Coleco strong-arming homebrew publishers and fan sites

[mumbai]

We might look like a compamy, but when you're doing almost everything [...] You better be passionate about it[.]

 

 

Sure, but this motivation (itself potentially driven by many things) does not match in full the earlier claim, which denied any financial component. I recognize that saying something is "all about the passion" feels good and reads well, but it's a bit of a gloss.

[retroillucid]

 

 

Sure, but this motivation (itself potentially driven by many things) does not match in full the earlier claim, which denied any financial component. I recognize that saying something is "all about the passion" feels good and reads well, but it's a bit of a gloss.

 

I'm not saying we're not making a dime out of it

But if you think you're going to pay your mortgage, new car or stuff like that....then you're dreaming

[mumbai]

I'm not saying we're not making a dime out of it. But if you think you're going to pay your mortgage, new car or stuff like that....then you're dreaming

 

 

As I said, "people can bicker over the relative scale of this commercialization."

[Keatah]

Given enough money, the most stubborn homebrews would sell out.

[retroillucid]

 

this x1000.

 

That's because you know what's behind all this works required to make a release happen

Most people only see the game for sale and the asked price

[Omega-TI]

Passion has to be the driving force. If one thinks about it and breaks it down...

 

1) How many freaking hours does it take to end up with a completed game anyway? From basic idea to graphics creation, full scale programming, debugging, beta testing, revisions, more beta testing and revisions... etc.

 

2) If you plan to sell the product in physical form, you have to invest time and money upfront to buy components, cartridge shells, printed circuit boards, boxes, get manuals printed up, then assemble all thosee components, burn the chips, and package everything up.

 

3) After all that, you then you end up spending even more time to marketing the item, answering emails, filling orders, going to the post office, etc.

 

4) Afterwards there is the obligatory after-sale inquiries & questions.

 

I don't know how big the CV consumer base is, but unless the items cost a fortune, the average hobbyist is not even going to come near even 1/2 of minimum wage for all his time, effort and investment.

 

This is one reason why I'm so damn appreciative of the hardware and software guys. They do so damn much for us and our enjoyment of the hobby.

[retroillucid]

Passion has to be the driving force. If one thinks about it and breaks it down...

 

1) How many freaking hours does it take to end up with a completed game anyway? From basic idea to graphics creation, full scale programming, debugging, beta testing, revisions, more beta testing and revisions... etc.

 

2) If you plan to sell the product in physical form, you have to invest time and money upfront to buy components, cartridge shells, printed circuit boards, boxes, get manuals printed up, then assemble all thosee components, burn the chips, and package everything up.

 

3) After all that, you then you end up spending even more time to marketing the item, answering emails, filling orders, going to the post office, etc.

 

4) Afterwards there is the obligatory after-sale inquiries & questions.

 

I don't know how big the CV consumer base is, but unless the items cost a fortune, the average hobbyist is not even going to come near even 1/2 of minimum wage for all his time, effort and investment.

 

This is one reason why I'm so damn appreciative of the hardware and software guys. They do so damn much for us and our enjoyment of the hobby.

 

For Colecovision, you can add: - Taking care of the cartridge mold (repairs)

[Ikrananka]

 

For Colecovision, you can add: - Taking care of the cartridge mold (repairs)

 

Plus doing all this in your spare time while also holding down a full-time job. That's passion!!!

[retroillucid]

Plus doing all this in your spare time while also holding down a full-time job. That's passion!!!

I would've loved to have like $10/hour for the CV version of Sacred Tribe

About 1500 - 2000 hours spent just for the design

 

And I'm not even counting the hours spent on programming the game!

[mr_me]

...

Regarding where RWB is going to get software? No big deal. They will hire out developers, or they will buy-out existing homebrewers. They have more money to play with than any homebrewer I know of. So a buyout is simple.

 

If the oldsters don't wanna do it, well, then, there's always a lackey ready to "Work for Coleco!!" Wow!! How cool is that!

Or you could take it from inactive or defunct companies that are unlikely to sue you.

 

------

Regarding homebrewers making money, I bet if they were to pay themselves for their efforts it would come to less than minimum wage. Creating a new game is alot of work and the audience is small. RWB might realise one day that without game IP there is not much money in Colecovision.

[+frankodragon]

.

[Northcoastgamer]

I respect your point of view

But try making homebrews (and keep going) ....if you're doing this for the wrong reasons, you're going to be burned out in only a few releases

We might look like a compamy, but when you're doing almost everything by hands, plus packing, shipping so many packages

You better be passionate about it

 

 

I've purchased ALOT of homebrews from Collectorvision and others. I can see the PASSION before opening the box and playing!

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

 

I know is been mentioned like 30 times here the whole advertising on their site. But this would fall in fair use, because they are advertising an event that will/may have Nintendo products. It is like used game shops put up posters of Mario Kart or whatever to advertise they have the game. It bugs me that this point keeps being brought out because is Moot.

 

That comment on Kotaku is what I suspected, them not wanting their logo to be placed on games that are infringing on Nintendo properties, because Nintendo very likely would come after them and not the homebrewer.

 

The way they handled the situation with the Facebook page/fan sites. That's another story and I still stand with my point of view.

Was this fair use?

I understand you no longer sell this specific game, and that was probably a wise decision on your part to pretect from potential infringemen, but I have two copies (one loose; one CIB) and it's an awesome 16-bit port.

 

Thor's Quest just didn't have the same impact. Current homebrewers are "borrowing" IP from everywhere but it gets overlooked by parent companies more often than not. Looking back at the label, there is still some stylistic borrowing from vintage SNES cartridges, such as the dark gray button logo which appeared on many games and boxes, as well as the red/purple pinstripe, and the KONG font which was clearly lifted from official artwork.

 

Image in context of the original page it was published on:

https://pikointeractive.com/blog/a-small-update-about-what-has-piko-been-doing/

 

Glad you are doing well Piko. You are level headed and a pretty good voice of reason in the current Coleco quagmire.

[Andromeda Stardust]

The guys holding an Xbox controller in that ad for the Darksides toy guide. Notice how their logo attempts to cover that up. That pretty much sums it up.

Not only that, I know of no 80s console that uses headsets. Maybe you could output audio to a set of headphones from the AV jack or TV, but why the mic?

[Northcoastgamer]

Isn't that an infringement on Microsofts patent or trademark? Using an Xbox controller in a "Coleco" ad? I don't think Microsoft even knows about this but I could be wrong.

[TPR]

Links back to this thread: COLECO IN SPAT WITH COLECOVISION COMMUNITY

 

Wow. Way to go Chris Cardillo! Even other blogs are picking up how pathetic Coleco is in this whole scenario. I would normally say that "any press is good press" and in a roundabout way, all this is doing is drawing attention to Coleco, but I also notice that not a single person has LIKED their Facebook page in the last 24 hours, so this is just flat out "bad press" for Coleco and the totally deserve it!

 

For example, it's clear that this blog "gets it"...

 

you have heard of the ColecoVision here and now in 2017 because it has a band of enthusiasts who have kept it alive. A brand is nothing without its community of loyal fans, we here at Hackaday know this very well because it is you, our readers, who keep us going. Your online fans are the footsoldiers of your brand; they give you free marketing to a huge value, just because they like you. Why on earth mess with that?

 

...but Coleco, which is supposed to be a company run by smart businessmen, right? ...doesn't have a single clue. Seriously, Coleco, this is such a simple concept. How can you be so incredibly stupid?

 

Oh, hey, I'm still waiting for that retraction email, BTW. You know, the one where you can retract everything but the horrible disgusting lewd gross triple XXX rated porno games and that Nintendo license to prove you're not full of shit. Yeah, I'm still waiting on that...

[enoofu]

Just wondering if you could actually do porn on the CV since most sprites look like stick figures much like the the so called Atari Porn games which are basically PG-13 jokes

[Northcoastgamer]

Just wondering if you could actually do porn on the CV since most sprites look like stick figures much like the the so called Atari Porn games which are basically PG-13 jokes

 

 

The adult games in question for the CV are far from stick figures. Detailed sprites of beautiful women. Very well done! I would post some pics from the games but I don't want to offend anyone, I do have some morals. P.S. Don't tell my wife, I bought them with her credit card.

[Swami]

Just wondering if you could actually do porn on the CV since most sprites look like stick figures much like the the so called Atari Porn games which are basically PG-13 jokes

They were obviously done with great care, but are basically one step up from ASCII images, so I would place them in the art category rather than the other, its difficult to say whether the dot matrix level images or PG cover art is less controversial. It is all small potatoes compared to at least the intended effect of Mystic games for Atari 2600.

Edited May 25, 2017 by Swami

[newcoleco]

I'm wondering what is happening.

 

Every day, this thread gets about 2-3 more pages to read. I'm shocked.

 

Some posts are related to the topic Coleco strong-arming fans sites and homebrew publishers. What I'm reading in the late posts are more distractions and "concerns" about each others.

 

I've read the hack-a-day article and its comments section. Again, thanks to some people on Twitter who gave the link to the article.

 

And, I will not suggest to post pictures, Northcoastgamer, but if you do, I promise to not tell your wife as you wished.

Edited May 25, 2017 by newcoleco

[syn]

I still laugh at how prudish the US is. I spent a year in Scotland when I was 6 and looked at page 3 every day

[CPUWIZ]

Anybody post this yet?

 

http://hackaday.com/2017/05/25/coleco-in-spat-with-colecovision-community/

[RupanIII]

Homebrew games have a right to make money. Those are original IP.

 

I have no sympathy for those who just convert MSX games and pretend they can charge a full fare for it and claim somehow it's their work.
It's not.

If you want to do that for free and release the ROM, go ahead.

Otherwise, there's a lawsuit waiting to happen and Coleco has a right not to extend their mark to it since it's their mark.

Regardless of the Coleco mark arguments, the games flagged are not somehow public domain like old novels, they are IP that are released and re released by their owners and honestly OpCode and others are just waiting to get sued.

I love this scene but you gotta know if your argument is valid, and, making a profit at it clouds judgement very quickly.

[Pixelboy]

Homebrew games have a right to make money. Those are original IP.

 

I have no sympathy for those who just convert MSX games and pretend they can charge a full fare for it and claim somehow it's their work.

It's not.

 

If you want to do that for free and release the ROM, go ahead.

Otherwise, there's a lawsuit waiting to happen and Coleco has a right not to extend their mark to it since it's their mark.

 

Regardless of the Coleco mark arguments, the games flagged are not somehow public domain like old novels, they are IP that are released and re released by their owners and honestly OpCode and others are just waiting to get sued.

 

I love this scene but you gotta know if your argument is valid, and, making a profit at it clouds judgement very quickly.

What makes you think I make a profit from what I do?

[TPR]

Every day, this thread gets about 2-3 more pages to read. I'm shocked. Some posts are related to the topic Coleco strong-arming fans sites and homebrew publishers. What I'm reading in the late posts are more distractions and "concerns" about each others.

 

I agree 100% Daniel.

 

The distractions I have moved into their own thread on the CollectorVision forum. Albert agreed that probably should have it's own thread anyway to keep this one focused.

 

As to the other "concerns" all I ask is that perhaps now is not the time to be in-fighting with each other. We just had the one company who could have potentially done the most for this community backstab it's own fans and homebrew supporters and now would be a good time to try to stick together as a community and prove to the corporate greed mentality that we are a respectable group that can band together.

 

Am I saying that people shouldn't be allowed to have opinions or thoughts on certain discussions? Not at all. But maybe a bit more "discussing" and a little less "arguing" couldn't hurt?

 

After all, we are all in this for fun, right?