Can you live on emulation only 100% ?

[Keatah]

As far as AI taking advantage of multiple cores, if there's multiple opponents, then it is by default a massively parallel operation. Suppose you have an army of Orcs in a tactical battle MMORPG. Each Orc has it's own AI and reacts slightly differently to it's surroundings. Such a game would only work on a multi-threaded CPU/Game Engine.

 

Not exactly. Continuing the previous example, you can have AI aircraft in X-Plane whether you have a single core or multiple cores. You can easily dynamically allocate and assign cores to different tasks. It's not difficult.

[adamchevy]

I've been playing a lot of arcade compilations on Xbox 360 this week. I was excited to play robotron 2084 with the dual analog sticks. It seems way more difficult than the 7800 version. I think controls are a huge factor when it comes to emulation. That's my primary reason for sticking with original hardware.

On another note , every time I buy a flashcart/multi cart for a console my desire to play it goes down like a rock. I think I would rather own a few of my favorite games in cartridge form rather than a multi cart.

[kiwilove]

The main reason for me using emulators has to do with cost - but I can see the advantages with space saving and convenience etc.

I don't have my original Atari 800 etc hardware anymore - but I guess I do need it again - because of designing graphics for Atari 8-bit games - where Altirra does not 100% accurate reproduce the graphics - even though 99% accurate is still very very good. It is certainly easier and quicker to design graphics with editors/tools etc written for a laptop.

However I think I'm fooling myself - in that I use to think what I am designing today - would have been possible back in the day.... This is simply not the case - because even using the Internet - say typically making use of Google image search is a very useful resource tool...

 

Of course emulation will end up outlasting the original hardware - and enabling classic games and hardware to live again - for succeeding generations - who may think such games cannot match the current latest games -but if they'll give them a go, may be pleasantly surprised that the best games will always retain their playability and excitement - just like they were released yesterday.

 

Harvey

[24Fanatic365]

Maybe not 100%, but I'm already almost there. The only console I currently own is a 2600, and even there I play everything on my Harmony Cart. I don't own a single original cartridge. I sold them all when I moved out of my apartment. Living full time in an RV, space is at a premium. That's why I'm currently in the process of setting up an Android stick computer that will be dedicated solely to retro console emulation(NES, SNES, Genesis, and N64), using Blutooth Playstation 3 controllers. Extreme limits on space cuts down the options a bit, but even if I had the room, I would have gone this route. Cartridge prices have taken quite a jump in prices, especially in the last few months. Besides, when is the last time you saw a game like Little Samson or Battletoads & Double Dragon in your local retro shop? With emulation, I have the opportunity to play these and other ultra rare/hard to find titles, as well as the old standbys like Super Mario Bros. and Metroid.

 

I have no problem with the purists who only want to play on original hardware, though. It's all a matter of personal preference and the options that are available to you. Besides, I consider myself to be more of a gamer, and not a collector.

Edited January 4, 2015 by 24Fanatic365

[fujidude]

Do you think you could do all your classic gaming and retro computing via emulation? And never use the original hardware again?

 

 

I'm doing it already.

[Keatah]

I think emulation is perfect for the off-gridders up in Alaskan regions. In the space of a quarter-cubic meter you can have nearly every classic system that ever existed. And none of it requires an internet connection to play or to archive. And when they make the trek into town they can do all their updating then and there. A small pocket-size solar array can charge a battery over the course of a day or two and allow for evening gaming!

[Justin222]

Input lag stinks. Emulation is only adequate for things like RPGs and simulators — games that don't require split-second reflexes.

[fujidude]

What input lag?

[+LS650]

What input lag?

I agree. Maybe Justin222 has a more sensitive touch than me, but with good emulation software set up on a sufficiently decent computer I don't notice any such thing.

 

I prefer genuine gear, but that's more because I enjoy the history of the hardware and games, and like the look and feel of the 'original deal'.

[Keatah]

There is definitely some lag, not much, and you do get used to it in a predictive sort of way. And as long as you have a fast enough system the problem is so minimal it could be could be considered non-existent.

Edited January 5, 2015 by Keatah

[fujidude]

There is definitely some lag, not much, and you do get used to it in a predictive sort of way. And as long as you have a fast enough system the problem is so minimal it could be could be considered non-existent.

Core i7 3.8GHz, quad channel RAM. I have no problems.

[Andromeda Stardust]

What input lag?

When you press "A" telling Mario to jump, he just sits there giving you enough time to run to the kitchen and grab a can of soda/beer, and you get back to the couch just in time to see him leap into the air on your TV screen... if you've got superman reflexes that is!

[+wongojack]

If you are getting noticeable lag then you are doing emulation wrong. That fact that you CAN mess it up is another point in favor of original hardware, but not for me because I haven't noticed any lag in more than 15 years.

[Cynicaster]

If you are getting noticeable lag then you are doing emulation wrong. That fact that you CAN mess it up is another point in favor of original hardware, but not for me because I haven't noticed any lag in more than 15 years.

 

Yeah, I'm always a bit perplexed by these claims of noticeable lag in retro console emulation. As an avid user of emulation on multiple devices with widely varying levels of computing horsepower, lag is not an issue***, plain and simple.

 

*** the only possible exception is when playing Mike Tyson's Punch Out on an NES emulator; I can't beat the last 3 opponents, but can do it no problem on hardware. That might be because I'm using a crappy XBOX 360 controller, though (the d-pad is retrograde at best).

[+LS650]

I think the problem might rely with folks using a PC to emulate on a large screen TV. Then you can definitely have delays in display, but that's on the TV, not the emulation process.

[Andromeda Stardust]

I think the problem might rely with folks using a PC to emulate on a large screen TV. Then you can definitely have delays in display, but that's on the TV, not the emulation process.

I use a 23" ASUS monitor for HD gaming. It has ~8ms lag. That's like half a frame. Unnoticeable.

 

Go look up the lag measurements on most non-Sony/Bravo 55" HDTV displays. They are abysmal for gaming.

Edited January 7, 2015 by stardust4ever

[israelg]

I am currently connecting my PC to a Sony CRT TV through a scan converter,

 

I also using an original Atari controller connected to a USB adapter,

 

So this is almost a real experience (without console and cartridges).

 

I am also using emulators on my android tablet it is really fun...!

[Cynicaster]

I use a 23" ASUS monitor for HD gaming. It has ~8ms lag. That's like half a frame. Unnoticeable.

 

Go look up the lag measurements on most non-Sony/Bravo 55" HDTV displays. They are abysmal for gaming.

 

Yeah, I tried playing some Pac-Man Championship Edition DX (PS3) on my girlfriend's TV and it was unplayable. I kept blowing right past intersections because the controls weren't responding right. Worked just fine on my circa 2006 rear-projection DLP TV.

[Keatah]

Some displays are terrible with lag, and others are lag-free. Once you get into the "core" i5, the emulation process and lag, though quite measurable, is very low.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Guys, for HD gaming, get the biggest PC monitor you can find. Make sure it's 1920x1080p for maximum compatibility. They should scale 1280x720p or any other weird resolution (even those not commonly supported by HDTVs) without any issues. Note most PC monitors don't have an aspect adjustment option and will either stretch the picture by default or display any non-native resolution as square pixels. This is a non issue for modern consoles but it's something to think about if you plan to use an upscaler to display SD game systems. Most cheap scalers stretch SD images to 16x9 so you may get stuck with that. Many PC monitors also have crap speakers or none at all. Some monitors also lack audio pass-through. If you use a DVI port or your monitor lacks a pass-through, you may need a splitter in the event your HD console doesn't supply external audio. It's also a good idea to get a quality HDMI switch-box for hooking up multiple consoles. My Monoprice HDMI switch-box has 4 inputs, one output, auxiliary SPDIF out, and a 1/8" stereo plug for analog stereo.

 

For SD gaming, just keep a small CRT around for those. Many retro gamers have 100s or 1000s of game carts and dozens of systems and accessories. If you can't make room for a proper retro display device, you're doing it wrong.

Edited January 8, 2015 by stardust4ever

[Keatah]

I use a 23" ASUS monitor for HD gaming. It has ~8ms lag. That's like half a frame. Unnoticeable.

 

Go look up the lag measurements on most non-Sony/Bravo 55" HDTV displays. They are abysmal for gaming.

 

That's pixel response time. The time it takes for an element to twist full on or full off. Partial twists for greyscale or partial brightness changes takes much longer, like 30ms or more.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

That's pixel response time. The time it takes for an element to twist full on or full off. Partial twists for greyscale or partial brightness changes takes much longer, like 30ms or more.

Doesn't change the fact that your average PC monitor still has light-years quicker response than most HDTVs. If you research lag listings and sort by response time, you'll notice most of the displays at the top of the list are PC monitors. Most HDTVs above 30 inches in size have at most a rating of "acceptable" with many being "poor" or "bad". The Sony/Bravia 55 inch (I forget the exact model) is the lone exception.

 

I do notice some motion blur on LCD displays, especially portables such as on my DS or Wii-U gamepad, when I scroll a browser webpage slowly, the small pixels have a tiny amount of motion blur. I imagine the monitors are a bit better but I've seen the effect when displaying for instance a checkerboard pixel pattern. Moving it around or scaling it causes noticeable motion blur, moire, or other artifacts on the screen.

 

I'm not going to cry about the deficiencies or LCD though. OLED display tech is still in it's infancy and currently all displays that use it are susceptible to burn in patterns as the blue LEDs burn-in at a faster rate than the red and green. That's why Sony switched back to LCD screen in their Vita handhelds.

http://kotaku.com/sony-explains-why-it-changed-the-ps-vitas-oled-screen-1299021236

 

Continuous watching of letter-boxed or pillar-boxed content on an OLED display will also cause a similar problem. The areas near the edge of the screen within the black bar space will eventually shine whiter and brighter while the areas in the center rectangle where the content is more frequently illuminated will develop a pinkish hue over time.

 

The industry leaders know this but they also know that it will take time for the burn-in to take effect and become noticeable and bothersome. Unless the TV is left on 24/7, the effects will typically occur well after the warranty is expired. And do you know what else? You don't even need to have the TV turned on or plugged in for burn in to happen. Exposure to natural or artificial UV light or high-intensity blue light will also burn in the screen too. I recall a Youtube video where a guy pointed a home-made blue laser pointer (hacked from a 405nm BluRay lens) at an OLED screen, and it left permanent yellow trails burned into the screen.

Edited January 8, 2015 by stardust4ever

[bomberpunk]

there aren't good emulators for every system out there, so no. i could not.

[adamchevy]

Gaming as a hobby is very inexpensive compared to other hobbies. Take hunting for example. First, most have to miss work to go hunting, then there's the hunting gear( Gun $250-$500 at minimum, ammo $50-$200 minimum) and that's the basics. Most hunters I know have a four wheeler and all of the latest gadgets from cabelas. Also there's the hunting camo clothing that probably cost $200-$500. They also have to buy tags every year. Being a gamer is cheap, emulation aside, you can buy almost any console on eBay for $100 or less. I'm not sure why any "gamer" if that's your most serious hobby would ever go 100% emulation.

[fujidude]

When you press "A" telling Mario to jump, he just sits there giving you enough time to run to the kitchen and grab a can of soda/beer, and you get back to the couch just in time to see him leap into the air on your TV screen... if you've got superman reflexes that is!

Sounds like using "cooked" keys rather than raw in Altirra.