Savetz Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 (edited) I want to convert some more Atari disks for use on AtariMagazines.com / AtariArchives.org, but really don't want to hook up my old SIO2PC setup: a Windows95 box without USB ports. I'd rather hook up my 130XE to my Mac. So I've been researching SIO2USB solutions and haven't found anything great. Am I missing something? Steve Tucker has the hardware, but it doesn't claim Mac compatibility. (Unless it works with the SIO2OSX software at http://atarimac.com/sio2osx.php ?) I could use SIO2OSX with an SIO-to-serial cable, and a USB to serial adapter, but that sounds kludgey. There's the hardware at http://home.arcor.de/grasel/sio2usb_e.htm but it says it's at least 130 Euro = USD$167+. Expensive. Is there something better? Thanks Kevin Edited February 11, 2009 by Savetz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vectorman0 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I have actually been wondering the same thing. A couple days ago I sent Atarimax.com an email asking if he knew about the SIO2OSX software and if their USB SIO2PC Interface was compatible, but have yet to hear back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I have actually been wondering the same thing. A couple days ago I sent Atarimax.com an email asking if he knew about the SIO2OSX software and if their USB SIO2PC Interface was compatible, but have yet to hear back. Yes it works with OS X. You just need the SIO2OSX software and a USB to Serial adapter. I have an adapter from Coolgear that works perfectly with it. Allan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vectorman0 Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I have actually been wondering the same thing. A couple days ago I sent Atarimax.com an email asking if he knew about the SIO2OSX software and if their USB SIO2PC Interface was compatible, but have yet to hear back. Yes it works with OS X. You just need the SIO2OSX software and a USB to Serial adapter. I have an adapter from Coolgear that works perfectly with it. Allan I was wondering about compatibility with this Atarimax USB one: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savetz Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 I have actually been wondering the same thing. A couple days ago I sent Atarimax.com an email asking if he knew about the SIO2OSX software and if their USB SIO2PC Interface was compatible, but have yet to hear back. Yes it works with OS X. You just need the SIO2OSX software and a USB to Serial adapter. I have an adapter from Coolgear that works perfectly with it. Allan To clarify: Vectorman and I are wondering if Tucker's newish SIO-to-USB adapter works with the software, rather than the SIO-to-serial plus a third-party USB adapter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Allan Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I have actually been wondering the same thing. A couple days ago I sent Atarimax.com an email asking if he knew about the SIO2OSX software and if their USB SIO2PC Interface was compatible, but have yet to hear back. Yes it works with OS X. You just need the SIO2OSX software and a USB to Serial adapter. I have an adapter from Coolgear that works perfectly with it. Allan To clarify: Vectorman and I are wondering if Tucker's newish SIO-to-USB adapter works with the software, rather than the SIO-to-serial plus a third-party USB adapter. SIO2OSX only works with a SIO2serial adapter, not the SIO2USB adapter. Luckily a serial2usb adapter can be used and are very cheap. Allan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 All, The SIO2USB adapter doesn't work with SIO2OSX. It would require a specific Mac OSX driver, or some other specific code (user space) for that adapter, and he hasn't publicly published any details on the interface. Cost wise there isn't a huge difference. A USB Serial dongle is about $20, and you can find a serial cable for $10 or under, so getting a Serial SIO2PC device is about the same cost as the SIO2USB> Even if I did have the data, I wouldn't have a huge incentive to add the support. First, I'd have to buy one of the adapters, and the market for SIO2OSX is quite limited (I've only sold 15 or so of them in the time it's been out) so at $25 per copy of SIO2OSX, I wouldn't get much return on my time. Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookt Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Hey Mark. As a mad idea, if someone (or a couple of people) in the community were willing to cover the cost of the SIO2USB adapter and Steve was forthcoming with any information you needed would you be willing to add support ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ApolloBoy Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 I use VMWare Fusion to run APE for my SIO2PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Spookt, I won't say no offhand, but besides the cost of the adapter, it's going to be a question of how big a job it is. The first step there would be for Steve to release the information on it, before I could determine that. I asked him for it when he first came out with the USB version (a couple of years ago now I think), and he had indicated he was going to release it, but I've never seen anything on it. Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fletch Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Gee, I'm in an exclusive club. 1 of 15 eh? I wonder what number I am All, The SIO2USB adapter doesn't work with SIO2OSX. It would require a specific Mac OSX driver, or some other specific code (user space) for that adapter, and he hasn't publicly published any details on the interface. Cost wise there isn't a huge difference. A USB Serial dongle is about $20, and you can find a serial cable for $10 or under, so getting a Serial SIO2PC device is about the same cost as the SIO2USB> Even if I did have the data, I wouldn't have a huge incentive to add the support. First, I'd have to buy one of the adapters, and the market for SIO2OSX is quite limited (I've only sold 15 or so of them in the time it's been out) so at $25 per copy of SIO2OSX, I wouldn't get much return on my time. Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 Fletch, Number 5 to be exact And I'll have to eat my words, as I went and counted my Kagi email receipts. Seems I've sold 27 of them so far. So the good news is you were an early adopter, the bad news is that it's not as exclusive of a club as I once thought. Everyone, And as I said, it's really a matter of how much time it will take, which I could determine if I had the interface I needed to code to. I hate to say that's a factor, but my day job takes more time than when I started this, and believe it or not, SIO2OSX proceeds won't pay the mortgage payment Thanks, Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Wolfe Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 @ everyone: I am currently testing a $6 [shipping included in U.S.] USB/Serial dongle that does indeed work with SIO2OSX and my Mac laptop I will be posting a thread in the 8bit forum soon with all my results but this finding drastically reduces the overall cost on a USB solution for mac and/or pc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sub(Function(:)) Posted February 12, 2009 Share Posted February 12, 2009 I could use SIO2OSX with an SIO-to-serial cable, and a USB to serial adapter, but that sounds kludgey. There's the hardware at http://home.arcor.de/grasel/sio2usb_e.htm but it says it's at least 130 Euro = USD$167+. Expensive. I am not sure if there will be another production run of this SIO2USB device. When I got mine they said there was not going to be one... I can see what you say about the use of a serial dongle being Kludgey. But I think this what the atarimax SIO2PC USB unit does anyway. It will just have the same sort of chip as you find in the USB to RS232 dongle (just fitted on the PCB, the flat square chip next to the GAL in the pictures, on the atarimax site). However I guess the driver will be different hence the problem with the SIO2OSX. If I start to use SIO2OSX (which I may do soon) I will use a serial dongle and my old SIO2PC device, it simply replaces the serial cable from the PC version of my APE setup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctorclu Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 @ everyone: I am currently testing a $6 [shipping included in U.S.] USB/Serial dongle that does indeed work with SIO2OSX and my Mac laptop I will be posting a thread in the 8bit forum soon with all my results but this finding drastically reduces the overall cost on a USB solution for mac and/or pc Sweet! Yeh please do! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookt Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I could use SIO2OSX with an SIO-to-serial cable, and a USB to serial adapter, but that sounds kludgey. There's the hardware at http://home.arcor.de/grasel/sio2usb_e.htm but it says it's at least 130 Euro = USD$167+. Expensive. I can see what you say about the use of a serial dongle being Kludgey. But I think this what the atarimax SIO2PC USB unit does anyway. It will just have the same sort of chip as you find in the USB to RS232 dongle (just fitted on the PCB, the flat square chip next to the GAL in the pictures, on the atarimax site). However I guess the driver will be different hence the problem with the SIO2OSX. Well it's not the kludge its just being sure to find the right adapter here in the UK. I already have a USB to Serial cable that I use to run Linux consoles on my Mac but that dosen't work with SIO2OSX. I don't want to spend money on a cable unless I can be completely sure it's going to work. Perhaps I'm blowing that up a little though - I should maybe just research a cable and source one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+poobah Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I have an FTDI chip based USB-serial dongle that I got from Newegg for something like $10, works fine with my homebuilt max232 based sio-serial interface. Linky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Wolfe Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I have an FTDI chip based USB-serial dongle that I got from Newegg for something like $10, works fine with my homebuilt max232 based sio-serial interface. Linky this says $16, but you can do a $5 mail in rebate and then there is the shipping. the one I found on ebay is $6 [shipping included] sorry for the delay in getting my SIO2OSX thread going it is my son's birthday tomorrow and there is a lot going on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookt Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 (edited) I have an FTDI chip based USB-serial dongle that I got from Newegg for something like $10, works fine with my homebuilt max232 based sio-serial interface. Linky this says $16, but you can do a $5 mail in rebate and then there is the shipping. the one I found on ebay is $6 [shipping included] sorry for the delay in getting my SIO2OSX thread going it is my son's birthday tomorrow and there is a lot going on Thanks for the links guys. Does anyone know of anything in the UK? I'm guessing shipping would cost more than the interface from the US. Most places I've seen them listed over here there is often no mention of manufacturer never mind what chipset is in there. I'll have to have a good search around. Edited February 13, 2009 by spookt Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mirage Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 I have an FTDI chip based USB-serial dongle that I got from Newegg for something like $10, works fine with my homebuilt max232 based sio-serial interface. Linky this says $16, but you can do a $5 mail in rebate and then there is the shipping. the one I found on ebay is $6 [shipping included] sorry for the delay in getting my SIO2OSX thread going it is my son's birthday tomorrow and there is a lot going on No problem, enjoy the time with your son! Looking forward to the $6 adapter info (unless I missed it). I'm glad I didn't order the USB model without waiting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Wolfe Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 you didn't miss the info from me, I will make a new post very soon, part of the delay is that I want to do side by side benchmark tests with a PC and my $2 PC laptop has no USB so I have to rig up my office PC which is a huge pain, but I'll get there once the birthday madness is over . You can find the dongle on ebay, you can search ebay and just check the auction descriptions for MAC compatibility. It is frustrating that no one lists chipsets or anything. I will try to make a comprehensive list of ebay sellers who carry it for my upcoming post My guess is there must be some UK sellers who have the same things that you can buy and avoid overseas shipping. of course the British Pound is so much stronger than the dollar right now you might make out better on the import Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+poobah Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 The FTDI chipset seems to be the 'chipset of choice' at least on the mac. I had one that was based on the Prolific chipset that didn't work as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Wolfe Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 The FTDI chipset seems to be the 'chipset of choice' at least on the mac.I had one that was based on the Prolific chipset that didn't work as well. how do you tell what you have when you buy these cheapo generic dongles? is there any way to tell? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spookt Posted February 13, 2009 Share Posted February 13, 2009 That's the trick. The dongle I have works fine with my Mac, just not with SIO2OSX. This is known behavior and there is an explanation of the problems with some of them on the SIO2OSX web page. I understand the issue and that the FTDI chipset is what to aim for but my problem is not many (if any) sellers tell you that kind of detail in their ads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atarimac Posted February 14, 2009 Share Posted February 14, 2009 Here's one another SIO2OSX user says he bought and it works, and is FTDI. It's German, so not sure what shipping, etc are from UK, but here is the link he gave me: http://www.er-tronik.de/shop2/product_info...210d62d6c892343 I know that it is a pain trying to find the right adapter, and I'm sure that's why Steve at Atarimax.com created his own USB dongle. The issue with most of the Serial dongles, is that they are not real time on any of the handshake/control lines. They work fine for "3-wire" serial applications where all you need is transmit, receive, and ground. However, to emulate SIO, you have to use one of the modem control lines, and the timing has to be accurate. The reason FTDI works is that it returns the modem status lines in every USB frame (or once per 1ms). The other dongles are making their driver poll for the lines, by sending a separate USB message and waiting for the reply, and the latency is more than the SIO emulation can handle. With anybody who has a MacPro (not many I know), the other option which I'm pretty sure would work is using a PCIE 16550 Serial card. I'm pretty sure OSX has a 16550 standard. But that only helps MacPro users, and the cards aren't real cheap either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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