sd cartridge for 7800?

[emmanuelf]

1.79Mhz is not very fast. 550ns is plenty of time in today standards and old rom are slow too, more than 120ns access time for sure.

Faster imply more power too. So power consumption is still the more probable track. We will see.

Even if the compatibility is way better with theses memory chips and confirm power supply exhaustion with the first ones, the most affected 7800 units will still need a regulator/power supply refresh (and perhaps decoupling capacitors refresh/enhancement).

Edited November 28, 2016 by emmanuelf

[StarshipUK]

Its nice to see this project back on track. For me the issue was not so much it had not been released yet (I'd rather buy a stable product), but more it had been a long time since previous updates so looked like it had been abandoned, but I am really glad I was wrong. Hopefully the last few issues can be resolved quickly with the help of the community.

 

I don't think 7800 systems between regions had many differences, but I have a French system (as it has the SCART\PERITEL cable) if you would like me to test on that at some point.

[Jinks]

Like a couple things I found Scrapyard dog the timer runs out really fast. I can not finish the first level on the junkyard the timer runs out half way.

Also the levels on dig dug the speed up alarm sound happens after 3 or 4 seconds on each screen. Astro fighter plays very fast easy is extremely hard. I own these orignal carts so I know what they should be like.

I have no clue what would cause this.

[Andromeda Stardust]

 

At any rate, I will report back on the performance of the new revision Concerto on my 7800 when I receive it.

Well I received the new Concerto from Batari in the mail today. No dice. Exactly the same symptoms as before.

 

EDIT: It ain't a voltage issue.

 

VCC as measured through controller port using a DC multimeter:

 

Concerto menu idle: 4.99V

Boot in inoperable state: 4.99V

While flashing Bentley Bear to internal memory (this ROM is big so it takes a while): 4.99V

Playing 7800 ROM (Donkey Kong, before and after it crashes): 4.99V

Playing 2600 ROM (Jr Pacman, title screen): 5.00V

 

Surely my 7805 voltage regulator cannot be at fault here...

 

Also, I attempted to play the Robot Tank cartridge I recently picked up. This is what I got on the title screen. There is a low growl and it doesn't seem to respond to input:

[Jinks]

Well I received the new Concerto from Batari in the mail today. No dice. Exactly the same symptoms as before.

I am sorry to hear this never fixed it.

 

Could you get any 7800 games to play even if crashing after a level or whatever?

One of my 7800s will not even load a single 7800 game.

If you are in the menu try moving around lots like press the fire button right away as soon as it lets you and navigate quickly thru the games. That procedure causes a crash every time on both of my 7800s. It has to be done delicately or its a black screen or freeze up for sure.

[Jinks]

With those readings the amperage which is the more important reading is probably not dropping down as you have only .01volt fluctuation.

I have found my 7800 that hates robot tank likes the concerto much better.

Do you have a 2600 ao you can play it at least? It is a pretty cool game..

[Andromeda Stardust]

I am sorry to hear this never fixed it.

 

Could you get any 7800 games to play even if crashing after a level or whatever?

One of my 7800s will not even load a single 7800 game.

If you are in the menu try moving around lots like press the fire button right away as soon as it lets you and navigate quickly thru the games. That procedure causes a crash every time on both of my 7800s. It has to be done delicately or its a black screen or freeze up for sure.

They are playable but nearly every single game I have tried crashes or is glitchy. Some games don't make it past the title screen.

 

Donkey Kong I cannot walk left but I can only jump left. It usually crashes in short order. DK Jr, when I grab the vine, I get stuck and cannot climb. Galaga, more often than not the first stage never starts up. Xevious occasionally works, sometimes the background tiles are scrambled.

 

Bentley Bear, falls through the floor on boot. Froggie, major sprite corruption. I think I made a video a while back detailing the errors.

 

I didn't even bother installing the Pokey in my new Concerto I just received with upgraded memory chips. Not gonna risk stressing the pins by repeated insertions and removals until I get something that works reliably. Or I may stick it in a homebrew sometime.

 

With those readings the amperage which is the more important reading is probably not dropping down as you have only .01volt fluctuation.

I have found my 7800 that hates robot tank likes the concerto much better.

Do you have a 2600 ao you can play it at least? It is a pretty cool game..

Yes, but my 2600 isn't hooked up right now. I can also play the 2600 game on my Harmony if I want. FYI, I only paid $1.95 for it I think, because someone said to test it.

 

What is the expected behavior of Robot Tank when a 7800 console doesn't like it?

[Jinks]

There is a compatability page I seen once about robot tank and the 7800 and what the outcome will be ans it varies from working to scrambled to a black screen depending on the model. I thought that was kind of the link that determines the differences in 7800 compatability.

I suggested the robot tank cart to try.

I hope you are ok with owning that robot tank cart now...one more to the collection dude!

I can play dk jr to level 2 then it cycles thru all the levels really fast.

Your compatibility seems somewhat similar to mine.

[Andromeda Stardust]

Most of the time my 7800 sits in my mom's bedroom because mine has too much clutter in it.

There is a compatability page I seen once about robot tank and the 7800 and what the outcome will be ans it varies from working to scrambled to a black screen depending on the model. I thought that was kind of the link that determines the differences in 7800 compatability.
I suggested the robot tank cart to try.
I hope you are ok with owning that robot tank cart now...one more to the collection dude!
I can play dk jr to level 2 then it cycles thru all the levels really fast.
Your compatibility seems somewhat similar to mine.

Robot Tank works flawless on my 2600. I didn't have a controller plugged in but I toggled Reset to start the game and just watched my player die. The static effects when your tank is destroyed are impressive.

OT, but does Reindeer Rescue work on your 7800? It doesn't on mine. First homebrew I know of that doesn't like my 7800 unit...

[video uploading]

[Jinks]

I do not own that one..Interesting.

I hope they can figure all this nonsense and mumbo jumbo we gave them for feedback out!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Wonder if the voltage should be measured off the cart port pins in some way? There has to be a +5 volt to the cartridge to power the standard carts, plus obviously the concerto would need power. I was testing at the controller port only because I was making sure voltage wasn't an issue with my AVox+ resetting while playing Dungeon Stalker. Need to measure from pins 13 and 14. 13 is +5 and 14 is ground. This way you can see the voltage readers while the concerto is being accessed. Likely have to solder external wires off those pins to attach meter gator clips to them though.

Edited November 29, 2016 by -^Cro§Bow^-

[Andromeda Stardust]

Wonder if the voltage should be measured off the cart port pins in some way? There has to be a +5 volt to the cartridge to power the standard carts, plus obviously the concerto would need power. I was testing at the controller port only because I was making sure voltage wasn't an issue with my AVox+ resetting while playing Dungeon Stalker. Need to measure from pins 13 and 14. 13 is +5 and 14 is ground. This way you can see the voltage readers while the concerto is being accessed. Likely have to solder external wires off those pins to attach meter gator clips to them though.

Isn't VCC a common bus? I imagine Pin 7 of the controller ports and the output of the 7805 regulator and pin 13 of the cart bus are all connected in some way, unless the traces are razor thin it shouldn't cause an impedance issue. Or did Atari add RF suppressant chokes and other junk to the cart bus?

[Everett1954]

It is disappointing that the low power Concerto is acting the same Kosmic. I would agree that measuring the 5 volts at the controller port is the same as measuring it elsewhere. There is only one 5 volt regulator in 7800 and if Concerto was loading it down you would see it at the controller port.

 

Looks like Concerto needs more work and testing.........

 

Maybe memory or timing problem?

[ApolloBoy]

Have you tried removing capacitor C64 on the motherboard? That's what usually causes a lot of the compatibility problems on later 7800s, I clipped it on mine and now I can play almost anything.

[iesposta]

Have you tried removing capacitor C64 on the motherboard? That's what usually causes a lot of the compatibility problems on later 7800s, I clipped it on mine and now I can play almost anything.

 

I did this on both my 7800's. (Still haven't been able to buy a Concerto yet.)

 

The thing is, some report Concerto working better with that timing circuit, and others report Concerto working better without that timing circuit.

 

While both play all the released 7800 games, the last run model with the X in the Serial Number fails with a scrambled display in Beef Drop, and not starting at all with Moon Cresta. That was enough for me to get an earlier model (although the newer one looked brand new.. I put that top shell on the older system. ).

[78001987]

 

I did this on both my 7800's. (Still haven't been able to buy a Concerto yet.)

 

The thing is, some report Concerto working better with that timing circuit, and others report Concerto working better without that timing circuit.

 

While both play all the released 7800 games, the last run model with the X in the Serial Number fails with a scrambled display in Beef Drop, and not starting at all with Moon Cresta. That was enough for me to get an earlier model (although the newer one looked brand new.. I put that top shell on the older system. ).

i have two 7800s with the timing circuit. One with it intact, and one with the capacitor removed. Concerto compatibility is the same on both.

 

Beef Drop and Moon Cresta work fine on Both. Beef Drop only has an issue if I have Pokey installed. Without it, it runs fine, and with POKEY installed, it runs fine after I load it twice.

 

Both of these Consoles have an issue with Alien Brigade and Basketbrawl not loading from Concerto. But those are the only commercial 7800 games not to run. Both of those games run fine from concerto on my older, non-timing circuit present 7800. But that one has bigger issues with power/pokey installed.

Edited November 29, 2016 by 78001987

[Everett1954]

With all the Concerto problems regarding not working on certain consoles, I think we should all be testing it with the same standards.

 

1) A known good and working romset.

 

2) An SD card of the correct kind (SD), manufacturer(?) size and speed (class 10?)

 

3) Same Concerto Bios.

 

Fred, is there any info you are looking for (which games fails and how, what we have installed (ex. LHE board, OEM or 3rd party supply?) that we can provide to help you? What roms are you testing with (any homebrews?) and what SD card do you use?

[tep392]

I'll bet Fred could learn a lot more about what is going wrong with this cart if he had some of these failing consoles/carts in his hands so he could trouble shoot with appropriate equipment.

[Everett1954]

Agreed, I offered to send in my Console for testing and it still stands.

 

Not sure if others are willing to part with their 7800's at least for awhile.

 

I have other systems (only 1 7800) to play while my 7800 is away.

[78001987]

I would be fine with sending in one of mine. I have a Stock, no video modded, timing circuit present console I could send if he needs.

 

Fred - PM me if this would be helpful. I will also provide a list of Rom compatibility I have seen with my concerto.

[78001987]

speaking of swapping equipment for testing, does anyone have a spare known working POKEy chip they would be willing to send me to rule out mine being bad? I'm not opposed to buying a new one, but I'd hate to waste $25 on something for the same result.

[+-^CrossBow^-]

speaking of swapping equipment for testing, does anyone have a spare known working POKEy chip they would be willing to send me to rule out mine being bad? I'm not opposed to buying a new one, but I'd hate to waste $25 on something for the same result.

 

I happen to have one. It is still attached to the Ballblazer cart that was used for my Mateos cart though. So it would be PCB only with the ballblazer rom and pokey still soldered on. I had purchased this ballblazer cheap for like $2 just for the Pokey inside it, but ended up not having to use it since the pokey on my parts donor 5200 4 port PCB was still on it and working and much easier to remove with it being socketed.

 

PM to discuss further?

[78001987]

 

I happen to have one. It is still attached to the Ballblazer cart that was used for my Mateos cart though. So it would be PCB only with the ballblazer rom and pokey still soldered on. I had purchased this ballblazer cheap for like $2 just for the Pokey inside it, but ended up not having to use it since the pokey on my parts donor 5200 4 port PCB was still on it and working and much easier to remove with it being socketed.

 

PM to discuss further?

Ah - but see there's my same problem. I believe my POKEY might be damaged, because I used a heat gun to de-solder it from it's Ballblazer board. I don't have a de-soldering iron to do the job properly - so I was hoping someone had a spare loose one where there wouldn't be risk of damage from trying to remove it from a BB board.

 

Thanks for the offer though, I do appreciate it!

[+-^CrossBow^-]

Ah - but see there's my same problem. I believe my POKEY might be damaged, because I used a heat gun to de-solder it from it's Ballblazer board. I don't have a de-soldering iron to do the job properly - so I was hoping someone had a spare loose one where there wouldn't be risk of damage from trying to remove it from a BB board.

 

Thanks for the offer though, I do appreciate it!

 

You are assuming I don't have a de-soldering iron? I'd be happy to remove the pokey from it and even test it in my Mateos cart before sending it your way?

[78001987]

 

You are assuming I don't have a de-soldering iron? I'd be happy to remove the pokey from it and even test it in my Mateos cart before sending it your way?

Well, that would be just plain awesome.

 

Cool!