Port Ladybug, LaserBlast, Mouse Trap, and Zookeeper

[peteym5]

As some of you probably already know, I had started up some ports for some games that were never ported to the Atari 8-bit. I am looking to do LaserBlast, have it partially done. The other games, LadyBug, MouseTrap, and Zookeeper, I am considering these to be done as co-op projects, getting some help with Font, Sprite, and Sounds together. Maybe do some beta testing. Now if someone chooses to assist, please understand, the work will be moved to private email, and possibly be put under non-disclosure until the game is completed. Non-Disclosure protects everyone involved as we intend to sell the games on cartridge. Has to be someone in the United States. Anyone assisting probably get around $5 per game sold, depending on the level of assistance someone provides. I am trying to keep the price low on new games because we know how that can lead into negative content here. The games are being designed to fit onto a 16K ROM cartridge and run on a stock Atari with a minimum of 16K RAM, so we have the option of porting to the 5200 later.

 

I know Bilbo was made many years ago and is why Ladybug was thrown onto the back burner. If I was to do this, maybe we can make a more accurate arcade port. Maybe get someone like Tep392 involved with the game design. Since MouseTrap and Ladybug are also go around and eat dots type game, it may be possible to combine these into a multi-cart and share some programming.

 

LadyBug, Mouse Trap, and Zookeeper was put onto the back burner as I am also currently working a group of these 16K ROM games already. I had not done much work with sprite and graphic design yet. I said, if people really want to see some games get ported, maybe I should seek out some help on putting the game together.

 

There are no demo's, screen shots, or videos, yet, because there is not enough of a game together to do so.

 

 

[Goochman]

I vote for Zoo Keeper since it never made it to any computer/console back in the day - and prob not ever.

[+save2600]

+1 for Zoo Keeper. Mucho underrated game and seems to be consistently ignored by the classic gaming community for some strange reason. Have lots of ways to play Lady Bug and Mouse Trap already and across a variety of platforms.

 

Speaking of Zoo Keeper, Bagman is *another* great classic that doesn't get enough love. Turtles is yet another!

[peteym5]

What needs to be done is reviewing some videos, screen shots, playing the Zookeeper on MAME and see if we can get a list of creatures that need to be drawn up for that game. What I did a few months ago is I used Megaoids as a template and cloned the programming into a bunch of different games since that has an Antic 3 + 4 scoreboard + playfield set up, reading the joystick, and moving sprites with a player/missile multiplexer. I am thinking multicolor mode with 2 players overlaying each other.

 

With the LadyBug / Mousetrap route, can include a Dodge 'Em type thing with cars. My other thoughts is call the game Beetle, Firefly, Termite, or some other insect and combine elements of the two games. Could be Lice running around on top of someones head that given us problems in the past.

Edited December 9, 2015 by peteym5

[peteym5]

I attempted to look up Mucho and Turtles. I was not 100% sure if these are arcade games you are referring to. "Turtles" I get "Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles"., But found another Pac-Man like clone in my MAME arcade collection.

 

Mucho, I got this game involving eating Mexican Food. Maybe have a character going around eating Tacos, Burritoes, Nachos, all with extra beans and have the pass gas sound effect at the end of each level.

[kiwilove]

One game title I'll throw in for open discussion is Atari's Black Widow. Is this game simply too difficult for the A8 treatment? I would also suggest going for the option of using the trackball. I forget what control the coin-op used?

 

Harvey

[+save2600]

LOL! You took my sentence out of context... there is no game called Mucho that I'm aware of. Was referring to how Zoo Keeper is such an underrated game. Mucho means 'much' or 'a lot' of course.

 

Turtles is a classic Stern/Konami vid, long before the TMNT phenom:

 

 

 

[peteym5]

I found Turtles a little later on MAME arcade, another Pac-Man clone. Maybe add that in the Pac-Man clone multi-cart.

 

Black Widow was considered by taking the Tempest Xtreme base code about 5 years ago. KJMANN12 did not want to that game, we did Venture instead.

[bbking67]

Lady Bug is a sleeper classic on ColecoVisiion (and arcade). Great game with addictive gameplay.

[peteym5]

Ladybug is a still active game on my development list. Many want to see Zoo Keeper ported also. Now these are "Ports" I am considering and asking help with graphics encoding. We have several of our own creations currently under construction and much further along, I will post something about these other games when they are finished, I learned the hard way its better to keep things secret until the game is almost ready for release. After I compacted and compressed Venture to fit onto a 16K cartridge. I started designing a new group of games that fit onto 16K ROM cartridges and run on systems with 16K RAM. Had too few sales for Venture at $50, so these games can be sold for $40 because Video61 has hundreds of blank 16K ROM boards.

 

I know most of us either have 48K, 64K, or 128K+ RAM in our Atari Computers, I want to keep the possibility of porting to the 5200 open. I still need to find or write up a 5200 joystick replacement procedure that I can drop into each of these games.

 

Now is there anyone out there that is interested in at least helping with encoding font (FNT) files and data files for sprites? I know someone made this engine several years ago. http://atariage.com/forums/topic/99661-sprite-engine-new-version/?hl=sprite%20edit Wonder if this was ever updated. You can also draw the sprites up with GIMP and save them all on one picture as a bitmap. I have a template image and a program that converts them as ML DTA statements, but these are internal tools used only by us. So if anyone is interested, they will have to work with me through PM and email.

Edited December 10, 2015 by peteym5

[electrohaze]

I have to admit, I never even played Zoo Keeper before.

After checking a Youtube video. I would have to agree, that would make a great addition to the Atari 8-bit library.

 

I understand what you are saying about making games that will work on 16k machines, but couldn't you design a more impressive game using 48k, 64k or even 128k as apposed to a 16k version? Is cost the main issue? Or, does it not really apply to the types of games you are designing anyway?

 

Also, I thought I might mention that I just placed an order for tempest extreme, venture, delta space arena, and secretrum labyrinth. I am getting back into Atari and am looking forward to trying out all the games you worked on. (that I am aware of) I will probably be able to make more educated comments and suggestions about your projects once I have tried your games.

Edited December 11, 2015 by electrohaze

[Defender II]

I like the multi-cart idea with all four games but single carts would be fine too. Let me know when they're avaiable, I'd like 2.

[peteym5]

I have to admit, I never even played Zoo Keeper before.

After checking a Youtube video. I would have to agree, that would make a great addition to the Atari 8-bit library.

 

I understand what you are saying about making games that will work on 16k machines, but couldn't you design a more impressive game using 48k, 64k or even 128k as apposed to a 16k version? Is cost the main issue? Or, does it not really apply to the types of games you are designing anyway?

 

Also, I thought I might mention that I just placed an order for tempest extreme, venture, delta space arena, and secretrum labyrinth. I am getting back into Atari and am looking forward to trying out all the games you worked on. (that I am aware of) I will probably be able to make more educated comments and suggestions about your projects once I have tried your games.

 

I am designing a few games based in the most common denominator, most of these work on computers with as little as 16K. This also makes it possible to port to the 5200. Have to keep in mind I am also using INFLATE which expands portions of the game into RAM. Most of that will be self-modifying RAM routines and data tables that can be written to. So you are getting around 20K of game program + data in that 16K cartridge. You can Deflate up to 27K game down into a 16K cartridge and expand it into RAM, but at that point you will be needing the 32K of remaining RAM (64K minus OS ROM with Cartridge ROM areas.)

 

 

I like the multi-cart idea with all four games but single carts would be fine too. Let me know when they're avaiable, I'd like 2.

 

When I thought about doing multi game carts, I would like to put several of the same type of game on a single cart. LadyBug, Mouse Trap, and this Turtle game can possibly share some common programming like multiplexing, drawing the maze, joystick control, etc. May be possible to fit everything into a 16K cartridge. I have several space/sci fi type games on my list that may be candidates for another multi-cart but that cartridges will probably be larger ROMS.

[Mclaneinc]

This idea will almost certainly crash and burn but here goes, why not every once in a while do a free digital game, say a budget style title. The reason being that we are very lucky with our devs producing numerous very high quality free titles and its not every day you get an almost complete Star Raiders II for free. That way you entice the public with a freebie but also sell your grade A titles on cart?

 

Alternatively release a free version of an older stock item that has hit the sales it was going to have long ago.

 

Anyway, its just an idea...

[ledzep]

One game title I'll throw in for open discussion is Atari's Black Widow. Is this game simply too difficult for the A8 treatment? I would also suggest going for the option of using the trackball. I forget what control the coin-op used?

 

Harvey

 

Love Black Widow. The original control scheme was dual sticks, like Robotron: 2084 (perfect for the 5200 using that Space Dungeon/Robotron: 2084 holder). A trak-ball wouldn't work, though it would be perfect for Quantum (was that game ever ported to home consoles?). I don't think it would be too difficult, at least graphics-wise. If Tempest could look good on the 5200, so could Black Widow, so I have to assume either/both would look good on the Atari 8-bit computers.

[peteym5]

I looked at Black Widow a few times because the arcade version had similarities to Tempest. It should not be that hard to do with a graphics 15 screen and a player/missile multiplexer.

 

However, I am commented to finishing up Laser Blast and Megaoids first and getting those games out of the way to go onto other projects. It will be awhile before I am able to get to anything else. My original intent of this thread to see if I can get some assistance with encoding the fonts with a program like Envision, and maybe use a sprite editor. I know someone made a sprite engine a few years ago, if there are any good tools that can cut the work time down, please let me know. I am not sure if is possible to use bitmap images with Gimp and save them as RAW data.

 

I may drop the ideal of doing Ladybug and/or Mouse Trap and just do Zookeeper since that is something that has not been done on the Atari.

Edited December 13, 2015 by peteym5

[+Philsan]

 

Now is there anyone out there that is interested in at least helping with encoding font (FNT) files and data files for sprites? I know someone made this engine several years ago. http://atariage.com/forums/topic/99661-sprite-engine-new-version/?hl=sprite%20edit Wonder if this was ever updated. You can also draw the sprites up with GIMP and save them all on one picture as a bitmap. I have a template image and a program that converts them as ML DTA statements, but these are internal tools used only by us. So if anyone is interested, they will have to work with me through PM and email.

I like Atari Player Editor (it supports overlap feature to create third color).

[kiwilove]

Love Black Widow. The original control scheme was dual sticks, like Robotron: 2084 (perfect for the 5200 using that Space Dungeon/Robotron: 2084 holder). A trak-ball wouldn't work, though it would be perfect for Quantum (was that game ever ported to home consoles?). I don't think it would be too difficult, at least graphics-wise. If Tempest could look good on the 5200, so could Black Widow, so I have to assume either/both would look good on the Atari 8-bit computers.

Thanks for confirming what control system it had. I had an inkling it was 2 joysticks like Robotron - but my memory wasn't that clear, since I only played it about 3? times. I don't know if it was a good game as I never lasted that long to find out.

 

I think you should do what games you like to see/do rather than requests - as it's more fun/rewarding that way.

 

Harvey

[Level42]

Zookeeper would be brilliant !

 

Quantum is a 68000 game...might be pretty challenging to convert.

It does use 2 POKEYs so.....

[peteym5]

I like Atari Player Editor (it supports overlap feature to create third color).

That is a good example of something we can use to encode these sprites. The What you see is What you get is very important with putting these games together. I know its hard to do that with looking at DTA and DATA statements in your programming language.

Edited December 13, 2015 by peteym5

[peteym5]

I looked at this Atari Player Editor and know one issue is that it can only do one player sprite animation at a time. I can tell you some of my games have well over 100 sprites and to use something like that will take weeks to make up a sprite set for a game. I am using an utility that converts sprites like seen in the images below to DTA statements. If someone wishes to help draw the sprites for games like Zookeeper or Ladybug, send me a PM and I will email you the utility. Of course I need to track who I sent the utility to. It is a compiled Dark Basic program that runs in Windows.

 

Also as I stated before if someone wishes to assist and look to make some money, you need to contact myself and Video61. We are going to need to know who you are, location, etc. before we can pay you.

Edited December 15, 2015 by peteym5

[Shawn Jefferson]

Release the utility?

[peteym5]

Since this is a Windows PC platform program, I had considered putting the player sprite conversion utility up for pay-for-download ("digital downloads") and show how fast this will be copied between people behind the scenes. Instead I will just put a few restrictions of what the public version be capable of doing. However I do not want to be dragged into another "Selling game on Cartridge only VS Digital Download" debate on here. That is also why I declined to comment in response to Post #14 until now.

 

I am actually doing some things to make it more user friendly and doing some final debugging. Dark Basic is like a super enhanced TurboBasic XL. It is not object oriented base and does not include a GUI interface. You have to enter the filename with an "INPUT" statement and have the image file in the same directory. I am attaching the present version of the program here. It may need some Dark Basic/DirectX8 DLLs if you do not have Dark Basic Pro installed on your Windows PC. It is not compatible with OSX, Linux, or the Atari 8-bit computer platform.

 

 

 

SpriteBMP2Data.zip

[Lynxpro]

As some of you probably already know, I had started up some ports for some games that were never ported to the Atari 8-bit. I am looking to do LaserBlast, have it partially done. The other games, LadyBug, MouseTrap, and Zookeeper, I am considering these to be done as co-op projects, getting some help with Font, Sprite, and Sounds together. Maybe do some beta testing. Now if someone chooses to assist, please understand, the work will be moved to private email, and possibly be put under non-disclosure until the game is completed. Non-Disclosure protects everyone involved as we intend to sell the games on cartridge. Has to be someone in the United States. Anyone assisting probably get around $5 per game sold, depending on the level of assistance someone provides. I am trying to keep the price low on new games because we know how that can lead into negative content here. The games are being designed to fit onto a 16K ROM cartridge and run on a stock Atari with a minimum of 16K RAM, so we have the option of porting to the 5200 later.

 

I know Bilbo was made many years ago and is why Ladybug was thrown onto the back burner. If I was to do this, maybe we can make a more accurate arcade port. Maybe get someone like Tep392 involved with the game design. Since MouseTrap and Ladybug are also go around and eat dots type game, it may be possible to combine these into a multi-cart and share some programming.

 

LadyBug, Mouse Trap, and Zookeeper was put onto the back burner as I am also currently working a group of these 16K ROM games already. I had not done much work with sprite and graphic design yet. I said, if people really want to see some games get ported, maybe I should seek out some help on putting the game together.

 

There are no demo's, screen shots, or videos, yet, because there is not enough of a game together to do so.

 

 

 

Wouldn't a 32K ROM cartridge work even with going with 16K RAM in the A8 as the default standard? That's what was done with the 5200 back then. Obviously, since then, there's been 512K ROMs produced at least on the 5200 side.

 

And what platforms would these games be ported from if the word is being used literally?

Edited December 16, 2015 by Lynxpro

[Lynxpro]

 

Love Black Widow. The original control scheme was dual sticks, like Robotron: 2084 (perfect for the 5200 using that Space Dungeon/Robotron: 2084 holder). A trak-ball wouldn't work, though it would be perfect for Quantum (was that game ever ported to home consoles?). I don't think it would be too difficult, at least graphics-wise. If Tempest could look good on the 5200, so could Black Widow, so I have to assume either/both would look good on the Atari 8-bit computers.

 

Don't forget, Atari Inc made a dual joystick coupler for CX-40s for A8 Robotron: 2084. Some may prefer that over the 5200 version due to controllers. Atari also designed a 7800 version for the ProLines, but there's only [known to be] 2 in the world in existence.

 

Let's not forget Cloak & Dagger as another Dual Joystick game in the arcade. I'm all for Black Widow. What about Crazy Climber? [i don't think anyone has hacked the 2600 version to support dual joysticks]. And then there's also Karate Champ and the much later Smash TV [there's definitely an NES version and I think a C64 version].

Edited December 16, 2015 by Lynxpro