Bill Loguidice Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 As I've stated before, it remains to be seen how interested people will be in a relatively straightforward streaming box that will play fairly low end PC games (I don't fault them for raising the price $50 above original estimates). The x factor continues to be what value-adds and services they'll offer beyond the basic box. Based on some of the comments I've seen though, they'll at least have a handful of sales from those who "think the case looks cool." I'm not one of the latter, though, myself, preferring sleeker, modern designs to fit into my entertainment center. As was stated by others, considering you can get Xbox One's and PS4's for less, and even late iteration streaming boxes like Nvidia Shield TV and Apple TV 4k for less, it's a very tough market it's trying to compete in (I know I'm more than set in those areas, and also already have a killer PC). As such, I'd say going the crowdfunding route is probably their best bet so they don't overproduce the thing and can at least recoup the costs of their investment. So even if this has a lifespan of a year or two, they still won't lose any money on the venture. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dj_convoy Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 $250 to 300 dollars is laughable. Indiegogo is still somewhat sketchy. This appears to provide very little in the way of utility, and as Bill said, the only thing that separates this from any number of similar items is what kind of value adds are included with it. I implore anyone who wants to buy this because of the Atari logo to think twice. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clint Thompson Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 I find it humorous or really just annoying those defending Atari or taking extreme offense to what we're seeing so far and their reasons for getting immediate blowback: ▪No solid specifications other than AMD ▪No in-house or 3rd-party developed exclusive games ▪Price tag of $250 minimum ▪Most likely to be SteamOS powered ▪Nothing truly unique to set it apart, unless you count the subjectively ugly case design ▪Sounds like an underpowered PC from the onset ▪No pictures of joystick or controllers ▪Funded by Indiegogo with no real investment backed by Atari There's nothing wrong with AMD or Linux. There is something wrong with no specific details, especially in regards to games. The only reason I can see for that is because it's just a PC with Linux and nothing more. There's nothing special about it other than the logo slapped on a rendered box that has yet to materialize and that's only if they get funded. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 As I've stated before, it remains to be seen how interested people will be in a relatively straightforward streaming box that will play fairly low end PC games (I don't fault them for raising the price $50 above original estimates). The x factor continues to be what value-adds and services they'll offer beyond the basic box. Based on some of the comments I've seen though, they'll at least have a handful of sales from those who "think the case looks cool." I'm not one of the latter, though, myself, preferring sleeker, modern designs to fit into my entertainment center. As was stated by others, considering you can get Xbox One's and PS4's for less, and even late iteration streaming boxes like Nvidia Shield TV and Apple TV 4k for less, it's a very tough market it's trying to compete in (I know I'm more than set in those areas, and also already have a killer PC). As such, I'd say going the crowdfunding route is probably their best bet so they don't overproduce the thing and can at least recoup the costs of their investment. So even if this has a lifespan of a year or two, they still won't lose any money on the venture. In some ways it sounds like the sort of "open console" I've always wanted (without having to hack it to get it to run homebrews). I don't think anyone has ever got that right. Raspberry Pi is currently the closest thing, but I assume this will be much more powerful, and being intel compatible will have a much bigger library of games. But is it worth $300 to me... hmmm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Loguidice Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 In some ways it sounds like the sort of "open console" I've always wanted (without having to hack it to get it to run homebrews). I don't think anyone has ever got that right. Raspberry Pi is currently the closest thing, but I assume this will be much more powerful, and being intel compatible will have a much bigger library of games. But is it worth $300 to me... hmmm On the plus side it's cheaper than most traditional Steam Machines (save for some of the clearance "last gen" models), but I suspect it's also not as powerful. Again, to me, potential sticking points for this is the to-date lukewarm reaction to Steam Machines and the ubiquity and low relative cost of mature, comparable options. For the general consumer, there are tons of off-the-shelf options with better support, and for the enthusiast crowd, they have Raspberry Pi's and equivalents to monkey around with. While I suspect they could potentially capture a good percentage of the latter crowd if positioned correctly, I'm not sure how much of the former crowd they can capture. I just don't know how survivable such a niche is, and I again frankly think the case designs are rather polarizing (and I HATE how dust collects in console boxes with ridges, and this is all ridges). It will also be interesting if this will be able to stream 4K HDR, at least from the non-game apps. I think only Nintendo can get away with not having that option at this point because the Switch is only a part-time console. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Bearing in mind what site I'm posting on, Atari grossly overestimated their brand recognition or relevance in this day and age. Too many retro companies run around screaming they're back!! And ready to bring all classics to you with a mix of new content in some ill-defined way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clint Thompson Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Too many retro companies run around screaming they're back!! And ready to bring all classics to you with a mix of new content in some ill-defined way. I just feel like they have no real project manager running this show or even really listen to their core fan base, especially once you see all the negative remarks and comments made across the social outlets regarding the latest news. That in itself will always be their biggest problem, failure to recognize their core fan base. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 Just saying there's a disconnect between the ideal world of what the market wants to happen and the real world of how it already works. --- "The new box will have an AMD custom processor with Radeon graphics. It will run the Linux operating system, with a user interface it’s customizing for TVs. Mac said that the machine will run PC games, but it will also be capable of doing streaming, running apps, browsing the web, and playing music. As far as games go, the machine will run the kind of games that a mid-range PC can do today, but it won’t run Triple-A games that require high-end PC performance." Well, you know, they've been trying PC/TV convergence for like 25 years and still haven't gotten it right. When people do PC things they tend to like a separate experience with monitor and box and being away from the fidgeting that goes along with the family TV. When you do TV you like to sit and eat and get carried away by physically non-interactive content. With the interactivity happening in your head. A traditional movie! Combining the two in a box always means some sort of compromises, well known compromises for that matter. Like tediousness in starting and pausing a movie or messing with the aspect ratio from a player. Like the early days of DVD on PC. It really hasn't changed much. Or doing online banking or messing with Amazon or working with word or excel, you want the more distraction-free environment a computer brings. "Computer time" is always a defined moment of concentration that shouldn't be distracting. As far as "apps" go, well, how many places do you NEED to run time? Isn't a phone and tablet enough? That's two go-anywhere sources already! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 I just feel like they have no real project manager running this show or even really listen to their core fan base, especially once you see all the negative remarks and comments made across the social outlets regarding the latest news. That in itself will always be their biggest problem, failure to recognize their core fan base. I think they may recognize it, but then quickly turn away and massage it into something else when they see how small it is. Maybe we can help them out here. What makes an Atari fan an Atari fan? And what sort of product do they want? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 26, 2017 Share Posted September 26, 2017 I think they may recognize it, but then quickly turn away and massage it into something else when they see how small it is. Maybe we can help them out here. What makes an Atari fan an Atari fan? And what sort of product do they want? This is exactly the type of product I would want. Even if Atari fails to support it with games, it's open design and still useful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercylon Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Seems like there area couple of boxes out there with AMD custom processors and Radeon graphics. From what I understand, people have bought games, accessories, and such things for them. I think the games for one might come in green plastic cases and for the other, in blue cases. Hmm.. .I think they do stream media too, but my memory is fuzzy on this. I think I will just wait for the Polymega. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Wow cybercyclon, thats a really cool idea. Like a workstation, but for playing games. A PlayStation, if you will. I'd buy one of those if it were backed by a powerful company with lots of software support. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrMaddog Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Honestly, they should have used SteamOS and make it a full blown Steam Machine instead of some unknown AtariOS... Even if you can sideload Steam, streaming apps (hello Shield), indie games and even open source emulators at $299 it's still too much for a microconsole. Especially for the same price you can get an Xbox 1 S that does more. I still would like to have an Atari branded modern console (even PC based) but I'll still wait & see. Till then I'm still getting a Steam Link. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDTAY Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Honestly, they should have used SteamOS and make it a full blown Steam Machine instead of some unknown AtariOS... Errm... Why would you want to limit what the OS can do? They said their version of Linux will be open to the user to run what they want on it, including both Steam and the things SteamOS doesn't run. Sounds way better than SteamOS to me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Till then I'm still getting a Steam Link. They've been really cheap lately ... I think I've seen it on (temporary?) sale for $19.99. I know I didn't pay much for mine. Agreed with JDTAY that straight Linux (with whatever branding Atari wants to put on it) is preferable to anything locked down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Honestly, they should have used SteamOS and make it a full blown Steam Machine instead of some unknown AtariOS... Even if you can sideload Steam, streaming apps (hello Shield), indie games and even open source emulators at $299 it's still too much for a microconsole. Especially for the same price you can get an Xbox 1 S that does more. I still would like to have an Atari branded modern console (even PC based) but I'll still wait & see. Till then I'm still getting a Steam Link. The flip side of that is if you make SteamOS the primary, then everything non-Steam needs to be sideloaded. It would be nice if the Steam store is included as an option out of the box for convenience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 How gross is the sideloading? If it's just click and run (like Android's option to allow other sources), it's no big deal, but if it requires hassle equivalent to softmod or jailbreak, ecccchhhh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tidus79001 Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 What I would like to see from the Ataribox is as follow Classing Atari consoles in emulation so that it is easy to play any of their old titles for all the different consoles without the need to own every console Allow homebrew titles to be published to the console Modern 2D games. The specs on this might not be capable of high 3D games but would be more than sufficient for groundbreaking 2D titles. 2D is very compelling and has been making a come back over the past few years. Do these 3 things and Ataribox might actually be successful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 How gross is the sideloading? If it's just click and run (like Android's option to allow other sources), it's no big deal, but if it requires hassle equivalent to softmod or jailbreak, ecccchhhh "Side loading" is just what we old-timers used to call installing For SteamOS's big picture mode, it's just a matter of clicking an icon in the top right, and you will be given a terminal window where you can do what you like. I did notice SteamOS is a very stripped down version of Linux and I had to install libraries that most Linux distro's installed by default to get some of my non-steam games to run. For non SteamOS linux, it's fairly simple to install the Steam app, and it can be run either as a desktop app on in big picture mode (console-like mode) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keatah Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 (edited) What I would like to see from the Ataribox is as follow Classing Atari consoles in emulation so that it is easy to play any of their old titles for all the different consoles without the need to own every console Allow homebrew titles to be published to the console Modern 2D games. The specs on this might not be capable of high 3D games but would be more than sufficient for groundbreaking 2D titles. 2D is very compelling and has been making a come back over the past few years. Do these 3 things and Ataribox might actually be successful 1- this is going to take a lot of time and effort and will end up being a duplication of existing projects like Stella and Altirra and Mame. As with most software, attention to detail is important. And with emulators doubly so because you now have to deal with the details of another computer entirely. Development time is going to be quite lengthy for a new suite of emulators. At least lengthy for emulators that are of the quality and caliber of what we already have. The best bet is to allow loading of existing emulators. 2- this is as easy as ink on the paper. 3- if the developers are willing, then I don't see a problem here either. Edited September 27, 2017 by Keatah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 The best bet is to allow loading of existing emulators. YEAH They're recycling games, they're recycling the operating system, they're passing the cup to even fund this thing. Why would they write emulators from scratch? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zzip Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 YEAH They're recycling games, they're recycling the operating system, they're passing the cup to even fund this thing. Why would they write emulators from scratch? Stella and Mame have been in continuous development for over 20 years. I'm sure they can replicate that in just a few months... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flojomojo Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Stella and Mame have been in continuous development for over 20 years. I'm sure they can replicate that in just a few months... They can just go on down to The Core Store! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raticon Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 (edited) I'm checking in on this once in a while to see if some actual progress was made. I was hopeful and modestly hyped at first.To see that the most infamous Feargal Mac was involved in this really really put me off. Big time.Stopdrop&retro's video about the gameband showed us all the shenanigans that dude has been involved in, basically taking off-the-shelf shit to kickstarter after slapping some cool stickers/logos on it like that stupid Minecraft-USB-bracelet and the horrible GameBand idea.If he sticks to tradition then this will disappoint every sane person around, while providing an ample supply of drama for us to devour and ample supply of hipster-tears for us to drink to our dark hearts delight.EDIT: Oh and why is he so focused on Minecraft and Terraria? He really pushed that stupid wristband piece of ass he went and crowdfunded with "PLAY MINECRAFT AND TERRARIA!!!!" Edited September 27, 2017 by Raticon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+stephena Posted September 27, 2017 Share Posted September 27, 2017 Stella and Mame have been in continuous development for over 20 years. I'm sure they can replicate that in just a few months... Sure, but that's because I work on Stella for only 10 minutes per month. So they should be able to easily duplicate the total work in a month or so. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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