New Atari Console that Ataribox?

[zzip]

$300, (at least some) real wood, Linux. Im actually mildly interested now.

 

how much for one with fiberboard with woodgrain decals?

 

$300 is the price of a PS4, they kept saying this would not be competing with the big three, but at that price it seems to be competing with the big 3...

[JDTAY]

Man, so far only me, Flojo, and vco can appreciate what truly open hardware means. I guess Bill was right when he said this was a niche device.

 

Also, not sure why people were expecting less than $249. We already knew this thing would be powerful enough to run "modern" games, though apparently according to the article not the most demanding ones.

 

BTW, a PS4 may be $300, but a PS4 that actually works, the Pro, is still $400. And don't get me started on Xbone X.

[leech]

 

how much for one with fiberboard with woodgrain decals?

 

$300 is the price of a PS4, they kept saying this would not be competing with the big three, but at that price it seems to be competing with the big 3...

I don't think they said anything about not competing with the big three, others certainly did. They've remained quiet. PS4 is an AMD based system just as this one is said to be...

 

Man, so far only me, Flojo, and vco can appreciate what truly open hardware means. I guess Bill was right when he said this was a niche device.

 

Also, not sure why people were expecting less than $249. We already knew this thing would be powerful enough to run "modern" games, though apparently according to the article not the most demanding ones.

 

BTW, a PS4 may be $300, but a PS4 that actually works, the Pro, is still $400. And don't get me started on Xbone X.

You missed me! I totally understand how much better it is that it IS gong to be an open device. The PS4 is also based on an AMD CPU and Radeon... at least for the most part. Indeed this sounds awesome, though I always have to wonder how good the Radeon drivers are in Linux.

[zzip]

BTW, a PS4 may be $300, but a PS4 that actually works, the Pro, is still $400. And don't get me started on Xbone X.

 

I've had the original PS4 since launch, works great.

 

 

I appreciate the open hardware design too, But realistically, it needs to cost less than the major players to get people to look at it. Hopefully for that price, the hardware is least as powerful as the 4-year old PS4

[Bill Loguidice]

Man, so far only me, Flojo, and vco can appreciate what truly open hardware means. I guess Bill was right when he said this was a niche device.

 

Also, not sure why people were expecting less than $249. We already knew this thing would be powerful enough to run "modern" games, though apparently according to the article not the most demanding ones.

 

BTW, a PS4 may be $300, but a PS4 that actually works, the Pro, is still $400. And don't get me started on Xbone X.

 

That would be me about the original price based on an early preview of the concept. I don't fault them in the slightest for "raising" the price $50. It's a minor bump.

 

I still have my doubts about this running most modern SteamOS Linux games smoothly. There are definitely concessions being made here at that price point. There's obviously a difference between the performance of a generic OS versus a custom OS like you'd find on a Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo system, particularly since the latter can also optimize for all the other components. There's a reason why most Steam Machines START at $100 more than the highest price point of an AtariBox.

 

I also disagree completely about the utility of the cheapest PS4 and Xbox One models. And there's something to be said for a no-compromise console like the Xbox One X, that in truth is only $150 more than the highest target price for the Atari Box. While it's a given it won't play 4K HDR games, we don't even know if the AtariBox will be able to stream 4K HDR video content. So again, not exactly comparable.

[Bill Loguidice]

I appreciate the open hardware design too, But realistically, it needs to cost less than the major players to get people to look at it. Hopefully for that price, the hardware is least as powerful as the 4-year old PS4

 

I don't think there's any way this will be as powerful as a PS4 Slim or Xbox One S, which, by the time of the AtariBox's release could be selling for well under $200 with extras. We can't really compare the performance of custom software/hardware with mostly off-the-shelf software/hardware at the price points we're talking about, particularly since Atari won't have anywhere near the same engineering might or economies of scale working in their favor.

 

I also think it's fair to say these are different target markets, with minimal overlap. I don't see the AtariBox being a replacement for one of the current three consoles from Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo, or likely for any of the current upper end streaming boxes like Nvidia Shield TV or Apple TV 4k. This is likely more in the category of competing with Raspberry Pi-like devices and other low-end Linux-like hardware, along with perhaps appealing to a subset of classic gamers. That's why I think the crowdfunding is not only their best strategy, but also their only viable strategy. This way they can produce exactly what they need and then produce just a little more in modest quantities going forward to meet what will likely be modest post-crowdfunding demand. Wearing my analyst's hat, I just can't envision any scenario where this has any impact in any way beyond that. (and that's certainly not a criticism, just a reality, and it's not even necessarily a bad thing. Niches - even sub-niches - can be profitable to be sure)

[leech]

 

That would be me about the original price based on an early preview of the concept. I don't fault them in the slightest for "raising" the price $50. It's a minor bump.

 

I still have my doubts about this running most modern SteamOS Linux games smoothly. There are definitely concessions being made here at that price point. There's obviously a difference between the performance of a generic OS versus a custom OS like you'd find on a Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo system, particularly since the latter can also optimize for all the other components.

 

I also disagree completely about the utility of the cheapest PS4 and Xbox One models. And there's something to be said for a no-compromise console like the Xbox One X, that in truth is only $150 more than the highest target price for the Atari Box. While it's a given it won't play 4K HDR games, we don't even know if the AtariBox will be able to stream 4K HDR video content. So again, not exactly comparable.

I would be both angry and amazed if it could. We're talking games like Mad Max, that even with the 1080GTX and i7-6700k, it dropped down to like 10fps during the last level (granted that's with every single option turned to maximum). Vulkan support helped a ton here though.

 

I'm thinking any of the higher end games will work via streaming though, so you'd have a system for local games (assuming this has enough local storage for that to be worthwhile) and you could stream over Steam for the fatter ones. I do this with the cheap Steam Link, but it seems to choke out if I enable 5.1 surround sound.

[leech]

 

I don't think there's any way this will be as powerful as a PS4 Slim or Xbox One S, which, by the time of the AtariBox's release could be selling for well under $200 with extras. We can't really compare the performance of custom software/hardware with mostly off-the-shelf software/hardware at the price points we're talking about, particularly since Atari won't have anywhere near the same engineering might or economies of scale working in their favor.

 

I also think it's fair to say these are different target markets, with minimal overlap. I don't see the AtariBox being a replacement for one of the current three consoles from Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo, or likely for any of the current upper end streaming boxes like Nvidia Shield TV or Apple TV 4k. This is likely more in the category of competing with Raspberry Pi-like devices and other low-end Linux-like hardware, along with perhaps appealing to a subset of classic gamers. That's why I think the crowdfunding is not only their best strategy, but also their only viable strategy. This way they can produce exactly what they need and then produce just a little more in modest quantities going forward to meet what will likely be modest post-crowdfunding demand. Wearing my analyst's hat, I just can't envision any scenario where this has any impact in any way beyond that. (and that's certainly not a criticism, just a reality, and it's not even necessarily a bad thing. Niches - even sub-niches - can be profitable to be sure)

My thoughts on this? Why couldn't they be as powerful as the PS4 Slim? Sounds like they're both engineered by AMD over Atari themselves. Which is most of the design for the PS4 (not sure how the slim is any different than the original except a quieter fan and a bit slimmer? The Pro being the faster one, just like the Xbox One S, right?) Granted you are right in that SteamOS is probably not as optimized the BSD(?) based PS4. Especially for Radeon/AMD.

 

What I wonder is A) is this thing going to be silent (which is a HUGE advantage over the PS4 I currently have) and B) is it going to come bundled with a Steam Controller that has wood grain? That'd be epic!

Edited September 26, 2017 by leech

[Bill Loguidice]

My thoughts on this? Why couldn't they be as powerful as the PS4 Slim? Sounds like they're both engineered by AMD over Atari themselves. Which is most of the design for the PS4 (not sure how the slim is any different than the original except a quieter fan and a bit slimmer? The Pro being the faster one, just like the Xbox One S, right?) Granted you are right in that SteamOS is probably not as optimized the BSD(?) based PS4. Especially for Radeon/AMD.

 

What I wonder is A) is this thing going to be silent (which is a HUGE advantage over the PS4 I currently have) and B) is it going to come bundled with a Steam Controller that has wood grain? That'd be epic!

 

I'm just wondering aloud about some things.

 

There's a reason why the original PS4 generates so much heat, and that's in a much bigger case than what we're getting with the AtariBox. I just don't know how much can really be crammed into the AtariBox case with obvious concessions to running reasonably quiet (in its favor, it does not need the optical drive space or electronics). Heck, even the Roku 4 (which support 4K) has a noticeable fan noise if you get too close to it.

 

I'm also not sure how much of an actual relationship Atari has with AMD. I don't think AMD is in the business of becoming a design partner with a company of limited resources like Atari. I mean, they are turning to crowdfunding for production after all. I think the more likely story is that one of the chips AMD has already worked on/is working on has been agreed to be used in some type of quantity, pending funding. Maybe that quantity is enough to make some minor tweaks to help with the performance needs of a box like this.

 

Anyway, it's still very early, and I guess until we get hard target hardware specs, there won't be any way to estimate best case performance here. At this time, I'm skeptical we'll see a match for even launch PS4 and Xbox One performance, let alone what Sony and Microsoft will be carting out as their low end (and likely cheaper than AtariBox) models late next year. Even if it doesn't, though, I don't think that matters for the sub-niche I believe this will appeal to.

[zzip]

 

I don't think there's any way this will be as powerful as a PS4 Slim or Xbox One S, which, by the time of the AtariBox's release could be selling for well under $200 with extras. We can't really compare the performance of custom software/hardware with mostly off-the-shelf software/hardware at the price points we're talking about, particularly since Atari won't have anywhere near the same engineering might or economies of scale working in their favor.

 

I also think it's fair to say these are different target markets, with minimal overlap. I don't see the AtariBox being a replacement for one of the current three consoles from Sony, Microsoft, or Nintendo, or likely for any of the current upper end streaming boxes like Nvidia Shield TV or Apple TV 4k. This is likely more in the category of competing with Raspberry Pi-like devices and other low-end Linux-like hardware, along with perhaps appealing to a subset of classic gamers. That's why I think the crowdfunding is not only their best strategy, but also their only viable strategy. This way they can produce exactly what they need and then produce just a little more in modest quantities going forward to meet what will likely be modest post-crowdfunding demand. Wearing my analyst's hat, I just can't envision any scenario where this has any impact in any way beyond that. (and that's certainly not a criticism, just a reality, and it's not even necessarily a bad thing. Niches - even sub-niches - can be profitable to be sure)

 

The XB1, PS4 and Ataribox all have customized AMD internals. My understanding is AMD will customize these chipsets to the customer's specs. Obviously Sony and MS have much higher volumes. But on the other hand, those consoles are 4 years old now, maybe 5 by the time this things releases. They should be able to produce a box with similar raw power at that price by then

 

Now I realize that the PS4/XB1 benefit from streamlined APIs and optimized software which is why they often outperform PCs of their class. But if the Ataribox has that kind of raw horsepower, it will still be able to run a number of decent games from the Steam store.

[Keatah]

I do know that AMD has an internal push to be more open to custom designing chips from existing building blocks. But I also believe atari is still name-dropping AMD.

 

I don't see AMD running around saying they got a contract win for ataribox.

[zzip]

 

I don't see AMD running around saying they got a contract win for ataribox.

 

If you're AMD, why would you? You highlight your biggest name customers

 

If it's PC based, it is most likely AMD, I'm not even sure that Intel has a CPU/GPU SoC design for these types of set-top boxes/ gaming consoles. If they did, it would most likely cost more.

Edited September 26, 2017 by zzip

[JBerel]

I'm still waiting for them to prove they have even 3D printed a single box before I start wondering what's supposed to be inside. I see scam written all over this.

[Keatah]

Who is writing the software suite for this?

[Flojomojo]

Those photos are almost certainly just renderings ... nothing Atari will ever be that pretty in real life.

 

I've attached their latest announcement, thanks for making it available so we don't have to subscribe. The various Coleco debacles have taught us that these things often vanish into the ether, so it's important to preserve them if we want to talk about them at a later date. Ataribox: Brand new pics & info!.pdf

 

The price seems realistic. If it were $30, it would be scoffed at as a toy, like the old AtGames Flashbacks. The going rate for that stuff is $80 (Atari Flashback 8 Gold, Sega Genesis Flashback, Retron 77, Nintendo SNES Classic Mini), so it follows that a more open system will cost a little more.

 

I agree with Bill, a "partnership" with AMD seems unlikely. They'll purchase a product from them, maybe with some minor customization if interest warrants it.

 

as well as being a great gaming device, Ataribox is also a full PC experience for the TV, bringing you streaming, applications, social, browsing, music, and more

 

 

They will need to explain why their "PC experience" is better than, say, your own PC.

 

 

you can access games you've bought from other content platforms (if compatible with the OS and HW)

 

Sounds good if true. I think OUYA said something similar.

 

 

 

There will be tons of classic Atari retro games pre-loaded, & current titles from a range of studios (we'll start talking titles very soon, stay tuned).

 

Asteroids, Adventure, Missile Command, yeah yeah, we know. Also, "very" is the least very adjective in the English language. Their imprecision speaks loudly.

 

 

We're launching Ataribox on Indiegogo this fall (read: pretty soon).

 

Read: weasel words. What comes first, "very soon," or "pretty soon?"

 

 

 

 

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Ataribox: More pics and news!

Thanks for your patience & support so far.

Today we're sharing brand new pics, more on what's inside, & more info on launch.

The pictures we're sharing today are of first prototypes. Everyone that has seen Ataribox first-hand loves it, feeling the Atari 2600 influence, while still being a modern design.

Ataribox will be powered by an AMD customized processor, with Radeon Graphics technology. It'll run Linux, with a customized, easy-to-use user interface. This approach means that as well as being a great gaming device, Ataribox is also a full PC experience for the TV, bringing you streaming, applications, social, browsing, music, and more.

Most TV devices have closed systems and content stores. Linux lets us be more open; you can access & customise the OS, & you can access games you've bought from other content platforms (if compatible with the OS and HW).

There will be tons of classic Atari retro games pre-loaded, & current titles from a range of studios (we'll start talking titles very soon, stay tuned).

We're launching Ataribox on Indiegogo this fall (read: pretty soon). To reiterate why: we want you, the Atari community, to be part of this launch. We want you to have early access, grab special editions (& pricing) and to have you as active partners in the rollout of Ataribox. We want you to be part of the story.

We plan on shipping late Spring 2018, with an expected price range of $249-$299 (depending on specific editions & memory configurations).

Hope you like what we are sharing today, and are ready for lots more in the weeks ahead.

The Ataribox team.
PS: To confirm what many of you have asked: the Wood Edition is made with real wood
PPS: Please continue to let us know what you think via our social channels; and also please like, follow, subscribe, and share as much as possible!

Copyright © 2017 Atari, Inc.,, All rights reserved.


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[Keatah]

 

If you're AMD, why would you? You highlight your biggest name customers

 

If it's PC based, it is most likely AMD, I'm not even sure that Intel has a CPU/GPU SoC design for these types of set-top boxes/ gaming consoles. If they did, it would most likely cost more.

 

The experience presented by Intel's NUC style of box brings energy efficient computing to the masses. It's essentially a laptop in a box sans the monitor, battery, and keyboard. You get those yourself according to the way you're setting up at home.

 

I personally believe an iPad + iPhone (which everyone has today) in conjunction with a PC brings the best of everything. And not only being the best, it allows for great versatility, have a couple of separate devices. Throw in a real game console if you want the occasional millennial-style game.

 

What I'm saying is that putting all this functionality into ataribox is redundant and limiting.

 

I really hate it when marketers think of a solution then invent a problem. Living by that philosophy means the customer has to always be uneasy until money is spent on their product.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Keatah

[Flojomojo]

I'm still waiting for them to prove they have even 3D printed a single box before I start wondering what's supposed to be inside. I see scam written all over this.

 

 

I think that's unfair. Coleco Chameleon had an injected molded case based on the existing Atari Jaguar molds, and they even sold them to people in this forum. They had NOTHING inside, that was a scam/lie.

 

In my opinion, it can't be a scam until they start asking for money.

[Flojomojo]

I really hate it when marketers think of a solution then invent a problem.

 

At least crowdfunding has a way of protecting everyone from this. If no one wants it, they won't make any, and no one gets hurt or ripped off.

[Flojomojo]

Who is writing the software suite for this?

 

No idea, but Feargal Mac (awesome porn name!) is the "creator and general manager of the Ataribox at Atari" and appears to be living the Atari lifestyle.

 

[+Nathan Strum]

Absolutely no mention of whether or not I can use my Atari SpeakerHat™ with it.

 

Clearly, they don't understand marketing.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Nathan Strum

[The Historian]

I do know that AMD has an internal push to be more open to custom designing chips from existing building blocks. But I also believe atari is still name-dropping AMD.

 

I don't see AMD running around saying they got a contract win for ataribox.

 

 

The article with Feargal mentions him working with "FMTwo Game Inc." which is Atari Gameband. Which did have AMD Reps in vids.

 

The images in the latest newsletter are not renders, but physical.

[leech]

Who is writing the software suite for this?

Valve / Debian?

[Keatah]

Calling it an "atari lifestyle? That's kinda pushing it.

 

I don't know what kind of lifestyle atari is trying to conjure up.. It's pretty vague and nebulous at this point. But.. When I talk to people about Atari, anyone who knows Atari, it's always the company from the 1970's and 1980's. They launch into a nostalgia-filled mini-rant about how they used to play it after school on mom's TV set. They may remember a game or three. And they may bring up the arcade, too, if the conversation lasts long enough. Back then we knew "Atari" as a blanket term, like Kleenex, to mean anything and everything videogame related. To play "Atari" meant sitting in front of that 70's television with a console and a hand controller, with carts strewn across the floor.

 

Pac-Man & Space Invaders are the only two arcade games ever recalled instantly. On the home front it might be Tank-Combat, or Breakout, or Centipede. Mario and Donkey Kong get honorable mentions. Discussing anything else requires one of the conversants to be a genuine classic gaming enthusiast.

 

I also want to make mention of Commodore 64. Everyone, I mean frakking EVERYONE remembers that little rig, and they always bring that up. The blue boot screen is a sleeper icon. They may also interject Apple II if the discussion involves the classroom. Then it's Oregon Trail, Oregon Trail, and nothing but Oregon Trail! But let us not stray from the topic at hand.

 

---

 

The one advantage their marketing department has is archival memory vs noobs. Things like documentation, video, and even MAME + emulators combined together can show anyone how things were. The marketing department can pour over material like that and remake it into a form that fits today's culture. What's old is new, especially when people only live to 80-90 these days. All the Atari kids of yore are all grown up now. And we're quite content to simply carry the memories and good times with us. Spiffed up with a couple of emulators or perhaps the genuine 40 year old system and its plethora of cartridges. We can swing both ways, emulation or real. One thing we don't like is half-assed recreations though. Remakes in the modern sense are dumb to us.

 

So that leaves the marketing department with the task of programming the young kids of today with that "atari lifestyle". They have to compete for kids' time against god knows how many other platforms, countless other regurgitations of the same material, and social media! And social media is the biggest combatant ataribox has to face. And yet it cannot partake in social media itself. Ohh technically it can, it's just a computer, but real social media requires a mobile platform and/or a rich environment like a PC - for YouTube editing for example. I fear this like the early convergence devices like WebTV. It just has "more" of whatever..

 

---

 

The point of all this is to say that atari has to build brand recognition. Because, right now, the market is crowded as all heck and everyone knows about SonyPS, MS-Xbox, Apple iPhone, and to lesser extents, Android + Steam.

[OldSchoolRetroGamer]

Well with these recent Email updates and articles appearing get ready for several new threads on "ATARIBOX" from newbies and people who do not search the forums thinking they are first to break the news to our community! "

 

https://venturebeat.com/2017/09/25/ataribox-runs-linux-on-amd-chip-and-will-cost-at-least-249/

I am hoping the factor that wakes people to reality is over pricing and the Indigogo RED FLAG (to little actually comes of most Indigogo funding and many just bolt with everyone's money without delivering anything) , the fact that "ATARI" could not even use Kickstarter instead is very telling, we will have to wait and see, priced right I would consider it just for the case and styling (knowing full well support is likely to be lame) - overall ever since earlier talks about PC technology I have to say this is about EXACTLY what I was expecting, in other words a low powered PC hardware box with Linux core that streams with apps etc. THIS IS LIKE A THOUSAND OTHER STREAMING BOXES you can import from cheap Chinese sites like AliExpress / DX . com etc. It seems about the only thing that will set it apart (IF IT EVEN COMES TOGETHER AS THEY CLAIM) is the addition of bundled Atari games (emulated like on Android on I am guessing) and a 2600 theme / styling. Even just as that could have been a fun impulse grab at the right pricing level just for collectors purposes but it is sounding like that styling along with the logo / licensing and bundle of Atari games is exactly why they seem to feel they can waaaaaay over charge for this. If that is the case I think I will just get a similar device at a 3rd of the cost and simply slap on some woodgrain MAKtac, install my own emulated Atari games and call it a day. Sure it may not be "official" but it will be something likely almost as good if not better.

TRY TO REMEMBER FOLKS THIS IS NOT REALLY "ATARI" IT IS SIMPLY A NAME / LICENSE / IP acquired by people looking to bank on your love and nostalgia for the original company. Some, actually many people always seem to want to believe that it is something more, it really isn't. And hey that is fine, even I would buy into something like this merely for that Atari logo if it were priced at an impulse buy level but it does not look like that will be the case so imho buying into and supporting such crap tells these companies how gullible and accepting we are to buy into ANYTHING and ANY PRICE, vote with your dollars folks and send the proper message.

[Keatah]

The article with Feargal mentions him working with "FMTwo Game Inc." which is Atari Gameband. Which did have AMD Reps in vids.

 

The images in the latest newsletter are not renders, but physical.

 

What's an atari gameband, some sort of FitBit fitness thing? And I never heard of FMTwo Game Inc? No don't bother, I have big boy pants and I can look it up!

 

Renders have gotten so good I wouldn't know the difference between them and photos unless I spent time looking real close, which I'm too busy to do. So I just assume everything is photographic trickery till I actually see it on the store shelf. And even if they're real case mockups, what's going inside there and how is that being created? With what philosophy? What's their target audience?

 

One nice aesthetic touch is the elongated/rectangular orange-yellow lights in the front, they used to be dots. I like it better this new way.