+sm3 Posted August 3, 2015 Share Posted August 3, 2015 I'm looking for a Newell OSN ROM and a Fastchip for a RAMROD MMOS (blank) board for an 800. Would anyone have an extra they wouldn't mind selling? I believe I could just put my stock ROM and math chip on there I suppose, but would like the Newell stuff if possible. I know this stuff is kind of rare, but doesn't hurt to ask, maybe the right person will happen to be checking the forums Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted August 4, 2015 Share Posted August 4, 2015 Deleted -- didn't notice this was for the 800, not XL. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 4, 2015 Author Share Posted August 4, 2015 Yes, sorry! I have a bare Newell RAMROD board (MMOS) for the Atari 800. Seems like a waste sitting there not being used For the XL, I know B&C still has those ROMs for sale or at least they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted August 6, 2015 Share Posted August 6, 2015 Can't have my rom even though I'm not sure it's what you are looking for in the first place but here is a post of what I do have to offer. Hope it's enough. http://atariage.com/forums/topic/145984-omnimon-4k-code/?do=findComment&comment=1776101 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 6, 2015 Author Share Posted August 6, 2015 Hi, thanks for the post. If I'm not mistaken, the OSN came as 2 4K eproms or 1 8K. These would fit in the RAMROD OS board along with the Fastchip and you could also use another ROM for that 4K block of unused memory at C000. I believe that is what Omnimon fills. The actual ROM dumps for OSN are on this forum, however, I don't have an eprom burner or the experience to make my own eproms so that's why I was hoping someone had a spare to sell. I suppose I may have to try and take the plunge though and make an attempt. Seems these are pretty rare! I don't really know if you can actually make a "Fastchip" though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 6, 2015 Author Share Posted August 6, 2015 Actually, here is the thread that lists the OSN ROM images. If someone wants to make a few extra bucks and create the 2 working ROMs I can use, I would be extremely grateful. I suppose with a little guidance I could attempt it myself as well, but it's going to take me a bit to obtain all the parts needed and probably some trial and error at first http://atariage.com/forums/topic/114593-super-rare-newell-os-board-for-atari-800-on-ebay/ Here is a picture of a RAMROD MMOS board with the 2 OSN chips, a Fastchip and an Omnimon instaled: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/205851-should-i-be-disappointed/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 Does anyone know what the pinout of the 400/800 math rom (CO12399B) is? I looked through Sam's, but did not find it listed (A402). What I'm really getting at is whether it is 2516 or 2716 compatible? Since the Fastchip was a replacement for the 800 math rom, presume it must be compatible with one of these. Or I suppose it could have been compatible with a 2532 or 2732, but seems unlikely since the cost would have been higher. Edit: Same question for the two OS roms -- 2532 or 2732? BTW, did anyone ever see the MyDos ROMDOS (it would have been a version 3.x MyDos) for the Ramrod board? I think that most info for this product has been lost. Similarly, there was a ROMDOS version for the XL/XE. IIRC, there is some info about it on Mathy's web site. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tpapahem Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 (edited) For the XL, I know B&C still has those ROMs for sale or at least they did. Edited August 8, 2015 by tpapahem Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 8, 2015 Author Share Posted August 8, 2015 Does anyone know what the pinout of the 400/800 math rom (CO12399B) is? I looked through Sam's, but did not find it listed (A402). What I'm really getting at is whether it is 2516 or 2716 compatible? Since the Fastchip was a replacement for the 800 math rom, presume it must be compatible with one of these. Or I suppose it could have been compatible with a 2532 or 2732, but seems unlikely since the cost would have been higher. Edit: Same question for the two OS roms -- 2532 or 2732? BTW, did anyone ever see the MyDos ROMDOS (it would have been a version 3.x MyDos) for the Ramrod board? I think that most info for this product has been lost. Similarly, there was a ROMDOS version for the XL/XE. IIRC, there is some info about it on Mathy's web site. -Larry Larry, the documentation I have on the board state: 4K eprom 2732 style pinout, 350 ns max access time. 2K eprom 2716 style pinout, 350 ns max access time. I know you can pull out your OS ROMs and floating point ROM from a stock OS board and use them in the RAMROD board. There are some dip settings you have to change though if you are using a stock OS ROM or the OSN. I'm going to attempt to make my own OSN ROMs and floating point ROM (Fastchip). Trying to choose an appropriate eprom burner and eproms now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 Thanks, and hope you can find a modern burner that can still burn these "vintage" eproms + newer devices. -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 8, 2015 Author Share Posted August 8, 2015 Here is a post on this site that confirms what type to buy from AtariAge user "sloopy": " .. you may want to consider getting a Willem GQ-3x USB version with external supply... as it will program the 2716's and 2732's at 21v and 25v Vpp, but wont program them without the external power supply... " There is a GQ-4X now. Now all I need to do is figure out which of the adapters I would need, if any. http://www.ebay.com/itm/260819856441 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 You really shouldn't be kneeling at the feet of the God Willem in the first place. Any programmer that doesn't support GAL programming or unmarked logic chip identification is not spending your money wisely these days since you can have all the above at less than $40. Look for a devices supported list and if that list is hard to find - AVOID that one like the plague. http://www.ebay.com/itm/171849158311 Won't need any adapters until you go surface mount package usually. As to 25 volt programming some 2732 required it and some (B version) were able to be programmed at the 'normal' voltage of 12.7 as per most EPROMS - that would be a chip source decision workaround if 25 volt chips aren't done properly in these cheaper give away priced programmers with so much talent otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 Thanks for the information. I didn't really want to get one at all, because I'm sure I'll only use it a few times to get the ROMs I'm looking for. How do you know what voltage you'll need anyway? The eproms I see on eBay just mention their type, don't see anything about voltage really. What about how to place the eprom into the programmer? The Atari ROMs are 24 pin. These things have 40 pins that I can see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Larry Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 Typical eproms for our use are 24 and 28 pins. A few at 32 pins. I have a "Mini-Pro" with several adapters so that I can program flash devices and a few other modern devices. But I cheated -- I have an older burner that I kept for programming the vintage eproms (even 25xx series). Here is a recent thread that discussed what you are asking: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/240295-which-usb-flash-programmer-as-versatile-as-possible-for-atari-uses/?do=findComment&comment=3273375 You just have to look at the specs of the individual programmers to confirm what devices it works with. Take a good look at the Mini-Pro. Lots of folks give it high marks. Edit: Just checked my Mini Pro software (Windows). It does support several types of 27XX series down to 2716. Also, a modern programmer will automatically select the correct voltage for the type device you tell it you are using. This is very close to what I bought and paid. Mine does have the adapters for the small flash devices that we have in cartridges, Ultimate 1 MB, etc. (And that is really handy to have!) http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mini-Pro-TL866CS-USB-Universal-Bios-V5-9-Programmer-13137-Chips-5-Adapters-/221649350685?hash=item339b54b01d -Larry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 Thanks. OK. I watched the video there from the "EEVblog" guy Dave I also watched a video on YouTube for the GQ-4X. So in short, the software with the programmer assists you with all the questions I had about adapters, voltages etc.. The particular video on the GQ-4X for instance will tell/show you if you need an adapter, what type, where to place it on the ZIF socket etc.. (for anyone else new to eprom programming reading this). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 9, 2015 Author Share Posted August 9, 2015 I was doing some further reading on the RAMROD and Fastchip and I re-read this post: http://atariage.com/forums/topic/182682-details-of-dual-os-newell-ramrod-board/?p=2302219 This is why I wanted an original Fastchip, if possible. Of course I don't really *need* the Fastchip. I probably will just try the 2 OSN ROMS and the Omnimon and use a stock floating point ROM. Overall I'm just trying to find a good reason to use this RAMROD MMOS I purchased. Otherwise, it's no better than a stock OS board and wasted money Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted August 9, 2015 Share Posted August 9, 2015 At your eBay link you can click on the devices list and read which adapter is needed for what, plus the breakdown on the 2732 (25+), 2732A (21+), and 2732B (12.7+) chips, so it's a matter of buying 2732B and not buying a 2732 if your programmer doesn't do 25+ volt programming. That device list is quite informative. So I can cook you up some FastChip rom code, turns out Bob Puff fixed it in his US+ OS release. I never noticed before this moment, but grabbed a segment out of omnimonXL OS and did the same with US+ OS to find one byte difference between the two segments. A little investigation at offset 1E0h shows good (Puff fixed) code is E9h - SBC #$09 and older bad code there is E5h - SBC $09. The first is subtracting an absolute value of nine, the second is subtracting what ever the value that is held at memory location 0009h, otherwise known as the BOOT flag which is usually one. And not too likely that 0009h (BOOT flag) holds anything of value that the math pack needs. Very common late night programming error to make leaving out the # sign, surprised no one said anything before this. FastChip.zip This code goes into a 2716 or similar sized 2K EPROM for the 800 only for life at D800h region. You can overwrite 1800h thru 1FFFh offset region to transplant this code into a standard 16K OS file if you want the Puff fixed Marslett FastChip code there too. I believe this should be called FastChip.rom as our own ClausB has done a better version which most are calling FastMath. Am I right here? Then I see a FastMath posted before ClausB even writes this one so I am confused some to say the least. Where is the source for that one? http://atariage.com/forums/topic/124761-fast-math-rom/ It won't work on the normal 800 though because it has code residing also in the CC00h region as I understand it. But the normal 800 doesn't use code in that region so it might be made to work after all. A bit out of my comfort zone at the moment, but the linked to somewhere above 800 board appears to be doing just this, but with Omnimon code there which will probably not like being stepped on by FastMath code so we have gained nothing again? Other than maybe getting a clue on how to enable a larger rom in that region for FastMath to live and work all by itself? In the XE/XL this code replaces some international character set and most consider it a good switch out, Omnimon most likely set up shop in that same region on the 800 to make full use of the area so it's not going to want to play well with others as they say. Yet again I'm at a loss for all the Omnimon naming conventions, can't keep one straight with another and still don't know what one does over another similar named offering by the same company. View, 80 and other variants aren't helping my feeble mind to keep things straightened out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 10, 2015 Author Share Posted August 10, 2015 Wow, fantastic! Really appreciate the effort. I mostly use the 800 (not XL) so for me this will be great. I still need to get my eprom programmer and some eproms before I can take the next step though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 19, 2015 Author Share Posted August 19, 2015 I've ordered all the parts I need. I can't wait to finally be able to make my own eproms. I went with the GQ-4X with external power adapter. I purchased the miniPro (first) from Amazon, but then returned it because it doesn't do the 25 vpp needed for the 2716 eprom. I'll post back after I've tried out the roms listed in this thread. Hopefully have some good news to report for the next person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 I think my GQ-4X shipment is lost in the mail Was supposed to be here in 3 or 4 days with "Xpresspost USA" and it has been 9 with no tracking updates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1050 Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Don't despair just yet, lately I've noticed that some often don't have tracking and have just purchased the delivery conformation ticket for it. You won't see it until it's been delivered. What I hate is when I can follow tracking and notice it goes to a city that is not mine and then is sent back to main sorting city but never is scanned again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 It finally updated on the Canada side. It shows it's at "USORDA" now which may be some sorting facility in Chicago. USPS still shows no change though. I really hate using the regular postal services. What's bad is that I paid about $32 to get it here in 3 or 4 days Update: Well, USPS finally updated and they show delivery on August 31st. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle22 Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 USPS is operated by the federal government at a net loss, funded by the taxpayers. Horribly inefficient. Typical bureaucracy. Hopefully Trump will get elected and make USPS a private company like happened to UPS years ago. UPS is profitable now that the feds are out of it. I hope you get your package intact 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+sm3 Posted August 28, 2015 Author Share Posted August 28, 2015 Thanks. I'm hoping it arrives intact as well! I asked MCUmall in Canada if they can get a refund for shipping since it has taken a lot longer than it was supposed to. They said they will call Canada Post, but I doubt they will get one. Canada Post is government owned as well I believe. Oh well, lesson learned I suppose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gozar Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 USPS is operated by the federal government at a net loss, funded by the taxpayers. Horribly inefficient. Typical bureaucracy. Hopefully Trump will get elected and make USPS a private company like happened to UPS years ago. UPS is profitable now that the feds are out of it. I hope you get your package intact That would be pretty hard to do as president since it would violate the constitution. I guess he could promote an amendment though. :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Like us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
AtariAge on Instagram
Watch us on YouTube
Chat on Discord
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.