nurmix

Interesting. Thanks for the information. Yes, I kept the replacement PIA in the computer, and all is fine now 👍🏼 And the Sys-Check 2.2 is working great as extended RAM. I’ve been checking out quite a few newer demos and games that require extra RAM. It’s a good preview before I install U1MB 😁 What other extended RAM test do you recommend?

That’s absolutely true. The end of the cable that connects to the controller can be removed and opened up, exposing the wires. And you can remove the entire cable from the console and the controller pretty easily as well. But if your goal is to REPLACE the original coiled cable with a straight / longer cable (and re-use the connectors at both ends of the original coiled cable), you should be OK with the controller end, although it takes patience and some ability with tools, and wire cutters / strippers if you are planning to thread all 9 wires of a new cable into the connector and reassemble it. But yes, no soldering is required. The end of the cable with the motherboard SIP connector will be more of a challenge. In my experience, there are a few variations of that connector. Some can be pulled apart, but some are sealed / molded plastic. You will likely destroy those when attempting to get them apart. Some can’t be taken apart at all, you would have to cut the wires, then try to push the pins out with an extractor tool. If you’re lucky, you might even be able to reuse those pins. Most likely you’ll need new ones, which will also require a crimping tool and a pin insertion tool. But yes, no soldering required.

Well, I had another interesting problem with the same 800XL that Sys-Check helped me get going a few days ago. My childhood 800XL that I referenced earlier in this thread, seemed to be working fine once I replaced that weak USB power supply. Its RAM passed the Sys-Check diagnostic, running in a loop for over an hour. And it passed all the Super Salt tests, also running on a loop for about an hour. So I decided to set up Sys-Check as RAM expansion (an awesome feature, I have to say), to try out some demos and games that require more than 64K. One of the things I ran was the eXtended RAM Test 0.21.0 from Satantronic, to check the 512KB RAM that's on the Sys-Check board. I'm running it from an AtariMax 8Mbit flash cartridge. When I ran it on my other 8-bits (three other 800XLs, and one 130XE), the test sees the Sys-Check as 32 banks / 512KB. Running the extended RAM test on those machines showed the RAM on the Sys-Check was good. But when I loaded up the extended RAM test on my childhood 800XL it showed 33 banks / 528KB!? And running the test resulted in a garbled screen shortly after starting it. WTF!? So I did more troubleshooting, re-seating and swapping of ICs with one of my other 800XLs. I already knew the 6502C was good, as I replaced that when I first took this 800XL out of storage last month, and it was powering on to a black (and sometimes white) screen. But here's what else I did: I configured Sys-Check to use its version of Atari OS, and also tried it using the Atari’s own OS - no change Replaced my original ANTIC (C012296-31) with an XL/XE ANTIC from a 130XE (C021697-31) - no change Swapped the MMU from another 800XL - no change Removed, cleaned, reseated POKEY, GTIA, PIA - no change Removed OS and BASIC, swapped in ones from another 800XL - no change I also tested all the removed chips in another 800XL - they were all fine on that computer The extended RAM test still showed 33 banks / 528KB!? And running the test still resulted in a garbled screen shortly after starting it. Grrr! So I started searching and reading the forums for some clues, and I stumbled on a thread from @Beeblebrox about his trials and tribulations with a 600XL and a red screen. The next day I removed the PIA, and put in one I got from Best Electronics, and ran the eXtended RAM Test again, and this time, it correctly showed 32 banks / 512KB, and the test ran all the way through - multiple times - all good. Just to confirm, I put the suspect PIA in another 800XL, loaded the extended RAM test, and now that 800XL was showing 33 banks / 528KB. Yep, definitely a bad PIA. I never knew they could cause issues with extended RAM. I'm not sure what other trouble it may have been causing, as the computer seemed to be running fine otherwise. So there you go, another tale of a bad PIA. And I wouldn't have found it without trying to test Sys-Check's RAM, and reading the post from @Beeblebrox. Some pictures of the problem below...

I know there are some variations in Raspberry Pi PSUs. What specs do you prefer, given the power requirements of the computer, Sys-Check 2, and the other assorted SIO devices most of us are also plugging into our 8-bits these days. 27w 5.5A 20w 4A 15w 3A

Thanks for that information. Since I have a spare [newer XL/XE] ANTIC, I might as well use it.

Last week was the first time I've tried one of the USB power solutions. I'm going back to my OEM Atari power supplies for now. The ones I have are all tested good, and no, none of them are "ingots" And just to keep the thread on topic, for those wondering... Sys-Check 2.2 can even help diagnose a failing power supply (although I don't think @tf_hh will be adding that to the official features list, it did for me).

Thanks, @flashjazzcat. I'm in full agreement that the Sys-Check is a fantastic device. I've only owned it a few days and it indirectly helped me identify a power supply issue. I was so puzzled because using that same USB/Apple power supply with 5 different 8-bit computers this past weekend, all but my original childhood 800XL passed with flying colors. So a power issue wasn't on my list of possibilities until I did some additional testing after the replies to my post here. I have to assume that my childhood 800XL is drawing more power than the other 8-bits I have. Could be down to aging capacitors. I haven't checked them yet, but I put together a full kit of all I need to do the entire board. I just need to go through them all with my ESR meter (I have one that tests in-circuit, which greatly simplifies the job) and change out accordingly.

Thanks, guys. Yes, very strange behavior indeed. So... I swapped the original ANTIC (C012296) with another ANTIC (C021697), but got the same results. Then I plugged in an Atarimax flash cartridge that I put some other testing tools on (additional RAM tests + Super SALT), but the 800XL wouldn't boot the cartridge - and it worked fine yesterday (scratching my head more here). Then I unplugged the Sys-Check, and plugged in my FujiNet to run some tests I have on the SD card, but now the FujiNet wouldn't boot (it also worked fine yesterday). And I noticed it was taking the FujiNet power light longer to come on than usual when powering up the 800XL (similar to how the FujiNet powers on when connected to a 400/800). I then connected a different 800XL, plugged in the Sys-Check, and it ran the RAM test, but went to a black screen right after that completed - before 'rainbow of colors' and OS test. Obviously at this point I'm really puzzled, but am starting to suspect a power issue, since this second 800XL passed all tests over the weekend, using this same power supply. So... I just started using one of the USB power adapters, along with an older Apple iPad charger (the bigger ones that output 5.1V @ 2.1A). All my 8-bits have been working fine with it for the past week. I did a quick test with my multimeter, and it was showing a steady 5.12V output without a load. I decided to plug in my old Atari power supply again (one of the big two-tone beige and black models), and suddenly both my original 800XL and the second one I was testing worked perfectly, and passed all tests in Sys-Check, multiple times. And on my original 800XL, it passed with both the older ANTIC and the newer ANTIC. No issues with cartridges, no issues with FujiNet. So weirdly, it came down to the power supply that worked fine all last week, and had no problems with all the other 8-bits I tested with Sys-Check over the weekend. I guess with the additional power draw of the Sys-Check, especially when combined with my original 800XL (which may be a bit more power hungry than the others I own?), the Apple PSU wasn't able to cope with the demand, so it caused all sorts of weird issues with the computer. And now the Apple PSU is flaky with just the computer by itself, so it's done. Maybe the power supply was on it's last legs, and the additional demands I was placing on it were enough to take it down. Anyway, all seems good now. But this does bring another question up... is there any real advantage/disadvantage to using the older/newer ANTIC in an 800XL? Should I keep the original older ANTIC in my childhood 800XL, or switch to the XL/XE ANTIC? Does the MOSTEK RAM care which ANTIC is on the board?

So I got my Sys-Check 2.2 last week, and I'm very happy with it. I've already tested a 130XE, and four 800XLs. But I ran into something that's got me scratching my head a little... All but one of the 800XLs passed the tests. The one that didn't, is my original 800XL I got in 1983. It has been 'dead' since around 1988, but I recently dug it out of storage, and after troubleshooting and testing, it turned out the 6502C was bad. I popped in a spare, and all was well. It's an early Hong Kong 800XL, with everything socketed. It also has the older 400/800 ANTIC (C012296), and not the XL/XE ANTIC (C021697). I understand that means is uses 7-bit memory refresh as opposed to 8-bit. The RAM chips on this 800XL are all MOSTEK (MK4564N-12 / C060612-009). Every other RAM tester I have tried shows them all good. I have no stability issues with the computer, running games or applications. I've used it with FujiNet, SIO2SD, SIDE3, it all works as it should. No crashes, everything is OK. But according to Sys-Check, ALL RAM is bad, every position. So I have to wonder, is this down to the older ANTIC / 7-bit memory refresh, and the RAM is actually OK?

A carefully used heat gun, slowly unwinding the coil, and patience should get you the result you’re looking for 😁 I have seen some 2609 cables that are tightly wound, probably from them getting twisted up or pulled too far then shoved back into the console that way over the years.

Replacing the old / hard rubber side buttons of the original controller with side buttons from a Flashback controller would help with the ‘feel’. Other than that, I can’t say I notice much of a difference between original (2609) controllers and Flashback controllers - as far as responsiveness; assuming the internal circuit matrices are in good shape, and there aren’t any wire or connectivity problems with them.

Hey, Jeff. So I’m clear… you want to keep using the original 2609 controller, but replace the coiled cable with a straight (longer) one? That’s not something I’ve done, but it wouldn’t be that difficult. The issue, as 8bitwidgets mentioned, is that you would need to retain the Mylar circuit matrix ‘pressure pin’ connector that’s inside the controller. So the top part / end of the coiled cable would need to be reused and spliced into the straight cord (which involves soldering). And I don’t have spares of those connectors. Then there’s the issue of connecting the straight cord to the Intellivision motherboard. The 2609 controllers use a 9-pin inline SIP connector to attach to the board. I use these on my Intellivision 1 (2609) Flashback adapter cables. So you would have to open up the console to replace the controller cables. I don’t know if you’d want to do this yourself? If you’re OK with that, then you’d need to open up your console, remove your existing controllers, and send them to me. I’ll replace the cords - reusing your circuit matrix connectors - and send them back. Then you’d just have to plug them in, route the cables, and reassemble. If you aren’t comfortable doing all this, then you could send me the console and I could do all the work and send it back.

A couple additional photos of diagnostic test results from the seller (maybe someone here on AA?)

Here’s mine, picked up on eBay earlier this year. No embossed or stamped date code. It came with 16K of (cased) RAM. I don’t know if that was the original configuration, but that’s how it was sold (I’ve since upgraded it to 48k using a modern aftermarket solution). I haven’t had a chance to open it all the way up for inspection and cleaning, it is fully functional though. I get 243 when I PEEK (65528) - saw this mentioned in an early post when I was catching up on this thread.

Thanks for continuing to make these! I just placed an order for one (we've emailed about it already).