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OSS-D-Day part 2-MAC/65 >1.02-cart&source now in PD

OSS MAC/65 MAC XL MAC XE source code

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#51 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:15 PM

MrFish you are complete right, my fault in describing. Maybe, it was a little late.

 

Correct, the file versions came first, officially 2.0 and 4.2, then the counter for the carts was resetted to 1.0 and running up to 1.02.

 

FTe just changed date and copyright, nothing else. So everything is correct.



#52 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 4:32 PM

No problem; I just don't want people to get confused reading it, which is easy if they don't know the chronology and versioning.

 

Even the most recent Atari 8-bit FAQ is not clear, as they're calling the v4.20 with the 1982 copyright date a demo version for some reason.

The FAQ also credits Jim Dunion for the disk version, which I don't think he had anything to do with, since DDT was not included with that

version, but rather Bug/65 by McStuff Co.



#53 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:37 PM

This Compute magazine article (from 1983) also states that the disk version was sold with OS/A+, not DOS XL (although the article erroneously states

that OS/A+ version 4.1 is DOS II compatible; It's OS/A+ version 2.1 that's compatible with DOS II). But, as this image (from Atarimania) shows, DOS XL was

substituted for OS/A+ later.

 

It'd be nice if we had some original, clean copies of the disk version(s), which I don't recall seeing anywhere yet. It'd be doubly nice to see a copy of the

original Mac/65 disk version paper manual. I guess that leads me to the question: is that FTe copy of Mac/65 on the Wiki an original, clean copy?

 

mac_65.jpg


Edited by MrFish, Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:54 PM.


#54 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:49 PM

O. K. then let's finalize it here:

 

disk versions: 2.00 and 4.20 ; both are from 1982 from SDL, no matter who changed the copyright, year etc., all content of the program is the same. All version are without DDT and therefore without Jim Dunion.

cart versions: 1.00 ; 1.01 ; 1.02 are all from 1984 from SDL and OSS with DDT and therefore with Jim Dunion from then on always.

 

Then it gets a little bit confused:

 

Have changed the Wiki, so it should be more clear now.

 

https://atariwiki.or....jsp?page=Mac65

 

now in chronological order.

 

1985:

MAC XL CARTRIDGE © 1985 Stephen D. Lawrow

MAC XE Version 3.4i © 1985 Stephen D. Lawrow

 

1986:

XE Version 3.4i © 1986

 

1987:

1987-12-21 Assembler v3.4

 

1988:

1988-01-07 MAC-65 v3.6

MAC/65 from ICD 1988 from Alfred from AtariAge

MAC65/XL Cartridge  © 1988 ICD Inc

mac-xl-master-3.6-1988

 

We can assume very close to the truth, that the carts only were further developed and published.

 

Jim Dunion (who isn't with us anymore): Well, it is true, Jim has developed the DDT and not the BUG/65 (<- we still miss version 1.1), but Jim has done so much for Atari & the community and has paid the highest price possible. He deserves not to be forgotten...

 

But this is just my opinion, of course.


Edited by luckybuck, Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:55 PM.


#55 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:08 PM

You mean this ATR:

 

MAC/65 shareware version with PC Xformer 3.0

 

?

 

No, just the file MAC/65 file is from FTe.



#56 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:37 PM

Obviously whoever sent Atarimania that disk photo has an original sale copy. I wonder if a disk image was made from it and

just hasn't got posted to their site yet?


Edited by MrFish, Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:38 PM.


#57 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:43 PM

Yes, you are right, we have to do it the Farb's way, there is no alternative.

 

Further, in the Article:

 

Atarl Assembler Editor Cartridge And MAC/65 Comparison...

 

But the comparison is done with EASMD...

 

We can make a call for help in this case? Maybe, Paul or Kathleen have one?

 

I really would like to have the source code for EASMD and the Assembler Cart, of course. :-)



#58 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:53 PM

Yes, you are right, we have to do it the Farb's way, there is no alternative.

 

In the case of disks like this it should be easy though; I don't think OSS was using any copy protection. We just need

someone with a valid copy to step forward, or to be hunted down. Probably a post on the main forum is a good start.


Edited by MrFish, Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:54 PM.


#59 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 6:57 PM

Yey, and with the picture above?



#60 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:01 PM

Yey, and with the picture above?

 

Well, a picture is worth a thousand words, but an image of the disk's contents will be worth a thousand more. ;)



#61 _The Doctor__ OFFLINE  

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Posted Fri Jun 15, 2018 9:45 PM

DOS XL was substituted on a number of OSS disks, interstel also did that with their disks, same game put on dosxl disk and maybe some updates..



#62 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jun 16, 2018 4:16 AM

Yes, sure, but the DOS XL case is cleared, on MrFish's site as well as on the Wiki. The main problem are the early OSS years with OS/A+ and Basic A+. Not all updaters are available. McDO patch is missing, BUG/65 1.1 is missing. DOS 4.1(?) updater is missing and the 2 programs for ACTION!, which were published via BBS only. So, still much to do. But I am off for 2 days, now. Wish all a great weekend.



#63 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jun 23, 2018 8:27 PM

Yes, sure, but the DOS XL case is cleared, on MrFish's site as well as on the Wiki. The main problem are the early OSS years with OS/A+ and Basic A+. Not all updaters are available. McDO patch is missing, BUG/65 1.1 is missing. DOS 4.1(?) updater is missing and the 2 programs for ACTION!, which were published via BBS only. So, still much to do. But I am off for 2 days, now. Wish all a great weekend.

 

Please pardon me for not keeping up with the minutiae of the various releases of the years, but I was digging around in some of the pirated disks I got as a kid lo those 30-something years ago and found an early disk copy of MAC/65 and BUG/65 with OS/A+, at least per the DOS boot message. I can post ATRs tomorrow if they might be something you're looking for. 



#64 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Jun 23, 2018 9:20 PM

Yes, great! Thank you very much DrVenkman, it is of major interest. We nearly do all images the Farb's way again with a Kryo or SCP. This one is missing. A picture of the disk would be cool, too. Btw, If you have a disk of that old, you may have further BUG/65 version 1.1? Cool, thank you so much in advance. :-)



#65 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:11 AM

Yes, great! Thank you very much DrVenkman, it is of major interest. We nearly do all images the Farb's way again with a Kryo or SCP. This one is missing. A picture of the disk would be cool, too. Btw, If you have a disk of that old, you may have further BUG/65 version 1.1? Cool, thank you so much in advance. :-)

 

Well, as I said before, my copy of this isn't original. I got it 33 - 34 years ago from a local guy in my town who ran a pirate BBS and disk trading group. He was a married guy in his probably late 30's/early 40's with no kids and devoted most of his time to the hobby. I was a 16 year old nerd. :) I didn't have a lot to trade for stuff so I'd mostly bring him blank disks in exchange for copies of stuff - something like 2 - 3 blank disks for every one disk he'd make for me. 

 

Anyway, here's what I've got. While it's on an OS/A+ disk, BUG/65 is version 2.0.  I don't think the disk versions were copy-protected in any way. In fact, I made this ATR using the OSS OS/A+ DUPDSK.COM program on the disk itself, then tested it. It boots and both MAC/65 and  BUG/65 load under Atari OSb normally as expected. Under an XL OS, MAC/65 loads as normal. BUG/65 gives a garbled graphics screen but SYSTEM RESET will clear the screen and give you the BUG/65 command line. I've got very little experience (basically none) with either one lately, so I didn't do any functional testing. 

 

Attached File  MAC65.atr   90.02KB   22 downloads

 

IMG_0095.JPG

 

IMG_0096.JPG

 

IMG_0094.JPG



#66 luckybuck OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:36 AM

Thanks DrVenkman, it is really of help, because we can compare the file sizes. Your ones do all match, witch the ones we have, further, we can make a hex compare to be absolutely sure. Everything from the beginning od OSS in shrouded in mystery, therefore any trace must be followed. Don't worry about about Bug/65, it has to be patched when used with XL or XE:

https://atariwiki.or....jsp?page=Bug65

Thanks again and have a great Sunday! :-)



#67 MrFish OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:37 AM

Looks identical to the disk posted here by Geezer: Mac/65 2.0 (minus the startup file -- which I would have deleted or renamed myself too).

 

Thanks for posting though.



#68 DrVenkman OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:44 AM

Looks identical to the disk posted here by Geezer: Mac/65 2.0 (minus the startup file -- which I would have deleted or renamed myself too).

 

Thanks for posting though.

 

Ah well. I imaged all of my old floppies that I could find (*) a few years ago but never looked too closed at the contents of all of them until recently again. I didn't see this version mentioned in this thread (with OS/A+) so I thought it might be worth a shot in case it hasn't been seen in modern times. 

 

Anyway, thanks to you and luckybuck - and all the software preservationists out there! - for trying to preserve all these old titles in as complete and original form as possible.

 

(*) I'm convinced the 45 or so disks I found in a box a few years ago for the first time in 30+ years are only about 1/2 to 1/3 of all those I had at one time. I still have some faint hope of finding the rest someday. Maybe there are some hidden gems lost with the rest, though at this point I doubt it. It would be great to find them though. 







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