GroovyBee Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Sounds like a mish-mash of styles. You might need some cut scenes to take the player from one genre to the other to make it more cohesive as a game. Sprites that are 12x12 (like the bat) might look a bit too small on a 256/320x224 screen (depends on number of sprites and backdrop colours/style/"busyness") so you might want to use 24x24 or something like that (pick a size that the hardware supports natively). Looking forward to seeing your progress. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 10, 2012 Author Share Posted October 10, 2012 The Bat is actually from something completely different (a low res/low color art contest) But, it did reinforce the idea for a different kind of homage to Atari Adventure The real sprite will probably be 16x16 for the overworld map and 24x24 for the top-down shooter portion. If the Bat can fly through walls it's hard to make an overworld map seem meaningful. I was hoping by depleting stamina it would force players to think more strategically about their moves whilst encouraging exploration into shooter areas. Sort of a nod to . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 (edited) I think the game design is mostly done. Akin to Atari Adventure 3 modes of play sounds about right. Game Mode 1: Linear, simple map. Area, Artifact and drop off points revealed. 1 Artifact to retrieve and drop off. Game Mode 2: Normal sized map. Area revealed but Artifact and drop off locations hidden. 3 Artifacts to find and drop off. Game Mode 3: Large, random map. Area, Artifact and drop off points hidden. 5 Artifacts to find and drop off. Artifacts will have various effects when carried. Some good and others not so much. An experienced Graphic Artist has given me some advice on how to present this game to publishers. Seems the best way forward is to start working on an information package or small portfolio for this game. Some general advice: * Document the license on all assets. Make sure you either own the rights or have permission to use whatever resources the game needs. * Some details like the compiler used can actually work against your game. Limit exposure to such factors while finding ways to show off the quality of your work. One thing to note is that the way I post in this topic is not a great idea for fronting yourself as an ace game developer. Notice I already changed the game design on a whim. I explain new game concepts off the cuff - sometimes only partially. Also, I describe false starts and my own general inexperience. This topic really isn't for me: It's for us. AtariAge has a great community that breeds new homebrewers. You can't encourage others to make great games if you don't show what it took to make one yourself. Edited October 11, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 * Document the license on all assets. Make sure you either own the rights or have permission to use whatever resources the game needs. Yep! Always good advice. * Some details like the compiler used can actually work against your game. Limit exposure to such factors while finding ways to show off the quality of your work. I disagree. If a game is well put together and fun to play it doesn't matter what language it was written in. Crap games can be written in assembler too. Sounds like you are hoping for a career change or to get into game programming/designing (or maybe I'm reading it wrong). If that is the case any potential employer wants to see well presented and preferably complete games in your "show reel/portfolio". By showing complete games it means that you have the ability to see the project through to the end. A well presented game means that you have paid attention to detail. You also need to be able to explain why things are the way that they are in the game. Its OK to say (paraphrasing) "For this game I didn't know about .... so I had to read up on ..." and quote the books, technical articles and resources you used to solve your problem. Employers don't necessarily want somebody who has all the answers at their fingertips. What is more important to them is that you don't know the answer now but after a bit of research you'll be on your way. Hmmmm... "Getting into the industry" is a whole thread in itself . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 (edited) Nah. No career change. The hard truth is, in order to get the same production run an indie publisher could do would cost minimum $1000. That's quite an outlay for a lone programmer. As for compiler prejudice. It's unfortunately a fact of life. When I worked in the database software development arena we scoffed at MS Access developers. In the homebrew scene everything not programmed in C or asm gets construed with the lowest quality amateur efforts. Although this attitude isn't universal you don't want to risk your potential publishers being one of the few. As you say, in the end it is all about presentation and gameplay. Anyone have any good game design templates? Edited October 11, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Nah. No career change. The hard truth is, in order to get the same production run an indie publisher could do would cost minimum $1000. That's quite an outlay for a lone programmer. How many carts do you get for that? As for compiler prejudice. It's unfortunately a fact of life. When I worked in the database software development arena we scoffed at MS Access developers. In the homebrew scene everything not programmed in C or asm gets construed with the lowest quality amateur efforts. Although this attitude isn't universal you don't want to risk your potential publishers being one of the few. Not all "C" compilers are created equal. I theory you could develop code in a compiled BASIC that produces better code (in terms of speed and code density) than a "C" compiler would with equivalent source code. Without sitting down and comparing the output of both compilers side by side at the assembly language level its not as cut and dried as people would have you believe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 (edited) How many carts do you get for that? About 50-100 carts. Heaven forbid you need battery backed RAM. Oh, I agree. The technical side of compiler preference isn't an issue. As an example I'd say Game Maker comes to mind. It's frequently associated with freakishly amateur efforts. In part because people new to game development do make freakishly amateur games (to start). Game Maker is actually capable of professional results as seen by Spelunky http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spelunky http://spelunkyworld.com/original.html Edited October 11, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 About 50-100 carts. Heaven forbid you need battery backed RAM. These days you don't actually need a battery to have non volatile RAM . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 11, 2012 Author Share Posted October 11, 2012 (edited) These days you don't actually need a battery to have non volatile RAM . Well, yeah. I was vacillating between terms I should use. I might have picked the wrong one. Same deal with terms like the Genesis frame buffer/tile buffer. Color table/CRAM.. sigh Are there example information packages for games? Would they look like the advertisements meant to entice Arcade owners to buy/rent new games? Edited October 11, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted October 11, 2012 Share Posted October 11, 2012 Well, yeah. I was vacillating between terms I should use. I might have picked the wrong one. Don't worry your terminology was perfectly fine. I was passing comment on the battery part. With modern day components you don't need to add a battery to have RAM chips remember their contents for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 13, 2012 Author Share Posted October 13, 2012 (edited) I think I pretty much got all the advice I'm going to get for approach publishers. Basically, boils down to a simple portfolio for the game and a demo ROM. Started researching the art style for the game. Decided on something similar to Super Deformed/Chibi/Adventure Time. Unfortunately, the style really doesn't seem to have a definite name. This link has an example: http://www.dragoart....-watermelon.htm Edited October 13, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 15, 2012 Author Share Posted October 15, 2012 Will be working on sprites this week. In the meantime, I'd like to share some of my idea sketches. When I remember to take a lunch break I bring along some drawing paper. Using doodles and notes the game design gets mulled over. Regular notepad paper is good for brainstorming in bullet points while drawing paper helps draw out the general game concept. Needless to say, this shouldn't represent my best drawing. Rather, it is an example of how I work out my game design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 16, 2012 Author Share Posted October 16, 2012 I need a paint program that allows me to draw with a color assigned to both left and right mouse buttons and allows for a custom palette. MS Paint doesn't seem to save the custom palette. The GraphicsGale program retains my custom palette but doesn't seem to allow me to draw using both left and right mouse buttons.. sigh. Here is the Bat in 24x24 pixels. I actually had BETTER luck starting from the 12x12 8 color bat, scaling it to 24x24 and tweaking the rough edges. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Yurkie Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 You should give gimp a try theloon. http://www.gimp.org Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 18, 2012 Author Share Posted October 18, 2012 (edited) Real men use MS Paint for sprites and Notepad for web pages. Gimp is very, very cool though. I just took a screenshot of the Bat sprite running on a Genesis emulator. Not the latest scrolling engine so you can see some tearing. Also, the level colors are off and the tiles are from a different game. I think I've got several choices for paint programs now. The process of importing those pictures into Genesis sprite data has been aggravating though. The first tool I use can import bitmaps but it screws up the sprite data. Specifically, it shifts the colors by one. So, I've had to resort to using the first program to import the picture then export to ANOTHER Genesis sprite utility THEN touch up the colors and export to actual sprite data.. whew! Edited October 18, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GroovyBee Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Writing your own bitmap conversion tools is a good exercise too and also a very common thing to need to do. By creating your own tools you can arrange the sprite and data so that it suits your game better. Languages like PERL are ideal because they don't need to be compiled by a second tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Yurkie Posted October 18, 2012 Share Posted October 18, 2012 Looks like your making some solid progress theloon! I love the look of the bat sprite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 22, 2012 Author Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) Thanks Yurkie! I guess it may be time for some news. Because I changed this project around I missed an opportunity with a cart reproduction guy to get new carts made cheap. So, it's good that this project has a firm vision finally. Bad that I had to miss an opportunity due to it. I secured permission from an artist to use some of his tracks for my game. All he asks is attribution and a link to the game when done. I'm hoping I can exceed that demand by giving him a real cart from the first batch when done Doing graphics last weekend was a big fail. Decided to get a horrible, insomnia inducing headache on Sunday instead. Decided that the Bat will be at the TOP of the screen flying down the shooter sections. I seem to be making an impression with at least one homebrew publisher. Let us see if I can figure out how all this works. Stay tuned for more this week! Edited October 22, 2012 by theloon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted October 26, 2012 Author Share Posted October 26, 2012 Not a whole lot of sex and sizzle this week. Just a disclaimer screen. That one screen represents quite a lot under the hood. It's running the first real stand-alone code for Gnuberubs Sojourn - not just another cobbled together demo. Unfortunatly, I have a game breaking bug that prevents stuff from dispaying on the screen. I'm forced to split my code into two: the old broken one and a new program. I slowly add code back into the new program until either everything is magically fine or I find the bug. That screenshot is from an in-progress new program code. Hopfully I can nail the bug and merge the code back. The font is AUGSCII which GroovyBee advised me on. P.S. Anyone recognize where that disclaimer came from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Gemintronic Posted November 7, 2012 Author Share Posted November 7, 2012 Haven't been posting here because I just became a subscriber - which means I get extra blogs! So, if anyone is interesting in the ramblings of an amateur homebrew developer go here: http://www.atariage....rn-dev-journal/ I'll try to post pictures and more substantive stuff in this topic. One thing I forgot to ask.. do people want this to be a real cartridge release? Or, are peeps looking for a quick and dirty ROM download? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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