AtGames Officially Unveils Legends Ultimate Home Arcade (full-size machine)

[Bill Loguidice]

 

Can you give us any new info????

 

Nothing new I'm afraid other than retailers seem quite pleased with the in-person demos.

[Bill Loguidice]

We're starting to finalize the improved arcade machine (you'll all be happy with the new iteration of and additions to the control panel!) and I was hoping to pass on some more info for the team to prioritize over the next few months. Basically, what you, as retro gamers, really want. This can be something about the build quality, the types of games you're after (obscure stuff, hits), features, etc. More or less your wishlist as a discerning and experienced retro gamer. Thanks!

[negative1]

It's hard to say at this point since you've addressed pretty much everything except the price.

 

$500-$1000 [with a lot less games]

$1000-$1500

$1500-$2000

 

are the 3 i see the most for cabinets like these from other retailers.

 

 

features already mentioned

-----------------------------

1) monitor is fine

2) controls are fine

3) 400 games - don't know the selection besides tetris

4) features like scanlines, are fine

5) resume, rewind, and savestates are fine

 

availability is all thats left.

 

i don't care about lit marquees, side art, control panel art, or any frills like that.

most generic multicade ones look terrible, and need to be replaced anyways.

 

 

later

-1

Edited January 10, 2019 by negative1

[Bill Loguidice]

It's hard to say at this point since you've addressed pretty much everything except the price.

 

$500-$1000 [with a lot less games]

$1000-$1500

$1500-$2000

 

are the 3 i see the most for cabinets like these from other retailers.

 

 

features already mentioned

-----------------------------

1) monitor is fine

2) controls are fine

3) 400 games - don't know the selection besides tetris

4) features like scanlines, are fine

5) resume, rewind, and savestates are fine

 

availability is all thats left.

 

i don't care about lit marquees, side art, control panel art, or any frills like that.

most generic multicade ones look terrible, and need to be replaced anyways.

 

 

later

-1

 

Thanks for the feedback. There are plenty of features left to be unveiled, both in terms of hardware, software, and extended functionality. In terms of pricing, you'll be quite surprised if that's what you're thinking.

 

I'll definitely log your note about the artwork. Hopefully it's not revealing too much too soon, but we're looking into options for at least partial custom artwork post-sale (at least making it available through some type of partnership).

 

Any other thoughts/requests/demands and I'll be happy to pass them on. Whatever would make it a must-purchase for you personally, once of course you're assured of build quality, performance, etc.

 

 

[ONLYUSEmeFEET]

Perfect emulation, along with including the best versions of each game (ex. Arcade 1942 instead of NES 1942) is all I'd ask for to be very interested. Also do not include terrible bootleg shovelware titles just to increase the game count. I understand a $20-30 product not being able to emulate everything perfectly (though third generation games should be perfect at this point), but a full sized arcade machine that costs (likely) over $300 MSRP? Flawless emulation is a must.

Edited January 10, 2019 by ONLYUSEmeFEET

[Flojomojo]

Modular components, standard interfaces.

 

Make it so that if something breaks, I can fix it.

 

Make it versatile enough to last for many years, not be some paperboard novelty that gets thrown out when some proprietary part goes bad.

[Bill Loguidice]

Thanks, guys, keep the requests/desires coming!

[negative1]

Perfect emulation, along with including the best versions of each game

(ex. Arcade 1942 instead of NES 1942) is all I'd ask for to be very interested.

Also do not include terrible bootleg shovelware titles just to increase the game count.

I understand a $20-30 product not being able to emulate everything perfectly (though third generation games should be perfect at this point),

but a full sized arcade machine that costs (likely) over $300 MSRP? Flawless emulation is a must.\

This is by far the most unreasonable request I have ever seen for a product.

 

Nothing is perfect. There is NO such thing as 'perfect' emulation.

 

There are many, many, 'MANY', bugs, glitches and issues with actual arcade units, games, and rom revisions.

 

So, NO, don't even try to ask for that.

------------------------------------------

 

As far as game count goes, as long as it's easily split between arcade and consoles, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

Why and how would they license shovelware games, but then until we see the game list, you won't know.

 

Also, don't forget, many times the home version surpasses the arcade versions of games in feature, settings,

graphics, and playability. [Look at the latter versions of Ms. pac-man which far eclipse the arcade version, etc]

 

Modular components, standard interfaces.

 

Make it so that if something breaks, I can fix it.

 

Make it versatile enough to last for many years, not be some paperboard novelty that gets thrown out when some proprietary part goes bad.

It is using Arcade parts, so that makes its replaceable and standard.

 

"Each game plays just like at the arcade thanks to an authentic control panel that features a matching

set of premium joysticks and six buttons for two player fun, as well as a professional trackball controller."

 

As far as the quality, you get what you pay for. Cheap -> cheap parts, Expensive -> better parts, one would think.

 

later

-1

Edited January 10, 2019 by negative1

[+bcombee]

My biggest request would be great versions of the core controls from classic arcade machines: joystick, trackball, and spinner. Arcade1Up really messed up with their sub-par spinner and low-resolution screen for the Atari vector game model.

[negative1]

My biggest request would be great versions of the core controls from classic arcade machines: joystick, trackball, and spinner.

Arcade1Up really messed up with their sub-par spinner and low-resolution screen for the Atari vector game model.

They haven't said anything about a spinner, but all the other parts are arcade or professional quality as I mentioned above.

later

-1

[Bill Loguidice]

We'll definitely discuss more about the additions to the control panel in the next official updates.

[ONLYUSEmeFEET]

This is by far the most unreasonable request I have ever seen for a product.

 

Nothing is perfect. There is NO such thing as 'perfect' emulation.

 

There are many, many, 'MANY', bugs, glitches and issues with actual arcade units, games, and rom revisions.

 

So, NO, don't even try to ask for that.

 

As far as game count goes, as long as it's easily split between arcade and consoles, it shouldn't be a problem.

Why and how would they license shovelware games, but then until we see the game list, you won't know.

 

Also, don't forget, many times the home version surpasses the arcade versions of games in feature, settings,

graphics, and playability. [Look at the latter versions of Ms. pac-man which far eclipse the arcade version, etc]

 

You're taking my suggestion and use of perfect too literally. I want the bugs present in the original arcade code. I'm requesting that they use something like MAME with decent hardware to ensure MAME is running as smoothly as it can.

 

Having shovelware on AtGames IS a problem, though. No matter where they lie, reviewers always dock points on their product when they're included. And with game titles like Mr. Balls, can you really blame them? It's like including a free poop emoji headrest with a new 2019 Lexus. It might be free, but it only serves to cheapen the overall experience.

 

As for home versions, that's a big disagree from me. If it's in an arcade cab, I want the arcade game. Ms. Pac Man Genesis has better gameplay, sure, but the graphics and resolution are awful compared to the original. Ports back then were give and take.

Edited January 11, 2019 by ONLYUSEmeFEET

[Flojomojo]

Agreed. No NES or 2600 versions, please. No Meatloaf Rotation, either.

[Bill Loguidice]

While I agree there should be no "filler," I think the strategy of including more than just arcade games (even if those are the stars) is reasonable enough. After all, you'll likely want to use the various types of controls with all kinds of console and PC games.

[negative1]

You're taking my suggestion and use of perfect too literally.

I want the bugs present in the original arcade code.

 

I'm requesting that they use something like MAME with decent hardware to ensure MAME is running as smoothly as it can.

 

Having shovelware on AtGames IS a problem, though.

No matter where they lie, reviewers always dock points on their product when they're included.

 

As for home versions, that's a big disagree from me. If it's in an arcade cab, I want the arcade game.

Ms. Pac Man Genesis has better gameplay, sure, but the graphics and resolution are awful compared to the original. Ports back then were give and take.

You mentioned perfect emulation several times, I was just pointing out there is no such thing.

 

Also, even the latest version of MAME doesn't really run games all that well.

 

It is a bloated emulator that is a jack of all trades, and master of none.

Its great for casual games, but not for anything recent or specific types of games, even if you have the latest processor.

 

Atgames and other developers have better emulators, if you look

at Microsoft Gameroom, which actually runs the Liberator roms without resetting at level 19/23 unlike MAME.

 

Also, the latest versions of Atari Vault have way better emulation than MAME does for almost every game [haven't tested them all yet].

 

--

As far as home versions go, if they can't get the rights to Ms. Pac-Man arcade, or other ones, I would happily accept the superior

home versions.

 

Many arcade games have killscreens and other problems. The latest rom verions in most compilations remove that limitation.

I know a lot of the Namco games do, like Pac-man, Galaga, Dig Dug, etc.

 

==

 

One more request, I don't know if it was mentioned or not, but adding dipswitch options is crucial, because I want

acces to ALL the settings, and features, and a way to reset them to default also.

 

later

-1

Edited January 11, 2019 by negative1

[sracer]

While I agree there should be no "filler," I think the strategy of including more than just arcade games (even if those are the stars) is reasonable enough. After all, you'll likely want to use the various types of controls with all kinds of console and PC games.

Sounds like there are 2 different issues being discussed...

 

The first is not using console versions of arcade titles... that because it is an arcade cabinet, the arcade version should be used.

 

The second is, that there should be a good reason for the inclusion of those 400 games, not just as a marketing bullet point. I don't think anyone was saying that console games should NOT be included. I think if 110 of those 400 games were Atari 2600 from the Flashback 9, there would be an accusation of THAT constituting shovelware.

 

From a customer's perspective, I think ATGames is a bit too ambitious in their endeavors. The FB9 is terrific IMO with just a few minor additions/tweaks to make it the ultimate flashback system. But with the FB9 paddles still MIA and other rough edges around the other ATGames offerings, this arcade cabinet product seems to be very ambitious. I hope to be pleasantly surprised however.

 

On a side note, I think that ATGames did a far better job with the FB9 than those other guys did with the C64 Mini.

[twalk]

Just to chip in my 2 cents...

 

1) Nostalgia is big. Really big. And for me at least, it's linked more to the cab artwork than anything. I really didn't need an Arcade1Up cab, because I can play all those games by other means. I ended up with 3 of them anyway, mostly because of the looks (and price, of course). Generic cab art with a potential post applied wrap really just doesn't do it. (I just about ran out screaming when I saw the art on the cab in Microcenter. Definitely don't be those guys.)

 

That said, it doesn't need to be the artwork from a real cab, just something that invokes nostalgia. I saw glow in the dark Ghostbusters cab artwork recently on Reddit and that looked great. There's a quite a bit of "Flynn's Arcade" / TRON cab artwork out there that looks great. Of course that's another license fee for you guys to pay, but that's the kind of thing that would trigger a buy impulse from me and even get me to pay a bit more than otherwise. 6-7 different great pre-order cab artwork choices and you should be good

 

2) Weight / size: If I can't reasonably move it around myself, then I'm probably not going to buy it

 

3) Controls: A1U is now reported for the next cab batch being releasedå to be using the better of the 2 different joysticks that they were using (deemed by most to be "decent enough") and a happ trackball. They're upping their game and are setting a new base for what it takes to compete

 

4) Screen: Needs to be bigger than the standard 17" A1U screen. Something closer to 4:3 is preferable (since it makes a much better experience for vertical games played on a horizontal panel). TV quality screen is definitely preferred over the TN screen in A1U

 

5) Games: Arcade games! Console games were meant to be played on a TV screen and playing them on a cab is just *weird*...

 

6) Access: Any bugs should be able to be fixed / updated by an internet download to flash drive then updated from that. I'd really also want full-ish access to difficulty settings and so forth (by really any means)

 

7) Game selection: I've got a 2000+ game Pandora's 6 Box. It pretty much sits there, because of both decision paralysis (so.. many.. games..) and the problem that to select games you have to scroll down a list of 2000+ games without any organization and with a ton of garbage games cluttering things up. My brain just goes into rebellion just thinking about it. You definitely need organization

Edited January 11, 2019 by twalk

[ONLYUSEmeFEET]

You mentioned perfect emulation several times, I was just pointing out there is no such thing.

 

Also, even the latest version of MAME doesn't really run games all that well.

 

It is a bloated emulator that is a jack of all trades, and master of none.

Its great for casual games, but not for anything recent or specific types of games, even if you have the latest processor.

 

Atgames and other developers have better emulators, if you look

at Microsoft Gameroom, which actually runs the Liberator roms without resetting at level 19/23 unlike MAME.

 

Also, the latest versions of Atari Vault have way better emulation than MAME does for almost every game [haven't tested them all yet].

 

--

As far as home versions go, if they can't get the rights to Ms. Pac-Man arcade, or other ones, I would happily accept the superior

home versions.

 

Many arcade games have killscreens and other problems. The latest rom verions in most compilations remove that limitation.

I know a lot of the Namco games do, like Pac-man, Galaga, Dig Dug, etc.

 

==

 

One more request, I don't know if it was mentioned or not, but adding dipswitch options is crucial, because I want

acces to ALL the settings, and features, and a way to reset them to default also.

 

later

-1

 

MAME has some exceptions, but for the most part, games run great with it. I also doubt Game Room of all things runs better than MAME. Both it and Atari Vault also have input lag, and I believe neither support paddles/trackballs. Neither should be brought up when talking about accuracy.You likely need to use older versions of MAME for certain games, because it can be indistinguishable from a real arcade. How many times were high scores obtained on MAME falsely accepted by Twin Galaxies on their arcade hardware leaderboards? And not including kill screens present in the original arcade? No way. Maybe add "cheats" to fix kill screens, but leave the original code alone.

 

Re: Filler games. To clarify, I'd love a high game count. And if it fits in the arcade genre, throw in both console versions of arcade games and console-only games. All I'm saying is that Arcade games should be given priority and AtGames' "Bonus Games" need to be retired.

Edited January 11, 2019 by ONLYUSEmeFEET

[negative1]

MAME has some exceptions, but for the most part, games run great with it.

I also doubt Game Room of all things runs better than MAME.

it's not some exceptions. virtually NO game runs on MAME exactly.

even galaga and galaxian STILL can't emulate the stars in the background correctly.

robotron 2084 only runs correctly on some versions.

every game is HIT and MISS, and even with the most powerful processors, still don't run correctly.

 

i've been using mame since it first came out, until now, and there are still many, many problems.

 

you can't make some blanket statement saying it runs 'great' mostly.

 

 

there's no way, depending on the majority of the games, they'll include a powerful

processor to run games at a speed that MAME could handle, so that's a moot point.

they will probably run a custom frontend, and other software.

 

Both it and Atari Vault also have input lag, and I believe neither support paddles/trackballs.

Neither should be brought up when talking about accuracy.

official releases, with official licensed ROMS.

 

MAME HAS NEVER HAD THAT. IT HAS NEVER HAD LEGAL ROMS WITH IT.

WHY WOULD they use it now.

 

Atari Vault and Gameroom have more accuracy, period. I've played all the games, each version,

each ROM, each variation.

 

One mistake that was in Gameroom, was Tempest had 'white' levels in Tempest, instead of invisible levels,

that was fixed with Atari Vault.

 

I've been on the leaderboards near the top of almost every Atari game on gameroom, and a lot on Atari Vault,

so I have no idea about input lag, or anything else, because i've never noticed it on the PC or xbox one.

 

I've also played the corresponding games in multiple MAME versions, no comparisons with the official releases.

 

You likely need to use older versions of MAME for certain games, because it can be indistinguishable from a real arcade.

How many times were high scores obtained on MAME falsely accepted by Twin Galaxies on their arcade hardware leaderboards?

And not including kill screens present in the original arcade? No way. Maybe add "cheats" to fix kill screens, but leave the original code alone.

i don't care about twin galaxies, what does that have to do with anything.

 

I do WANT the FIXED ROMS. Not many people can get to the killscreens, so unless you can get to them, you won't notice the difference.

I can get to them, which is why I prefer the fixed versions.

 

later

-1

Edited January 12, 2019 by negative1

[Goochman]

Im sure through this thread its been mentioned but for me the following is important:

 

1. Owner serviceable - You can glue/lock down anything Atgames puts inside the box - but make it so I can change or add things as necessary(dont hard wire the monitor to your box)

2. Doesnt need to be "arcade" quality cab - but it should be 50% of that strength and also be normal height. Doesnt need to be as wide or have the same depth - just tall enough for an adult to use. I didnt get a 1Up due to its small form factor

3. Reasonable price

4. Atleast 10 games, but if we go back to #1 I can change things

5. Make game settings configurable - 1Up messed up big time here as the trackball settings were terrible and could easily be fixed via config, but its not available so hacking the ball out is the only fix

Edited January 14, 2019 by Goochman

[Bill Loguidice]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I've passed it on.

[Goochman]

What does the rest of the peanut gallery here think of having a USB port available to connect an alternate controller? Not sure if thats feasible or not?

 

One other item Bill is to have 'mappable buttons' - the Defender layout for 1up is terrible, but could actually almost be arcade authentic with all the buttons on the rampage cab - unfort whomever picked the layout butchered it. Allowing users to map buttons their way would be great.

[twalk]

What does the rest of the peanut gallery here think of having a USB port available to connect an alternate controller? Not sure if thats feasible or not?

 

One other item Bill is to have 'mappable buttons' - the Defender layout for 1up is terrible, but could actually almost be arcade authentic with all the buttons on the rampage cab - unfort whomever picked the layout butchered it. Allowing users to map buttons their way would be great.

 

 

I think that Bill mentioned something about a usb port for other controllers. Personally however, I really don't see the point. If I remember right, it's going to have a dual fightstick layout ( X2 joystick + 6 buttons ) and a trackball. That combo handles the great majority of games. Most of what it won't support are spinner based games (which are ok to leave out of something like this) and 3-4 player games (which could work.. sort of.. except there's no place to set the additional controllers, so they'd have to be hand held). Also, the more you'd use a different controller, the more I'd question why'd you'd bother to buy this cab because it seems to me you'd be better off just playing on a computer then

 

If AtGames has someone who knows what they're doing mapping the buttons, we're probably fine with a static button map. Also, if the cab is updatable, then they'd be able to fix it (usb update) if they blow the layout (unlike A1U). A game like Defender will always have issues on a control panel made for other games. However it shouldn't be too bad on this, because you should have in a 6 button grouping the fire/thrust on right, hyper + smartbomb in the middle, and reverse on left

[boggis the cat]

This can be something about the build quality, the types of games you're after (obscure stuff, hits), features, etc.

I’m not sure if it’s been mentioned, but a setable 4/8 way restrictor for the joystick would be good. That would also require an easy way to access it, ideally.

[+GoldenWheels]

Modular components, standard interfaces.

 

Make it so that if something breaks, I can fix it.

 

Make it versatile enough to last for many years, not be some paperboard novelty that gets thrown out when some proprietary part goes bad.

 

Agreed, the more plug and play fixes/upgrades can be, the more fun it will be to mess with it too.

 

And for GODS SAKES make sure AtGames doesn't use HOT FREAKIN GLUE (in addition to screws) to mount the sticks. Seriously, 1UpArcade even glued over the joystick screws!!!!