soporj Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Hello, Keith! How’ve you been?! Would you happen to have copies of the rules booklets (instruction manuals) for the TUTORVISION system and its games?! If you do, please upload them onto Google Drive. Would I have your permission to (then) create archival materials—overlays, rules booklets, and box designs—for each of the TUTORVISION’s white-cased learning/educational game cartridges?! I know that you’re still waiting to officially release the TUTORVISION system and game .ROMs... but, have you been inquired to have your TUTORVISION work polished up for eventual inclusion into new INTELLIVISION product releases? From what I previously heard, NONE of the TUTORVISION games had any original overlays—I could design these (as well as—hopefully—their box designs and manuals). Thank You! Can you ask Keith why this post was made in such a large, annoying font? Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+DZ-Jay Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 RT12 Productions Producer Of Quality Games & Software Distributed Through ELEKTRONITE— Electronic Thoughts I'm curious to know which quality games and software you have released... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m-crew Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 The Software and Game That produced that Font!!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 I'm curious to know which quality games and software you have released... You will not get a quality answer..........nor quality games! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+cmart604 Posted February 25, 2015 Share Posted February 25, 2015 Cmart wonders about how FUN the next episode will be. (and when said FUN might commence) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intvnut Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 *peeks into thread* Hey guys what's happ- *blink* .... I'll just be on my way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Spear Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 I have a question for Keith that is not exactly a question for Keith - "Can you provide any insight into why the hardware was what it was, or throw the Intellivisionaries some leads to any of the hardware engineers or management leads that delivered the console?" It would be cool to hear about why some of the design decisions were made (eg why the AY-3-891x for sound was chosen, or why the controllers multiplex, or why the graphics modes are they way they are, etc). There is a ton of software information out there, relatively speaking, but very little from the hardware folks. We mostly know how the stuff works, but not why it was done. We can guess in 2015, but we don't know. I was just thinking about how someone can ask Woz about what he was thinking when he made the Apple ][, and he'll talk for hours on end, and that it might be cool to get something similar from a Mattel Electronics hardware guru. As discussed in our Intellivisionaries Episode 5 thread a while back ( http://atariage.com/forums/topic/221183-intellivisionaries-episode-5-is-up/ ), I am looking for questions to ask Keith Robinson. All the ones already asked in that thread have been sent to him, but if anyone else has more for him, please post them in this thread, and I will make sure he gets them. I will have him in the studio next week to get answers to them, which will [hopefully] be in episode 9 toward the end of May. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intymike Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 I have a question for Keith that is not exactly a question for Keith - "Can you provide any insight into why the hardware was what it was, or throw the Intellivisionaries some leads to any of the hardware engineers or management leads that delivered the console?" It would be cool to hear about why some of the design decisions were made (eg why the AY-3-891x for sound was chosen, or why the controllers multiplex, or why the graphics modes are they way they are, etc). There is a ton of software information out there, relatively speaking, but very little from the hardware folks. We mostly know how the stuff works, but not why it was done. We can guess in 2015, but we don't know. I was just thinking about how someone can ask Woz about what he was thinking when he made the Apple ][, and he'll talk for hours on end, and that it might be cool to get something similar from a Mattel Electronics hardware guru. A website dedicated to David P. Chandler, the lead designer of the Intellivision. Maybe it answers some of your questions: http://papaintellivision.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Spear Posted April 10, 2015 Share Posted April 10, 2015 I have read that site over and over a few times. It does have some historical info, but does not have the same fire as a real interview might. Kind of like how Ken Smith's recollection of the choices he made in doing Sea Battle eclipse all of the text on the BSR site about the game. But thanks for the link, it might be useful for others who google/bing for the same thing in the future.... A website dedicated to David P. Chandler, the lead designer of the Intellivision. Maybe it answers some of your questions: http://papaintellivision.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intvnut Posted April 11, 2015 Share Posted April 11, 2015 I have a question for Keith that is not exactly a question for Keith - "Can you provide any insight into why the hardware was what it was, or throw the Intellivisionaries some leads to any of the hardware engineers or management leads that delivered the console?" It would be cool to hear about why some of the design decisions were made (eg why the AY-3-891x for sound was chosen, or why the controllers multiplex, or why the graphics modes are they way they are, etc). There is a ton of software information out there, relatively speaking, but very little from the hardware folks. We mostly know how the stuff works, but not why it was done. We can guess in 2015, but we don't know. You probably need to find the APh folks and General Instrument folks to determine some of these details. For example, the Intellivision is actually based on a system developed by GI called the "GIMINI Deluxe 8900". (Full scan of the GI Micro-Programmable TV Games offerings here. Page 107 shown below.) The Intellivision adds a little bit of RAM (240 bytes of 8-bit RAM) to a base hardware platform that GI had developed. Now, the controllers, software stack and industrial design around it all came from Mattel and APh. That's where Dave Chandler and Glenn Hightower and such come in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Lathe26 Posted April 11, 2015 Share Posted April 11, 2015 I would love to hear why the RAM sizes were unusual sizes (352 words of System RAM, 240 bytes of scratchpad RAM) and whether there was internal controversy before those numbers were set in stone. I have good guesses as to why but would love to hear confirmation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+nurmix Posted April 12, 2015 Author Share Posted April 12, 2015 Excellent ideas / questions. These are definitely topics I'd like to cover. If I can get some of the people behind these things on the show, I will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Spear Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Could you add this to the next “Questions for Keith” segment, or if you have an answer before the show, and if you get a "preview answer" could you post it here? " Could you point the world to a definitive 'fair use' document that states the circumstances of where and when and under what rules the Intellivision Running Man can be shown? It would be interesting to know when that iconic figure can be shown on a fan site vs a homebrew publisher vs an independent/commercial venture. A pointer to a written declaration is all that's needed to be clear in this case. " We know that Keith is not a lawyer, but he's referred to legal issues about this-and-that in other segments, so it would be great to get some clear cut information on this topic. Different companies treat their brand identities differently so it would be good to know how IP treats this particular piece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+fdr4prez Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 My question to Keith would be this: If the original sports games couldn't be used due to their licensing logos (MLB, NFL, etc) so these logo's were simply removed, could the same be done to Tron games? For Deadly Discs if the Tron logo was removed from the start up screen, and the recognizer was replaced with something less recognizable, would that be OK for a flashback release? I've never played the Deadly Dogs version, so does that have recognizers in it? Or is it a giant ketchup (catsup) bottle spurting sauce at you? Maybe Deadly Dogs can be released on a Flashback if there is no recognizer. I am sure a giant ketchup bottle spurting at you, or a giant napkin holder tossing napkins at you, would be just fine for game play. Within the Tron: Maze-A-Tron game, there really isn't anything that shouts "Tron" within it except the name and the recognizers, so if these were changed would that be OK for a Flashback release? Would changing these games to be non-Tron related, without really changing the game play be acceptable to allow for release on a flashback and be acceptable to players? The old-time purists may say "nay, don't change the game", but then there would never be a Flashback release. In regards to Lock-N-Chase and Burgertime, and others, you can't really change the name only since this is a copy of real arcade games, but the INTV Tron games don't otherwise exist out there, so is a slight change of cosmetics enough to allow for a release? This would be similar to changing the recent Smurf game into the Sydney Hunter game. Tron Solar Sailor is very Tron-esque, so it would involve too many changes, but if you were to show a screenshot (or some game play) of Deadly Discs and Maze-A-Tron to a lay person in a blind taste test, I'd venture to guess that Tron would not be said at all until the recognizer is shown. sorry, I've not read all 5 pages of this tread, so I am not sure if something like that was already proposed to Keith. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
First Spear Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 I like your question a lot. Knowing what I know now about Intellivision graphics, there are probably n-tiles allocated to the Recognizer shape, and it would not take a lot of effort to turn them into ferinstance an evil trapezoid or a truck or anything else. My question to Keith would be this: If the original sports games couldn't be used due to their licensing logos (MLB, NFL, etc) so these logo's were simply removed, could the same be done to Tron games? For Deadly Discs if the Tron logo was removed from the start up screen, and the recognizer was replaced with something less recognizable, would that be OK for a flashback release? I've never played the Deadly Dogs version, so does that have recognizers in it? Or is it a giant ketchup (catsup) bottle spurting sauce at you? Maybe Deadly Dogs can be released on a Flashback if there is no recognizer. I am sure a giant ketchup bottle spurting at you, or a giant napkin holder tossing napkins at you, would be just fine for game play. Within the Tron: Maze-A-Tron game, there really isn't anything that shouts "Tron" within it except the name and the recognizers, so if these were changed would that be OK for(snip). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+intvsteve Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Well, in Maze-A-Tron there is the MCP sequence, which would probably have to change. But generally, IIRC the documentation / story in the manual is all tied to movie characters and storyline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+intvsteve Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 IIRC another thing mentioned in previous interviews is that games like the D&D titles were actually developed prior to ever getting the TSR license. So they could have been released under completely different names and not ever been associated w/ a licensed property. It think the same argument could be made for the sports titles, as far as you can make a football / hockey / soccer / basketball / whatever sports game and not associate it with any license whatsoever. Getting the license was purely a marketing tactic and not at all required to release the game - it was all packaging. I think the Tron games were specifically designed because of the movie license, and not done in independently without any knowledge or even the existence of the movie. That's where people w/ knowledge of how all the IP laws work have to inform us on just how all that works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+fdr4prez Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Well, in Maze-A-Tron there is the MCP sequence, which would probably have to change. But generally, IIRC the documentation / story in the manual is all tied to movie characters and storyline. True, there is an MCP sequence in Maze-A-Tron, but IIRC there is nothing in-game that signifies it as the MCP from Tron. It could simply be Johnny Depp from Transcendence, or Electro from the Marvel Universe, or any other villainous figure of imagination. Certainly the manual and the overlays would need a revamping, but they aren't normally supplied with the Flashback. They can be changed accordingly with a black line running through the Tron names, like a CIA released document of top secret info IIRC another thing mentioned in previous interviews is that games like the D&D titles were actually developed prior to ever getting the TSR license. So they could have been released under completely different names and not ever been associated w/ a licensed property. It think the same argument could be made for the sports titles, as far as you can make a football / hockey / soccer / basketball / whatever sports game and not associate it with any license whatsoever. Getting the license was purely a marketing tactic and not at all required to release the game - it was all packaging. I think the Tron games were specifically designed because of the movie license, and not done in independently without any knowledge or even the existence of the movie. That's where people w/ knowledge of how all the IP laws work have to inform us on just how all that works. And this is why it is a perfect question for Keith to get answered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+intvsteve Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 Pretty sure it was stated somewhere that the two-player sports games were left out because the 'Super Pro' versions are typically better, and support one-player mode. The Dollar General release included the original 2-player (Major League) Baseball because it's considered by many the most iconic Intellivision title. So for the sports titles, I think it was a matter of "curb appeal" -- 2-player only games may have made the FB a bit of a tougher sell for the casual market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+fdr4prez Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 True that, but wasn't it also stated that this is the reason why INTV Corp was able to sell them by removing the logos? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+fdr4prez Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 On a side note, I've also never played the Meteor! version of Astrosmash. Was this a complete enough game to be released on a Flashback? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+intvsteve Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 On a side note, I've also never played the Meteor! version of Astrosmash. Was this a complete enough game to be released on a Flashback? Is the Atari 2600 version of Asteroids? <sarc/> I think that yes, Meteor! could be a Flashback game - along the lines of how Brickout was on the FB. But there really isn't a lot to it -- think of your basic Astrosmash rocks and replace your guy from Space Hawk with a triangular ship. I don't think there are spinners. Can't recall if there are baddies other than the rocks and the occasional UFO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+intvsteve Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 (edited) True that, but wasn't it also stated that this is the reason why INTV Corp was able to sell them by removing the logos? Yep. May have also been that the licenses had expired, too. Intellivision, Inc. was pretty shoestring, it's been told, so no way they'd have ponied up to renew those licenses -- and the sports leagues had probably moved on to NES or Sega anyway by 1985-1986. But that makes one wonder, though: How did things work out for the Tron games and all the arcade ports? Intellivision, Inc. did release all of those (except maybe Solar Sailer -- though there are manuals from that one). But BurgerTime, Lock 'n' Chase, Bump 'n' Jump, Mission X -- heck, even He-Man. These all got reprints w/o the Mattel Electronics logo, with cheaper boxes and black & white labels and manuals. Were these super cheap licenses because at the time they were all "has-beens," too? I mean, by 1985 Tron was seen as a nothing burger, and arcades were disappearing. I don't think the Data East arcade games from 1981-1983 were hot commodities, either. Yeah, this would be a good topic to get a little more background on. It could probably be covered in 5 minutes, but likely expand out to 45 with lots of tangents and other recollections. EDIT: And all that tangential stuff is usually a bit of fun to hear, too! Edited September 22, 2015 by intvsteve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intymike Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 My question to Keith would be this: If the original sports games couldn't be used due to their licensing logos (MLB, NFL, etc) so these logo's were simply removed, could the same be done to Tron games? For Deadly Discs if the Tron logo was removed from the start up screen, and the recognizer was replaced with something less recognizable, would that be OK for a flashback release? Telegames did this with their later rereleases of the M-Network games. Tron Deadly Discs was altered to just Deadly Discs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+fdr4prez Posted September 22, 2015 Share Posted September 22, 2015 Telegames did this with their later rereleases of the M-Network games. Tron Deadly Discs was altered to just Deadly Discs. Did they leave the recognizer untouched? That would be a nice test case for a FB release if changing the name only is enough. Maze-A-Tron can become Maze-A-Dude And if there is fear of repercussion, then change out the recognizers so there isn't anything Tron related in the game play at all. And for Deadly Discs they can add a menu for selecting Deadly Dogs play style. I really like my thought of a giant ketchup bottle spurting at you I am still thinking Solar Sailor is too close to Tron since it does have too many Tron recognizable things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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