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Mode 7 Style Graphics on a standard "Atari ST"

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#1 philipj OFFLINE  

philipj

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Posted Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:44 PM

Hi... I just purchased an "Atari ST 520" off of ebay for the first time "Ever"; I never really owned one before so I am a first time of one of these machines. I was wondering has anyone ever programmed Mode 7 style graphics on the Atari ST? I've posted picture of a demo of mode 7 on a Sega Genesis and wonder if anyone ever tried to pull it off on the ST yet? It sounds like a neat little project for somebody.

 

 


Edited by philipj, Tue Apr 16, 2019 1:52 PM.


#2 fedepede04 OFFLINE  

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Posted Wed Apr 17, 2019 3:28 PM

its not as simple, the Sega Genesis had alot of hardware options to help, like hardware sprite,  more color on the screen, also think to remember it had hardware zoom.

 

to describe the plane ST.

it have a video chip, that in low resolutions had 16 colors out of a palette of 512 color, and 320x200 pixel, and that was it.

so all you wanted it to do you need to code for it. even a simple task, like putting a character on the screen(i know it had rom call for this, but they was still soft coded). 

Sprite also need to be soft code. so the video shifter on the ST was very simple.

 

i would even say, that many of the 8bit computer had more advanced video chips that the ST.

but they was lacking in resolutions, color on the screen and cpu speed.

 

the STE did improve little on the video chip, it expanded the palette to 4096 but it still only 16 color on the screen

but it also add the blitter to help move memory from one places to an other places. (plus it have some other functions like scrolling the bit planes).

it also had hardware scrolling. 

 

so you really need to know the hardware on the ST/STE to do wonders, this is also the reason in my book, why many of the new things that have been done on the ST/STE, the last couple of years,  is even more impressed 



#3 philipj OFFLINE  

philipj

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Posted Wed Apr 17, 2019 5:11 PM

Thanks for the response... For a minute I didn't think I was going to get one; was thinking I might be asking the wrong question. lol

 

its not as simple, the Sega Genesis had alot of hardware options to help, like hardware sprite,  more color on the screen, also think to remember it had hardware zoom.

 

 

 

Yea I was thinking about that considering that the Genesis was created 4 years ahead of the Atari ST... Great little system; I think it was the Sega CD that had hardware zoom.

 

to describe the plane ST.

it have a video chip, that in low resolutions had 16 colors out of a palette of 512 color, and 320x200 pixel, and that was it.

so all you wanted it to do you need to code for it. even a simple task, like putting a character on the screen(i know it had rom call for this, but they was still soft coded). 

Sprite also need to be soft code. so the video shifter on the ST was very simple.

 

 

The last few days I was at www.archive.org looking at some books on the ST hardware as well as "Wikipedia" and finally get some kind of rough understanding about what made the ST hardware a little more affordable to buy than the other competitor computers during its heyday, which were the IC chips inside the ST that really kept the whole system "GLUE(ed)" together versus a typical standard system, which I thought was a bit clever and a bit risky at the same time.

 

 

i would even say, that many of the 8bit computer had more advanced video chips that the ST.

but they was lacking in resolutions, color on the screen and cpu speed.

 

 

 

Jay Miner were responsible for those 8bit chips... Enough said. lol Yea I think it would've been cool if they had put a better version of a GTIA in the ST; although I think the ST video SHIFTER coupled with the 68000 CAD and 3D applications. The ST seems to shine a little bit with racing games like "San Francisco Heat" that uses pseudo 3D style graphics and such.

 

the STE did improve little on the video chip, it expanded the palette to 4096 but it still only 16 color on the screen

but it also add the blitter to help move memory from one places to an other places. (plus it have some other functions like scrolling the bit planes).

it also had hardware scrolling. 

 

so you really need to know the hardware on the ST/STE to do wonders, this is also the reason in my book, why many of the new things that have been done on the ST/STE, the last couple of years,  is even more impressed 

 

 

What's the name of your book and where can I find it? I'm always looking for new material on the ST versus the dated material I've been reading. 



#4 fedepede04 OFFLINE  

fedepede04

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Posted Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:27 PM

Hi.
 
for the lack of answers, i think it could be, because its an hard question to answer, without getting too technicall :D
 
i also saw it the other day, and thought maybe an other would answer it, but tonight when i saw no other had answer it.
 
then I thought that i would give it a try, even if my English knowledge are not the best :)
 
 
 
maybe i read one of your answer wrong, but the Sega was made in 1988, and the ST was first showed at a Exhibition in 1984 so the Atari was 4 years ahead of the Sega.  
 
 
 
overall i think that the ST was a great machine, it was not made to be a gaming machine, but to compete with the Apple computer. 
 
so it was not so important that it did not features all those co processor.
 
I also think that was the reason for the 72HZ high resolutions on the ST, to make it a good allaround computer.
 
I have ones read that the blitter was intended to be in from the first ST computer but it was delay or something(but i don't really know) but you can get ST with a socket for the blitter, that you could add one later.
 
also some said that they also had planed for a another sound chip, (again don't know is true).
 
in the end i think, it was more important to get it finish and out of the door, instead of waiting for something that was not so important, for what it was intended for.
 
but the reason why i did loved the ST back then and probably also now, is because its very simple to code on. 
You did not have to learn a lot of the co processors like you had on the Amiga, it was very straight for.
 
me and one of my good friends both had MSX prior, and we both used to coded on the MSX. 
 
i chose the ST and he chose the Amiga, but the Amiga was to complicate so he stop coding, and he first started again when we moved on to the PC.
 
but the ST also had some advanced over the Amiga. and today you can do stuff on the ST/STE that you are not able to do on the Amiga 500, 1000, 2000, due to its hardware limitations.
 
 
sorry no book here, but when i am coding i use "Atari ST internals" to look up stuff, and if you are thinking on, starting coding on the ST and if you run into some problem, just post you question, and we will try and help you out.
 
and last congratulations with your Atari, i hope it will bring some inside and joy to the Atari :D

Edited by fedepede04, Wed Apr 17, 2019 6:29 PM.






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