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New development: GTIA in CPLD


628 replies to this topic

#51 jk40001 OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 5, 2016 9:42 PM

Interested in 1 or 2.

#52 Simius OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 5, 2016 10:40 PM

Another nice addition would be the ability to half shift Gr. 10 pixels to the left so they match other modes.  This is one of those mystery things that is rumoured to be possible on normal hardware but not yet verified.

 

I checked it out. Pixels of GR.10 are not shifted comparing to the other graphics.



#53 Synthpopalooza OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 5, 2016 11:12 PM

@ProWizard
Only through RGB. No impact on the composite.

@MytekControl
That's why I asked about component. I'll try to make it.

@Ricortes
The device uses a clock signal (3.54MHz or 3.58MHz) from MB as a base for x8 PLL multiplier.

@Synthpopalooza
1. Yes. Each shade is OR-ed with the COLBAK register. The device has the same property. If you write #01 to the COLBAK register, each shade will have the least significant bit set
2. No. You want to shift the pixel before decoding. I talk with Rybags about shifting it after.
3. Yes. Text color in hi-res is independent from the COLPF2.
4. Unfortunately, there is no address space for additional 7 color register and not enough resources in CPLD.



 

 

Good news as far as the hi-res color is concerned.  This leads to all sorts of interesting possibilities insofar as scanline and flicker modes.  Especially if artifacting comes into play, blending a different color onto the background can lead to all kinds of color combinations. 

 

Insofar as PMG's, do the priority rules in Antic 4 also apply here when placing them on top of the different colored hi-res pixels?



#54 abbotkinneydude OFFLINE  

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Posted Sat Nov 5, 2016 11:36 PM

Hi Simius! I'd be especially interested in a SECAM version. Will take the PAL version as well (1 or 2 depending on pricing). Thank you.



#55 kenjennings OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 12:06 AM

Demo Video, please?

 

I'm  good for one.   If the price stays under USD $60, probably good for two.



#56 Standard User OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 12:58 AM

Others might have addressed this, but I'm not too technical. Is this additive? Might be a nice trick, if one could add a luminance layer along with the original color signal, even if it means holding one image, while mixing it with either signals from the add-on or from a seperate screen produced by the GTIA itself. You would be blending two screens, which might flicker more, though I guess there might be ways to reduce that, as well.



#57 rayik OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 3:59 AM

Interested if works in 5200



#58 Synthpopalooza OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 1:00 PM

Others might have addressed this, but I'm not too technical. Is this additive? Might be a nice trick, if one could add a luminance layer along with the original color signal, even if it means holding one image, while mixing it with either signals from the add-on or from a seperate screen produced by the GTIA itself. You would be blending two screens, which might flicker more, though I guess there might be ways to reduce that, as well.

 

 

I have played around with this a lot, in 2011 I wrote a series of programs called Interlace Character Editor (ICE) that does full frame font, screen, and mode switches to blend modes and increase color resolution in text modes.  These modes are related to Super IRG (a doubled Antic 4 using only font changes), although they have the drawback of flickering more, especially on PAL Ataris.  However, when used with a modern LCD TV with frame blending, or a monitor with a scan doubler, the flicker is eliminated.

 

To create what I have termed the DIN mode, you would want to cycle the display list from Antic 2 (Graphics 0) to Antic 4 (Graphics 12) every cycle.  In addition, you must cycle the background color PF2 every cycle to ensure that the background color remains static ... when the screen shows Graphics 0 the BG color must be the same as COLBAK.

 

The real fun comes with PF1.  With this new GTIA device, you can now set the chroma for the hi-res characters separately from the background in Antic 2, this allows for more color combinations possible in DIN mode, or any other ICE mode that relies on Graphics 0.

 

The other advantage, comes from the added luminances in non GTIA modes.  It becomes possible to blend two colors every frame using 1/16th of a luminance, which will help reduce the flickering dramatically, especially if using the MIN mode (12+9) in monochrome settings, where you can get theoretically sharper black and white pictures.


Edited by Synthpopalooza, Sun Nov 6, 2016 1:00 PM.


#59 Synthpopalooza OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 1:06 PM

OK, another technical question.

 

With this new device would it be possible to improve the GTIA output when setting the GTIA modes in Graphics modes 1 and 2?

 

As it stands now, when using the GTIA (modes 9 10 and 11) in these modes, screen codes 0-32 (the uppercase range) are invisible, and you get only 10 of the 16 colors in GTIA 9 and 11, and 7 of these in GTIA 10.  Also, one of the ranges only lets you use 2 colors plus the BG.   Ideally, it would be nice to at least be able to display the lower uppercase range, and make use of the PF0 and PF2 colors which are unavailable currently when setting GTIA 10 in Graphics 1 and 2.



#60 Mathy OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 4:21 PM

Hello guys

 

Would additional modes be possible?  Like 640 x 240?

 

Sincerely

 

Mathy



#61 Synthpopalooza OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 6:55 PM

There might be a way using the SHIMC technique. Thus used cycling hires mode by register PF2 between magenta and yellow to induce a 1/2 hires pixel shift. Maybe if thus is done on the PF1 pixels it might have the same effect?

#62 tuf OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 11:48 PM

Sign me up for one when the pre-order happens!



#63 Simius OFFLINE  

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Posted Sun Nov 6, 2016 11:50 PM

There is no PAL/NTSC encoding here, so there is no shift between different colors. Additional modes is a matter for ANTIC, not for GTIA.



#64 Rybags OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 12:05 AM

A shift ability would be cool, that'd allow scrolling to 320 pixel accuracy.  A half pixel shift would allow a sort of software generated 640 pixel mode though of course they'd still be 320 pixels thickness.



#65 tf_hh OFFLINE  

tf_hh

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:48 AM

The new CPLD solution is already working. Features:

The tests takes some time. The decision on the mass production depends on the interest.

 

I´m also interested. :)

 

One hint for a possible mass production version: It should be better to place the GTIA (the real one, which must be placed on the new PCB) at the top of the PCB. Simple reason: This arrangement or parts will not work well in a XL system (800 XL, 600 XL) when all may be full socketed. But when the socket for GTIA is at the top of the PCB, it will fit in all systems (XL, XE, XEG).

 

Jurgen



#66 zeruel85 OFFLINE  

zeruel85

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 8:20 AM

Really interested for using with the 5200!

#67 gearheadtocz OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 9:59 AM

I definitely want one for my 5200. Sign me up!

#68 haightc OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 10:06 AM

Put me down for one as well...   My system is connected to a PVM, so this will be a nice upgrade for me!



#69 iCach0 OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 11:35 AM

I'm definitively interested, very happy to see this is in progress



#70 chadwyk OFFLINE  

chadwyk

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 12:29 PM

Sweet! Came here by way of RetroRGB.  I am interested in this if it works on the 5200!



#71 8bitbill OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 2:28 PM

Put me down as interested as well. Thanks.

#72 twoquickcapri OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 3:28 PM

I would be interested in 2.

#73 funkwad OFFLINE  

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Posted Mon Nov 7, 2016 5:24 PM

Definitely interested RGB for 5200 - yaayy!  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:  :thumbsup:



#74 ndary OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Nov 16, 2016 2:32 PM

i Visited Simius last weekend and recorded a video of his new RGB upgrade, you can see it here:

https://www.youtube....eature=youtu.be

 

anyone volunteer to lend Simius a 5200 unit so we can make adaptation and test his RGB upgrade on that system as well?

there are no 5200 units in Poland.

 

Nir



#75 Philsan OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Nov 16, 2016 3:36 PM

Interested!






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