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SF3: 3rd Strike (Arcade) Real Bout Fatal Fury Special (Arcade) Panzer Dragoon Saga (Saturn) ...and I was playing Valkyrie Profile (PS1) but'll probably need to restart at least the 2nd Chapter over again. Also need to pick back up Gunstar Heroes (MegaDrive), that game was insanely fun.

I'm like six years late asf on this one lol. But it sounds pretty interesting, will keep an eye on it.

Lol I don't see why not; isn't there a hellish-looking Sonic knockoff on SNES? Granted, an actual SMB on Genesis would need to do some of the graphical features (like Mode 7) in software, but all the same some of the Sonic stuff on SNES would have to be done in software too (or via specialty chips on a cart to handle those kind of things).

Wow, what a completely misinformed post. The point of games like Gunstar Heroes was to push the envelope in terms of action, basically an evolved Contra if you will (appropriate given Treasure was mainly made up of ex-Konami devs). The game's got some of the best visuals of the generation and did some really cool stuff w/ level and boss design concepts that were rarely seen before or since. I mean, I kinda suck at the game but from the little I've played it's actually one of the more approachable games of its type, certainly more approachable than say Alien Soldier (which sounds like my cup of tea but I'd have to take a solid afternoon to learn the kinks inside and out to get the most out of it). Unique weapon system, nice maneuverability options and some fun levels, that's quite a good deal right there for games. Sounds like you like more slow-paced games that push story ahead of twitch gameplay which is cool, but do understand those type of games weren't that mainstream at the time and not everyone prefers them nowadays, either. Also at least for me a lot of them like the JRPGs take a lot of time to get up and going, which doesn't fit my lifestyle atm as I usually gravitate to pick-up-and-play games that don't need to take a few hours to get interesting. Though that said, obviously not every JRPG is like that, just like how not every twitch-style action game is some mindless button masher or w/e. You really aught to expand your looking into the lesser-known MegaDrive games b/c there's a lot of neat surprises on the system, just like w/ SNES. I like both systems a lot and they're among my favorites in general, but MegaDrive seems to get a bad rep for being the "Sonic and arcade ports" machine when there's lots of original content on it too in a lot of different genres, even some strong micros/PC ports too. But I blame the lazy retro gaming Youtubers and streamers for starting that misconception (and well SEGA just being lazy when it came to most of those Genesis collections in general).

Actually on the note of OutRun 2 Coast to Coast, they could simply remove the Ferrari license but keep the rest intact. Worked for Outrunners. Or they could re-license the brand which isn't out of their domain since iirc SEGA holds the GT license atm (at least in Japan). I guess technically, the same could be done w/ Cool Spot and TMNT, but those games used even more antiquated technology and therefore it'd likely be harder to redo art in them to remove the licenses. And in the case of TMNT, they already have a recent arcade release from Raw Thrills so probably if anything we already kind of have a precedent for current and future TMNT beat 'em ups that might not exactly be the classic Konami game but are essentially spiritual followups like the current one. Oh yeah; Iso Zone shut down their downloads section a couple days ago apparently. Thanks, Nintendo! (/s)

Yeah it's stuff like this that REALLY makes me dislike Nintendo as a corporation many-a-times. The presence of these kinds of sights is one of the few ways most people who don't have hundreds/thousands of disposable income can play some of the obscure games that have been lost to the sands of time. Not everyone has room in their home for an original arcade cabinet, either, let alone the shipping and freight costs that come with such a purchase. I understand Nintendo wants to protect their IP, but exerting this kind of pressure also in a way is them forcibly speaking on behalf of other companies, some of whom aren't even active anymore, or aren't platform holders, and don't have much a reason to touch some of these games ever again for commercial re-releases either digitally or physically. It reeks of a sense of entitlement and arrogance, a sort of false pride, not to mention it yet again kind of dicks around w/ their fans considering Virtual Console is practically a non-starter on the Switch atm. Also yes I understand Nintendo didn't *actually* issue a cease-and-desist to Emu, but the fact is they've been on a rip of recent doing this to other sites so that would naturally instill a sense of trepidation to other sites such as Emu, knowing there's a 90% chance they'd be next in line. If anything, I wouldn't mind these sort of sites simply removing all Nintendo-published content off their archives anymore, and probably also remove downloads for games that tend to see regular re-releases gen-over-gen in well-known anthologies, which'd include IP like Sonic and King of Fighters, etc. But as long as companies like Nintendo continue to do this kind of crap, it means less chances for younger gamers getting into the retro scene to play some otherwise amazing games that have only been growing more and more obscure as time passes on, meaning they'll just end up playing the same stuff over, and over, and over, and over again. There's SOOOO much more to retro gaming besides Mario, Sonic, Pac-Man etc. but the harder it is for regular people to easily access some of those rarer, lesser-known gems in ways that don't cost them a month's rent or more (especially considering 9/10 times the companies releasing retro games just keep picking the same 5% of games endlessly), the more things risk becoming completely monotonized and...boring. At the very least, knowing how slow Nintendo's being w/ Virtual Console plus causing stuff like this to happen w/ Emu, has turned me off from investing in a Switch for the foreseeable future. Guess it'll be exclusively PC gaming for me for now.

Yeah, the 1UP stuff seems pretty neat but while it'd be really cool to see that w/ modern (not sure exactly what's powering those but I'm guessing it's Pi-level hardware; not like any of those games need even a modern i3 to run well) I worry the pricing for that would shoot well north of $300 unless they cheapened out on build quality significantly. ...That's if we're talking about new releases in the format, not anthologies of classic games.

This is what I've been thinking the whole time. Hell, SEGA aught to consider doubling-down on arcades globally as well, I've been impressed w/ Scarlet Dawn and World Driver's Championship stuff so far. Raw Thrill's been consistent and getting IP like Halo in FECs is a big deal. And osme big potential big markets for it too. Exa-Arcadia is looking pretty good right now, too. Now if someone could just make a complete package and put some real muscle behind it, it's not out of range of expectations arcades could blossom again globally even if not at the levels of the '80s.

These specs sound pretty bad for the price. Could've at least gone w/ LPDDR4 and maybe eMMC over microSD (almost sure the flash is microSD) and an Intel i3 7101E which is only $117 and that's w/o bulk pricing, and has a better iGPU while also being embedded. Honestly the only problem there would probably be the TDP; even downclocked it'd still hit pretty high for a handheld so they'd have to do some Switch-like docking/undocking feature to control what power's used in which state. But then if that makes it impossible, quite honestly it just doesn't sound worth it b/c the 610 iGPU just doesn't have enough juice for most PC games even on the lowest settings, so that selling advantage of "uncompromised PC gaming on the go" is just completely dead.

Funny thing is I remember my dad getting me that Madden Sports Genesis package in '95 and I almost immediately started looking for other games to play xD. Haunting, Global Globetrotters, then eventually picking up stuff like SF2 Champion Edition and Gaires. I'm glad I diversified my gaming pickups so early, otherwise I'd probably be like some of the drones online that seem to think all Genesis is = Sonic and sports games.

Lot of really good games in that list; there's also some game called Devastator on it that seems pretty cool. I have a lot of catching up to do on SCD honestly (Saturn, too).

Lol well, yeah like I was saying earlier, Sonic's been a mess of a series post-Dreamcast overall, some solid entries notwithstanding. I think it's probably two factors; one being Sonic Team hasn't taken the time to settle on mainstay game mechanics and build on those, the other being that Sonic Team just...seems tired of making Sonic games imho. Wouldn't mind if Sega gave the team a break to focus on another series, maybe a new Chu Chu Rocket or Burning Rangers even. Also they need to stop with the bs deadlines :/ Understand where you're coming from w/ the Dreamcast; those things would certainly play a factor. But I don't think those are the only sort of people a Dreamcast-mini or HTPC-like system w/ Dreamcast emulation on it would appeal to. Again, when I see a lot of stuff about Dreamcast from others, a lot of it seems to be either people who got into collecting for it after it left the market (so maybe, mid-2000s or such), and then you've got even younger people now who've grown up playing those games and others on emulators, and discovering the library from there. So that's already two groups outside of those who had one in its heyday and didn't feel "burned" that such a product could potentially appeal to. The latter in particular, a lot of the growth in appealing to those sorts comes, again, with consistency as a 3rd-party for the major consoles, iterating on some classic IP and creating new ones, and the such. And just building that rapport and clout in the overall mainstream gaming sphere, something Atari failed to do imo. Also I agree you'd still have some of the people who had it back then that'd still feel burned and not want a new mini or the such, but it's been almost 20 years now; kinda feel most of that lot have had enough time to get over those feelings and let bygones be bygones, they'd probably be interested if the price were right. You can apply the same w/ Atari fans who probably felt jipped w/ the Jaguar; most of them have moved on and would check out a Jaguar-mini if done right. About an Atari plug-and-play based more around the computers, I was thinking more in terms of it just being a standard PC device, priced accordingly etc. The difference being that you could have those GUI options emulating the old OSes, and everything being pre-installed. For people wanting to use those to code or such, maybe just provide that as a software package and they can write the software to control certain parts of the OS functions (there's a video program I use called PotPlayer that lets you shut down and set timers for your PC through the program itself; never used it, but the feature is there, and if that can do it I don't see why this hypothetical program couldn't allow for similar stuff), type commands to access files and folders, etc. Basically, a software package simulating and OS so it'd have to be able to view pictures, read certain documents, view video etc. in the program, but w/ a GUI based off old Atari computer OSes you can change on-the-fly. Not quite the same as using one of the old machines exactly, but close enough and a realistic option. You buy the HTPC and that stuff comes inside and installed, baked into the cost etc., or just buy it for your PC at a fair price and use it there. The HTCP'd still have the form factor of an Atari computer to go give it some value.

Yeah, that Sega HTPC idea sounds pretty neat actually. Since it wouldn't be marketed as a console, it wouldn't bring any of the expectations people generally have w/ consoles like "Where's the 1st party content?", "How good are the graphics?", etc. Just make a solid box OEM-style, put Windows 10 on there, maybe work out some terms w/ different emulator devs (or better yet, since M2 I think is doing the Sega Ages collection on Switch, hire them for emulation purposes) and load it with games. Most importantly tho, give it a console-like aesthetic, a variety of them, innards stay the same but the exterior ranging from different systems. Maybe even add an actual cart slot on the MegaDrive/Genesis versions to play actual carts. But they'd HAVE to have the arcade games on board, too, and not just the usual picks. My only caveat there is that, technically, HTPCs aren't that upgradable. Stuff like RAM are usually locked in place, so if they could make components like that user-upgradable it'd be neat. To be perfectly honest, the more I've learned on Atari the more I feel a HTPC-like approach would've done a lot better. Just position as that instead of a gaming console, market the computer side more. Maybe a custom GUI suite emulating their classic computer OSes in visual style, but with modern user comforts. There's probably the issue of marketability b/c 2600 is just so ubiquitous w/ the company's image it seems, but seeing as how the VCS is already virtually a HTPC, marketing it as a HTPC would have saved them a lot of the social media headaches they've gone through, especially if they chose to model the design after one of their computers instead of the VCS (or have that and the VCS as model options differing in looks only).

The other systems from them both are more obscure for sure compared to how widespread names like PlayStation and NES are globally, I agree, but I'm usually pretty surprised with how much positive WOM Dreamcast gets online. It may be mostly related to gaming circles, but I often see lots of YT vids for example that are generally very positive on it, and some of those getting up to hundreds of thousands (a few even millions) of views and lots of comment engagement. There seems to be a whole generation of younger people getting into that system, and kind of seems like the same's happening with Saturn, albiet not quite the same degree (for starters, collecting for it is a pain in the ass). Atari-wise I don't see a lot of that same spread but impressions from some w/ the Jaguar seems to have gotten more positive in recent years. I don't seem to see their computer line being dogged the same way as the non-2600 console side, but I'd assume the reach there is limited. I agree tho they need to do something software-wise to make VCS more appealing; they don't have a lot of options but teams like Llamasoft might be their best bet.

Regarding the combination system, you're right, the look and feel of having a physical replica under the tv is a HUGE part of it, but I still think it could both work and likely make for an easier sell. All they'd need to do is make shell variants, so the stuff inside's the same, but the exterior would be whatever system a person'd prefer. An Atari version'd likely be easier, save maybe for Jaguar (don't know how good Jag emulation is these days) , not just for technical reasons but the games on average would be smaller. Vs. something trying to include Saturn and Dreamcast images in there, just one of those can eat away a few hundred megabytes, so they'd prob need a nice, fat microSD or small and "cheap" SSD, both kinda costly tho. VCS-wise, maybe they could throw in their arcade games as well? Even the ones up into the '90s. They could even pull a Nintendo and finish development on some prototypes to release in there like w/ Starfox 2, but that'd mean either having internal game devs (doubt they have any) or getting someone like Llamasoft to do the honors.

Ah yeah, had meant to mention that xD. For whatever reason the 2600 ones have been more accurate than the Genesis ones. Might come down to components being used, lack of effort etc. I dunno :/ Wouldn't mind an "all-in-one" Flashback-like system for either of them tho; 2600, 5200, the computers etc. w/ Atari. Genesis, Saturn, Dreamcast, arcade games etc. w/ Sega. Just bring all the product lines together under one product and take it from there.

Yes, that's essentially the point of it, but also to show that the credibility comes with consistency and building rapport w/ the community (fans, gamers in general, developers and publishers, etc.). And you're right: in the grand scheme of it, it's a small point, but in directly comparing the two it's a much wider discrepancy between one who's mostly been doing it right, and one who's mostly been doing it wrong. I'm also in the idea that something like this could've worked as an enthusiast type of system priced reasonably. As you said, a Flashback kind of thing but w/ a few more extensive console features, kind of mirroring what's in systems now but more focused on the games and not multimedia things. They wouldn't even have needed to make it exclusively as a Flashback device; give an option w/ that stuff in the Flashback digital collections for other platforms, the convenience of a hardware version would just be for the hardcore fans that want to play that stuff on something resembling the original hardware. Atari does deserve some credit for the Flashbacks being more or less on-point though, which is more than can be said about most of the Genesis systems from ATGames. Hopefully they've gone back to the drawing board on that recent one they revealed. Though really the one I'm most looking forward to atm is the Neo-Geo mini....as long as it's priced reasonably.

Hey everyone! This is my first post here and glad to be around; I've been following the thread since the VCS reveal last year and it's been my go-to for info and opinions regarding that project. I did see some Sega talk earlier and I'm more a Sega fan than an Atari one (didn't grow up w/ them as they were a bit before my time), so while I feel I kinda have to interject on a few things there, it's mainly b/c it ties into my own opinion of the VCS and why it has such a massive image/trust problem that won't go away anytime soon. I think we can all agree that the Sega of today isn't the same Sega from back in the console days, that much is clear. It isn't the same company that was at the forefront of 3D graphics tech in arcades beyond what you could get at the home or on computers of the time, and it isn't the same company that published ridiculous-yet-funny stuff like Sea-Man and Segagaga!. Nor is it the same company that dove into somewhat oddball-yet-interesting multimedia pushes with their home consoles (getting other companies like Hitachi and JVC to manufacture versions of systems, adding video playback and karaoke features, pushing online gaming and web browsing before those things became mainstream w/ gaming consoles etc.). I get that much. It's also not a stretch to say that their exit from the console market was more or less their own doing. I'm not one of the guys in the camp that feels the Sega CD did any actual damage to the brand at the time, but releasing things like the 32X (which should have been completely cancelled) and the surprise Saturn launch did them no favors. We can argue as to the how and why into those decisions, or if it was SoA or SoJ who pushed for them, but that doesn't matter in this context. Sega as a company, like Atari, simply made too many mistakes with consumers as a platform holder in too small a span of time to justify holding a spot as a platform holder in the eyes of most gamers. By the early 2000s, their time was up in that game, and things just came to be as they are now. Even if some of us would have preferred differently, a lot of that preference has come with hindsight, and and things shape out the way they do for a reason. That said, I *do* think there's misconceptions surrounding Sega in their post-console years. While the Sonic series has been, at best, serviceable (with some true horror stories and a few quite good games in-between, the latter recently being Mania)...it has been consistent. And they've certainly put out more than a small handful of good games you can count on one hand, too. Off the top of my head (and not to turn this into a list war, but merely illustrating a point), you have: Virtua Fighter 4 (and EVO), GunValkyrie, Outrun 2, Billy Hatcher, Super Monkey Ball, Virtua Fighter 5 (and FS), Valkyrie Profile, Sonic Colors, Sonic Generations, the Yakuza series, Afterburner: Climax, Sega Rally 3/Sega Rally Revo, Jet Set Radio Future, House of the Dead 3 and 4, Sonic All-Stars Racing Transformed, Virtual-On Oratorio Tangram, Virtua Tennis 4 and more recently some stuff like A Certain Magical Virtual-On, 7th Dragon III, House of the Dead: Scarlet Dawn and Sega World Drivers Championship. And in terms of games they've published, you have the Platinum-developed Bayonetta and Vanquish, the Total War games, Alien Isolation, Football Manager series etc. And there's more I could name but feel that's enough. The reason I did that wasn't just to discount the idea they've barely put out any decent software since going third-party, but also that they've been consistent in publishing in a meaningful way since leaving the hardware business. Sure, a lot of particular games I'd like to see aren't there, but I can't hold that against the quality and quantity of otherwise solid releases from them. And while they did make some (obviously) dumb decisions when going third-party (imo splitting their base across all three systems 6th gen was a mistake, they should've mainly focused on PS2), again,...at least they have been consistent. More than that, really. And doing this has helped them both retain a relationship with most of the old fans, and ALSO bring in new fans....the majority of whom I can promise are not utterly insane and/or want a Dreamcast 2 in any serious way That's ultimately what it boils down to tying this into Atari and the VCS; even if, in the off-chance (and completely insane) decision Sega were ever to jump back into making consoles...imho, I feel they would have "earned" the opportunity much, much more than Atari has. Because ever since leaving the hardware market, Atari's publishing track record has been spotty, and in some cases, completely dead. I remember when they were publishing some games in the 6th gen, particularly Enter The Matrix...which was a completely broken game, but still relevant. They published a small handful of other games, too, but the last MAJOR release I can think of from them was 2008's Alone in the Dark. After that things just...kind of...petered out. Atari's gone under multiple restructurings I'm sure, so hopefully people keep in mind that I'm just referring to "Atari" in general and not any specific incarnation. That said, aside from those mentioned games, Atari's presence in the mainstream gaming circle has been more or less a marginal one. Yes, they have had the clone system deal w/ ATGames and a few Flashback collections, but when I mention the "mainstream" gaming circle and building rapport, that's mainly in relation to new software (either w/ new IP or current/legacy IP) targeted at old and new fans on the major mainstream consoles, and that's something that, undeniably, Sega has done significantly more of (and better) than Atari since they both went third-party. It's what leads to my main issue w/ this new VCS, honestly: it feels like an unearned shot at the big boy's table, from a company that has very little to any rapport with current mainstream gaming audiences, and hasn't made success of chances to bring in a large enough stable of new fans to their brand, so they're mainly banking off of nostalgia from the older hardcore fans, which in Atari's case, isn't enough to sustain a console. Not one as a major competitor, hell not even one at the Ouya's level honestly. If it seems like they're having trouble getting notable developers on board, that's probably because they have little to no clout with the modern industry in which those developers are a part of, so why should they bother to develop on a system that, compared to PS4, XBO or Switch, is a non-starter? All the same, why would brick-and-mortar stores bother to stock the system and take away shelf-space from those other consoles, or the much-cheaper Flashbacks? When you really think about it, what market niche does the VCS even serve? It's price puts it in league with a PS4, XBO, or Switch, all of which offer a much richer ecosystem of 1st and 3rd party gaming content and multimedia apps, and are either much more powerful for a few dollars more, or offer a level of lifestyle convenience something like the VCS never could. It's priced well beyond things like the Dreamcade Replay, which can do almost all of the emulation the VCS will, for a cheaper price, and from a company with a track record of proven hardware (via their MAME arcade systems). It's also priced well beyond simple streaming boxes that can play all sorts of media content in hi-def 4K with ample options and home theater integration, so why get a VCS for simply that? And for those just wanting a nostalgic rush of an experience, I'm certain they can get one of those clone retro emulator systems out there for $100-$150 that even let them use their original cartridges to play from, a feature the VCS completely lacks. Oh but what about those who'd want to mess around in that sandbox environment they're promising? Well, I'm certain they can do that already on their own PCs, or if they really want to try some cool hobby projects, just get a RasPI kit on the cheap and dig in. To be completely fair, these same factors of niche-filling would apply if this were Sega making a Dreamcast 2, or SNK making a Neo-Geo 2 or whatever. The fact of the matter is, the home gaming market is already being well-served by Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, PC and mobile, so unless a company has some wildly inventive stuff to throw into the ring (and the capital to do so), there's no reason for them to try as the industry marches towards what could be the last console generation anyhow. Leave that to companies like Google, Apple, and Samsung. SegaSammy should stick to what they're doing now, including third-party software support for the Big 3. Making a Dreamcast 2 to compete against them would be financial suicide. Same for SNK. Honestly, I feel the one area any of these companies should try to do more in could be arcades; aside from a small handful of companies like Raw Thrills, Sega, and BandaiNamco, the scene's pretty underserved. Hell, even with them it's underserved and could be waiting for a blossoming, much the way Nintendo helped get the American home console market back to life w/ NES. But that's an entirely different conversation. Atari, with this new VCS, just feels like they're blinded with nostalgic ignorance, or worst yet, arrogance. To think that even without building rapport in the largest chunks of the industry (significant rapport, anyway), without truly strengthening ties w/ old fans or bringing in new fans gradually, they can just try to go up against companies that have been doing these very same things for decades, is complete insanity. You can see the arrogance shine through too in how they handled some things like the social media, and attacking certain reporters and Youtubers in pretty unprofessional ways. And that's really the biggest reason I feel this project is going to fail, because I haven't gotten a single tinge from them showing that they've learned or grown from the end of Jaguar to now. At least Jaguar-era Atari was commendable for trying some actual engineering and having a hilarious ad campaign that backfired horribly, but at the very least, seemed interesting (speaking as a guy who at the time didn't even know who Atari *was*; like said earlier, they were before my time :/). The current Atari definitely has the 2nd part locked down but with none of the earnestness and sincerity (or engineering talent, even if the end product is buggy) of the last true vintages of the company. I'll keep hoping they announce something that surprises, shows that they're taking this seriously...you know, maybe by announcing some GAMES. If they want to position this as a legit console effort, they should know that it won't get anywhere without some 1st party content that isn't available anywhere else. But as I already basically said earlier, they haven't even bothered with much consistency of quality software for systems on the market after going third-party, so what hope is there that they'll step up those efforts for a system with magnitudes smaller a potential install base, even in the best-case scenario? There is none. Again, glad to be able to post and share my thoughts up here, hope to have more to share in the future whenever they reveal something meaningful on this project. I wish Atari the best of luck w/ this VCS because they will need ALL of it and more, just to stand a chance.