't remember anything in a menu related to Mhz speed. So is this Xcontrol part of TOS2.06 (or better?) or is it something I need to locate and install on the machine?

Does the fact that the system is a MEGA STE guarantee TOS2.06 with Xcontrol? Or, is Xcontrol something they came out with after the selling the machines as an option?

All I've every had/used so far is 1040STf computers with TOS 1.0. So this Mega STE will be a real treat for me. It will come configured with 4mb ram and 324mb hard disk.

[Christos]

xcontrol or control panel is a desk accessory you load at startup. It allows you to load various other programs that set up your computer that have the extension .cpx. You will find it in the language disks that you can get here:
http://www.atari.org...systemdisks.php
The latest version is on the falcon disks but if your MSTE comes with an HD chances are it's already in there.

[jens]

A Mega/STe will not guarantee TOS 2.06 - it can well have 2.05 which shows no Atari logo or RAM-test on startup. Also, some bugs have been patched for 2.06.
I used to run Cubase on my Mega/STe, and I really loved the combo of a faster processor and an integrated, fast hard disk.

[wood_jl]

Necro-bump!

Thanks to all of the above, for the information provided in this thread, so far.

I picked up another Mega STe, recently.  It's really nice-looking, and, evidently, works well.



Unfortunately, there is no hard disk in there.  My other Mega STe came with some hard drive in it. I was under the impression that hard drive was standard equipment, but on a machine this old, I suppose you take what you can get.  However, I was a little thrown by the machine LOOKING for the hard drive, even though it ain't there.  Evidently, you have to hold down the ALTERNATE key to boot from floppy, even if that's all you have.   I thought something was wrong with this thing, at first.

Somewhere, I have an Ultrasatan (I confess I've never used), HD Driver (ordered from Uwe), and an adapter that lets you put the Ultrasatan internal to the Mega STe (from a teriffic chap on atari-forum).  Although I'm quite familar with the use of the ST, I never could afford a hard disk "back in the day" and I'm wondering if there is a how-to-FAQ for the hard disk (or Ultrasatan or whatever) user, so I could peruse it, before asking 20 questions that have been answered 40 times before.


Looking at the RAM.....



.....All 4 are different brands.  NICE!!!!! This kind of bothers me, but I've been gaming with it for a good while, and it appears to be stable.  I've read differing opinions on this.


I was surprised - when I went to format a floppy - that the High Density option was there.  I thought I read that the 1.44MB drive was either an upgrade, or on later Mega STe only.  Sysinfo says this has the older TOS 2.05, so either 1.44MB drive is standard, or has this been upgraded?



I don't much see the point, as I'd like to be able to read the disks in my 1040STe (and other lesser machines, too), but I guess it's nice that it's there.  Interestingly, when I put the disk into my PeeCee......



.....it recognizes a different number of bytes than the Atari screen shows.  Whatever, I was able to read and write to the disks with my PC just fine, and create a system boot disk.  [Thanks Christos, for the System Disk info a few messages above].

I'd never seen the CPX thing before.   I set to 16Mhz and cache, and it saved to the floppy.  I suppose this means, then, that there's no way to boot another disk (without CPX)  - like a boot disk game - and run at 16Mhz with cache?   Same for the blitter, which seems to default to "OFF."  I assume most games wouldn't work anyway, but the Mega STe is always going to default to 8Mhz and no cache, and no blitter when it's switched on, then, right?  I also assume that unless a game is specifically-written to use the blitter, it wouldn't help anyway?

Thanks for info.   I'm a 520/1040 man, and as such, this thing is a bit strange, but a very interesting machine.  It makes me wish I'd stuck around a bit longer in the old days, but I probably couldn't have afforded a Mega STe back then, anyway....LOL.

[CyranoJ]

Loads of games here, patched for hard disk install and 16mhz.

It makes a hell of a difference in quite a lot of cases.

[Junosix]

What a great looking machine, good find!

[OBO]

There was a batch of TOS 2.05 with 1.44 mb floppy drives in standard.
I had one of them, sold it recently.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

There are better ways for setting 16MHz CPU clock, instead CPX - especially if gaming is aim. Short programs (200-500bytes), which set it. Even possible in case of games on bootable floppies.
Considering games and 16MHz:  3D games mostly benefit. Some may run too fast (Castle Master) because not really good coding. Many non-3D will run too fast, so it's on you to see what CPU clock is better.
Smaller % will crash or freeze, but much more because TOS version, and not 16MHz.
For hard disk, flash card users, over 600 games adapted, tested on Mega STE:

http://atari.8bitchip.info/fromhd.php

Tested, checked, updated for TOS 2.06 games:

http://atari.8bitchi...STGA/astgam.php

[Official Ninja]

When you get an UltraSatan or HDD setup and have HDDriver installed on it just put the files from the MSTE system disk on the root of the drive. You will get the proper control panel apps and all that
http://www.atari.org...systemdisks.php


Sent from my Windows Phone 8X by HTC using Board Express

[wood_jl]

Official Ninja, on Mon Dec 17, 2012 10:00 AM, said:

When you get an UltraSatan or HDD setup and have HDDriver installed on it just put the files from the MSTE system disk on the root of the drive. You will get the proper control panel apps and all that
http://www.atari.org...systemdisks.php


Sent from my Windows Phone 8X by HTC using Board Express

Thanks, man.  Apologies for our little tiff, in the other thread.  

[tjlazer]

Open it up and see if there is a SCSI card in it.  You should also get TOS 2.06, pm me if you want a set.  

[Stephen]

Nice machine!  Makes my poor TOS 1.0 520ST feel very inadequate.

[Official Ninja]

tjlazer, on Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:36 PM, said:

Open it up and see if there is a SCSI card in it.  You should also get TOS 2.06, pm me if you want a set.  

That is true. You need to check for the SCSI card. They are very hard to find from what I hear. If its not there you can't even use SatanDisk on the ACSI port.

Sent from my Windows Phone 8X by HTC using Board Express

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Official Ninja, on Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:52 PM, said:

That is true. You need to check for the SCSI card. They are very hard to find from what I hear. If its not there you can't even use SatanDisk on the ACSI port.

That's not true (for change :-)  ) . In case that no SCSI card, there should be bridge, what connects DMA with external ACSI port. If there is no such, you can place there 15 jumpers - and it will work - tested. If jumpers are problem, can solve in other way. Point is in connecting all neightbour pins on 2 connectors.

[Official Ninja]

So is the bridge something Atari installed if the machine had no hdd or is this a user mod?


Sent from my Windows Phone 8X by HTC using Board Express

Edited by Official Ninja, Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:19 AM.

[ParanoidLittleMan]

Surely that it was installed by factory - otherwise ACSI port would be useless. If it missing, the reason is certainly that someone removed it, or removed ACSI-SCSI adapter.

[rustynutt]

Bump

Just purchased a Mega STE, have had ST's, Mega's and TT's before. The ST uses an ICD Link (lost since new wife moved everything to the garage). This STE looks like it had been sitting behind a drywall saw 15 years, spent the day cleaning and scrubbing it up.

First off, no hard disk, and no adapter . Reading this thread, is all that is needed are jumpers on the ASCI headder, and the external ASCI is functional? So if I can find the Link, I'm good? It has a 1.44 floppy, but don't see a boot logo, so figure it's TOS 2.05. The ROMS are p/n C302018-002B and odd C302019-002B. Sound right?

I want to stick in an FPU, I see an Atari p/n on the schematics, is it same as a MC68882? See i'll need a GAL for that. Wanna try Chronos and DynaCadd, they are a bit funky on the Falcon with the NOVA card.

Nothing in the Desktop setting to indicate TOS ver, cpu speed (but I don't have XControl loaded). Stuck in 4 new 1 meg simms while in there.

One more thing, it takes forever to boot, even with a floppy in the drive. Is there a jumper that will signal no hard disk attached? Figure that is what it's waiting for, that, or something to do with TOS 2.05. Too bad my PAK won't fit

Taking the STE apart, looking at how it was built, makes me think back and wonder if the Falcon had been packaged that way, with an 040 like the prototype, what might have changed in the world. That, and mass produced VME video cards .

[wood_jl]

rustynutt, on Sat Feb 2, 2013 6:10 PM, said:

One more thing, it takes forever to boot, even with a floppy in the drive. Is there a jumper that will signal no hard disk attached? Figure that is what it's waiting for, that, or something to do with TOS 2.05.

I'm not qualified to answer any questions about the Mega STe, as I haven't had time to fool with mine AT ALL.  But a few messages up in this thread, I learned you had to hold down the ALTERNATE key when booting, to signal there's no hard drive.  My first Mega STe has a hard drive and the second one doesn't.  I haven't even looked into it to see if it has the SCSI card or not.  But I have the internal Ultrasatan adapter somewhere, and an Ultrastatan somewhere.  One of these days I'm going to have some fun.

[rustynutt]

Thanks, about all I have done after cleaning it up is to boot Tanglewood, sent the photo to my son to jog memories.

[DarkLord]

rustynutt, on Sat Feb 2, 2013 6:10 PM, said:

Bump

Just purchased a Mega STE, have had ST's, Mega's and TT's before. The ST uses an ICD Link (lost since new wife moved everything to the garage). This STE looks like it had been sitting behind a drywall saw 15 years, spent the day cleaning and scrubbing it up.

First off, no hard disk, and no adapter . Reading this thread, is all that is needed are jumpers on the ASCI headder, and the external ASCI is functional? So if I can find the Link, I'm good? It has a 1.44 floppy, but don't see a boot logo, so figure it's TOS 2.05. The ROMS are p/n C302018-002B and odd C302019-002B. Sound right?

I want to stick in an FPU, I see an Atari p/n on the schematics, is it same as a MC68882? See i'll need a GAL for that. Wanna try Chronos and DynaCadd, they are a bit funky on the Falcon with the NOVA card.

Nothing in the Desktop setting to indicate TOS ver, cpu speed (but I don't have XControl loaded). Stuck in 4 new 1 meg simms while in there.

One more thing, it takes forever to boot, even with a floppy in the drive. Is there a jumper that will signal no hard disk attached? Figure that is what it's waiting for, that, or something to do with TOS 2.05. Too bad my PAK won't fit

Taking the STE apart, looking at how it was built, makes me think back and wonder if the Falcon had been packaged that way, with an 040 like the prototype, what might have changed in the world. That, and mass produced VME video cards .

Congrats on the Mega STe - they are really nice machines!

I'd probably just get an internal Ultrasatan adaptor from Alan H. over at AtariForum and stick and Ultrasatan or Gigafile in it.

If its just the bar from TOS 2.xx that gives the hard drive time to spin up, you can just hit the space (or any) key and bypass
it.

HTHs.