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ChipOff (Breakout-style example program)


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#26 PacManPlus OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:56 AM

Im sorry, but this is *not* "just a crappy Breakout rip-off" This game looks like attention was paid to details, and some 'outside the box' thinking was applied (again I have to site the 'dropping' of the bricks and the kickback of the paddle). ...and the additional ball angles.

I just like your version quite a bit and would buy a cart of it. Paddle controls would be the icing on the cake, is possible.

#27 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Apr 27, 2013 12:41 AM

I'm sorry, but this is *not* "just a crappy Breakout rip-off" This game looks like attention was paid to details, and some 'outside the box' thinking was applied (again I have to site the 'dropping' of the bricks and the kickback of the paddle). ...and the additional ball angles.


Thanks. I'd eventually like to have a collection of fairly good quality example programs on the bB page that will represent some of the standard video game genres, so I was trying to do the best I could without going overboard and turning into a full game.




I just like your version quite a bit and would buy a cart of it. Paddle controls would be the icing on the cake, is possible.


The multicolored playfield is lost if paddle controller movement is added, so that's not an option. If people would like this to be turned into an actual game, I can try to add the ability to have a bigger paddle and maybe I could let the player choose from one of three ball sizes. I'll also need to add a pause feature. If people don't care about having a title screen, maybe this could stay at 8k.

#28 Gemintronic OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 16, 2013 12:07 PM

Instead of configuring ball/paddle sizes you could make them in-game bonuses that activate when breaking certain blocks ala Arkanoid.

#29 Mr SQL OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 16, 2013 12:54 PM

Instead of configuring ball/paddle sizes you could make them in-game bonuses that activate when breaking certain blocks ala Arkanoid.

X2! The physics are already there the way RT has the bricks start to fall when hit - some of them could keep falling and turn into special powers :)

#30 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 16, 2013 1:01 PM

X2! The physics are already there the way RT has the bricks start to fall when hit - some of them could keep falling and turn into special powers :)


The only 'problem' with that is the block destruction effect would stop working until the bonus item is caught or drops off the bottom of the screen. Would players accept that or find it confusing?

#31 Mr SQL OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 16, 2013 3:47 PM

The only 'problem' with that is the block destruction effect would stop working until the bonus item is caught or drops off the bottom of the screen. Would players accept that or find it confusing?

RT,
I don't know - it's a cool effect right now maybe it would be better to have another routine take over to deliver the block all the way down when it's a power up, so that the effect can continue with other blocks, or maybe it would be better if it ceases until the powerup reaches the bottom. Try it and see which plays better. I always find it helpful to have at least one other person (or better yet a few) give it a try and then a bigger test group like the players here :)

#32 RevEng OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu May 16, 2013 4:20 PM

Why not give the caught dropping blocks a cumulative effect? E.g. Every 20 caught gives a power.

Taken further, you could make it so the player needs to catch blocks of the color+power they want consecutively. Catching a block from another power would reset the count.
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#33 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri May 17, 2013 8:24 AM

When I first started working on this, I made a simple bonus item that came down when you destroyed a block just to see what it would look like. Since it was just a test, I had it reset every time a new block was destroyed. When the ball (missile) got up to the top and was quickly bashing blocks, the bonus item barely had a chance to drop before it would drop again and again. I thought that looked pretty cool and kept it as a block destruction effect since I haven't seen that before and abandoned the idea of ripping off Arkanoid since Arkanoid rip offs have been done to death:

gamasutra.com/view/feature/130053/breaking_down_breakout_system_and_.php?print=1

I thought a fairly unique effect might be more interesting than a watered down, less interesting Arkanoid rip off.

Just remember that I'm not actually arguing with anyone. I like to wrestle with ideas in an attempt to come up with something that is fairly unique. What do we want? What is more fun and looks cooler? Which ideas do we love enough to 'fight' for and which ones can be dropped without regret? Do we want something closer to Breakout or do we want something closer to Arkanoid? I'm not married to the block destruction effect. We can dump it if you guys would rather lean toward Arkanoid.


Thanks.

#34 Mr SQL OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri May 17, 2013 1:27 PM

When I first started working on this, I made a simple bonus item that came down when you destroyed a block just to see what it would look like. Since it was just a test, I had it reset every time a new block was destroyed. When the ball (missile) got up to the top and was quickly bashing blocks, the bonus item barely had a chance to drop before it would drop again and again. I thought that looked pretty cool and kept it as a block destruction effect since I haven't seen that before and abandoned the idea of ripping off Arkanoid since Arkanoid rip offs have been done to death:

gamasutra.com/view/feature/130053/breaking_down_breakout_system_and_.php?print=1

I thought a fairly unique effect might be more interesting than a watered down, less interesting Arkanoid rip off.

Just remember that I'm not actually arguing with anyone. I like to wrestle with ideas in an attempt to come up with something that is fairly unique. What do we want? What is more fun and looks cooler? Which ideas do we love enough to 'fight' for and which ones can be dropped without regret? Do we want something closer to Breakout or do we want something closer to Arkanoid? I'm not married to the block destruction effect. We can dump it if you guys would rather lean toward Arkanoid.


Thanks.

That was an excellent read RT! Great coverage of breakout and arkanoid clones; sometimes a clone is phenommenal like Breakout 2000 for the Jag, or not so much fun like some pictured with the cutesy/busy look.

I think you already have a better-than-breakout breakout with the first release of ChipOff which is going to be difficult to eclipse, though the proposed featureset is interesting. Arkanoid is a different genre though and I would much rather have another Arkanoid to play :)

Here's a related Arkanoid question for Loon or anyone who may have played it on the Genesis:

In 1989 or 1990 I saw and played an Arkanoid clone on the Genesis and it motivated me to buy one a couple of years later but I could never find the cart - today it's nowhere to be seen in any ROM collection. The article made reference to Sega comming out with the Arkanoid genre first with a game of a different name so perhaps that was it - anyone have any info?

#35 BrianC OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat May 18, 2013 5:33 AM

In 1989 or 1990 I saw and played an Arkanoid clone on the Genesis and it motivated me to buy one a couple of years later but I could never find the cart - today it's nowhere to be seen in any ROM collection. The article made reference to Sega comming out with the Arkanoid genre first with a game of a different name so perhaps that was it - anyone have any info?


The only Arkanoid clone I can think of for Genesis is Devilish.

#36 PFL OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 13, 2013 3:46 PM

Why not give the caught dropping blocks a cumulative effect? E.g. Every 20 caught gives a power.

Taken further, you could make it so the player needs to catch blocks of the color+power they want consecutively. Catching a block from another power would reset the count.


If you decide to come back to this RT I think RevEng's idea is a cool one. It keeps the game from going down the Arkanoid route but allows a little tactical thinking and variation in the game. Maybe even evolve the idea into 'chain' style scoring like some shmups (ie/ Ikaruga) that, too, could be fun.

PS: I actually like the fact the game is for joystick play. :)

#37 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Sep 16, 2013 3:14 PM

Why not give the caught dropping blocks a cumulative effect? E.g. Every 20 caught gives a power.

Taken further, you could make it so the player needs to catch blocks of the color+power they want consecutively. Catching a block from another power would reset the count.

 

If you decide to come back to this RT I think RevEng's idea is a cool one. It keeps the game from going down the Arkanoid route but allows a little tactical thinking and variation in the game. Maybe even evolve the idea into 'chain' style scoring like some shmups (ie/ Ikaruga) that, too, could be fun.

PS: I actually like the fact the game is for joystick play. :)

 

Since RevEng has pfread working in the DPC+ kernel, maybe I should move over to that kernel? Then bonus objects could be added that can be on the screen at the same time with the block destruction effect.



#38 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 19, 2013 9:00 PM

I have a DPC+ version working without the destruction effect (since I had to use the ball as the actual ball). I'll have to use a sprite for the destruction effect, so it will take a little more time to get that added.

 

Until then I thought I would post a version using the standard kernel. My brain must be working better lately because I finally figured out a better way to handle collision between the ball and the blocks. The program seems to handle all three ball sizes without screwing up.

 

 

Instructions

When the program starts, move the joystick left or right to choose between 3 ball sizes. Press up for the regular paddle and down for the larger paddle. Press the fire button to start.

 

Latest version is in the first post.

 

 

Feedback

If you guys like having different ball sizes and paddle sizes, I'll add it to the DPC+ version.



#39 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 26, 2013 6:55 AM

I was thinking about adapting my guidance meter idea and instead of using an energy bar, I'd use use the thing that looks like lives. If you catch 5 of a certain kind of bonus item, you earn a nudge token (or whatever I'll end up calling it). You can spend a nudge token by holding down the fire button and moving the joystick left or right to nudge the ball for a very short amount of time.

 

Does that sound like something that would be fun?

 

 

 

Update (May 27, 2014)

 

To avoid confusing anybody, I went back to using a bar so it would look different from how many balls you have left.



#40 PacManPlus OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:40 PM

Definitely a different twist on this game.  Sounds cool to me!  Looking forward to what you come up with :) 



#41 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Sep 26, 2013 7:15 PM

Definitely a different twist on this game.  Sounds cool to me!  Looking forward to what you come up with :)

 

Thanks. I have a semi-working version right now. I hope to have a version others can look at in a day or two.



#42 Ninjinister OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:07 AM

I really appreciate something like this, as my first attempted project is to port my old Breakout clone ("Stone Smash") to 2600 and since I'm super new at 2600 programming, it's a good guideline on how to get it to work.

 

However, I can't get this game to run in Stella at all. Am I doing something wrong, or is there another emulator of choice?


Edited by Ninjinister, Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:08 AM.


#43 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:08 PM

I really appreciate something like this, as my first attempted project is to port my old Breakout clone ("Stone Smash") to 2600 and since I'm super new at 2600 programming, it's a good guideline on how to get it to work.

 

However, I can't get this game to run in Stella at all. Am I doing something wrong, or is there another emulator of choice?

 

Do you have the latest version of Stella?

 

stella.sourceforge.net/downloads.php



#44 Ninjinister OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:21 PM

 

Do you have the latest version of Stella?

 

stella.sourceforge.net/downloads.php

Well!

I thought I did.

And I appear to have been sorely mistaken. Egg on me face indeed.

 

Thank you.


Edited by Ninjinister, Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:22 PM.


#45 PFL OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Sep 27, 2013 11:44 PM

 

Thanks. I have a semi-working version right now. I hope to have a version others can look at in a day or two.

 

 

I'm looking forward to trying out this new mechanic.  Have you decided any other goodies or are you planning on keeping it 'simple'?



#46 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 28, 2013 12:21 AM

I'm looking forward to trying out this new mechanic.  Have you decided any other goodies or are you planning on keeping it 'simple'?

 
I seem to be having a creativity drought right now. I love the various times during every year when I have Spock's Brain moments and ideas just pop into my head. But right now it's harder than pulling teeth, especially when it seems like everything that can be done has been done:
 
gamasutra.com/view/feature/130053/breaking_down_breakout_system_and_.php?print=1

 

Right now there will be one that you'll collect to earn those nudge tokens and an evil one that will cause you to lose a ball if the paddle touches it, but I can't think of anything else that would be at least semi-unique. Multi-ball, catching the ball, fast ball, slow ball, changing paddle size, shooting missiles from the paddle, and the rest listed on the page I linked to above have been done to death.

 

I'll keep working on what I have and maybe I'll get lucky and something will pop into my head.



#47 RevEng OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Sep 28, 2013 7:22 AM

For creativity, I find it helps if I constrain myself to a theme and run through the ideas within it, like you did with Seaweed Assault. Often the ideas start playing off each other.

For an Alien Invasion theme... there could be UFOs that plant eggs on the playfield, and if you don't get to them in time, they'd hatch into brick spawning aliens. There could be UFOs could also pull a Galaga thing where they steal your paddle, and you have a chance to double-up or lose it. Some UFOs could be dive bombing. A power-up could be a nuke that kills all aliens on-screen, or one that changes the gravity. (Circus Atari style.) A black hole power-up could warp the ball travel if it gets close to it.

#48 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jan 9, 2014 3:45 PM

Slightly new version in the first post. The paddle will slide in the direction that you stopped more smoothly now (I figured it out while working on the DPC+ version and moved the code to this Superchip RAM version). Speaking of the DPC+ version, I'm working on it again after taking a break. When using the largest ball, if it hit the wall and a block at just the right spot, the block would not be removed. I got too frustrated with it and quit for a while. Maybe I can figure it out with a refreshed brain.



#49 PFL OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jan 9, 2014 4:35 PM

Cool beans.  I'm glad to see you've found some inspiration again.  Good luck!

 

PS:  Enjoying your new build.  The slidey paddle thing takes a little time to get used to but it really adds to the elegance of your game. :)



#50 Random Terrain OFFLINE  

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Posted Thu Jan 9, 2014 5:12 PM

Cool beans.  I'm glad to see you've found some inspiration again.  Good luck!

 

PS:  Enjoying your new build.  The slidey paddle thing takes a little time to get used to but it really adds to the elegance of your game. :)

 

Thanks.






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